What to look for in a violin? Options

[Claudia's Mum]

What factors should one be looking for when buying a violin and in what order? I am thinking that playability, good tone, evenness of tone, resonance and projection are all important but what else should we be looking for?

Obviously condition and price are an important factor but how important are the history, age, country of origin, instrument and the maker or the wood used?

What other things should one look out for?

[BadStrad]

If it's an older violin then look for cracks/repairs - a crack under the sound post will open over time unless it has been repaired VERY well and that requires a violin worth spending the money on. Any repair under the sound post will generally affect a violin's price (ie reduce it).

An older violin will probably have a more open sound as the wood will have hardened more, so gives better resonance. But if the instrument hasn't been played for a long time it will need opening up again.

[DiscoPants]

An older violin will probably have a more open sound as the wood will have hardened more, so gives better resonance.

Sorry, but this simply isn't true.

[violinlove]

What other things should one look out for?

I may be a bit of a romantic - see my username - but I would say a violin that fills your daughter's heart with joy. A violin that she loves and that she loves to play. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wub.gif)

Plus of course the other sensible factors that you mention in your post and the issue of cracks.

As far as country of origin goes, some people can be very snobbish about German violins but I have a gorgeous German violin with an amazing sound and he wasn't horrendously expensive. So I would say country of origin is less important.

[BadStrad]

An older violin will probably have a more open sound as the wood will have hardened more, so gives better resonance.

Sorry, but this simply isn't true.

Oops. Could have sworn I read that in one of my violin books. Must have got it wrong.

[mcm]

You may well have read it but that doesn't mean that it is true (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) .

[owainsutton]

What other things should one look out for?

I may be a bit of a romantic - see my username - but I would say a violin that fills your daughter's heart with joy. A violin that she loves and that she loves to play. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wub.gif)

Plus of course the other sensible factors that you mention in your post and the issue of cracks.

As far as country of origin goes, some people can be very snobbish about German violins but I have a gorgeous German violin with an amazing sound and he wasn't horrendously expensive. So I would say country of origin is less important.

Excellent advice!

Mine's a German workshop violin, thoroughly unfashionable, but lovely to play. I've not encountered any violin under five figures which I'd swap it for!

Antique violins are priced as antiques, not as music instruments. Pure market economics: the value depends on scarcity and on demand, and there's more demand for Italian instruments, followed by French ones. Exquisite workmanship bumps up the price, even if it's on something like the scroll, which has no impact on the sound at all.

At the other end of the spectrum, one former pupil of mine tried numerous antique instrument and ended up buying a modern Chinese instrument - not a factory product, but completely handmade. Someone unnamed, somewhere in China, had learnt how to do it properly and had acquired the right tools and materials, and a shop I know well had bought it through Hong Kong contacts. For little more than a top-of-the-range Stentor, she got a beautiful instrument (in looks and in sound) on which she sailed through Grade 8 and is now preparing diploma repertoire...

[lottie]

I play viola and I should imagine it's pretty much the same principle.

To suit my circumstances as an amateur my number one priority was sound. Even though I had quite a bit of money to spend this was an instrument that I needed to be in love with and that I could grow and develop with over coming years. Financially I anticipate I'll get my money back on sale whenever I do sell it but that doesn't really matter to me. For financial investment I put my money in other things. But I don't see me changing instrument again unless something remarkable happens. I guess I'll be playing it for the next 25 years at least (until arthritis or dementia kicks in!) so it's already been a worthwhile investment from the pleasure it's given me.

Condition was a concern though - I wouldn't have touched an instrument with damage. I also had a specific size in mind but that's a viola thing and most violins are pretty much the same size. Looks did feature too because I was offered one to try that had bright yellow varnish and I couldn't have lived with that!

I tried a German viola which had a magnificent sound - I've heard people look down on them but the reports of great sounds from these instruments. I settled though on a Chinese/American hand made instrument from a company with a great reputation and I think I found a 'good one' - the sound is absolutely phenomenal. It's a modern instrument (2005) but I've had several professional players comment on the quality and breadth of it's sound and as my playing develops it's not letting me down in any way.

Things might be different if I was a young person aiming at a professional career. I'd probably have more money to spend and be looking for something to hold its value so I could trade it in as I moved up through the profession. However, heart must feature because if you don't have that 'love' I think you're losing an edge on your playing.

There are so many options and so many circumstances. Professional advice is useful but your relationship with your instrument is an intense one so you have to have something that touches your heart.

[BadStrad]

You may well have read it but that doesn't mean that it is true (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) .

True if it's on the internet - but generally I would expect a book - edited and published by a reputable publisher to be pretty accurate. Actually that's not true - eg. Gillian (not doctor) McKeith had books published and they were complete twaddle.

[Blackbird77]

The best advice I was ever given when looking for a violin was to keep looking and trying them until you found the one that speaks to you.

Go with an open mind and when I was last looking, I deliberately didn't look at any of the maker's labels as I knew it would've biased my decision and I wanted to decide more on the sound and feeling that the violin gave.

Also, if the violin has been there a while and hasn't been played, you might not get a true impression on the day of what it can actually do. Mine has had a lot of restoration work done (apparently it has some lovely staples) and it's taken a while for it to find its voice.

I've also learnt to always get a second, independent opinion - a fresh viewpoint can be invaluable.

Good luck with your violin search.

[Claudia's Mum]

The problem (well, it might not be a problem) is having fallen in love with the first one we tried!

We're now trying to compare it to others just to make sure it is the one!

[DiscoPants]

The problem (well, it might not be a problem) is having fallen in love with the first one we tried!

We're now trying to compare it to others just to make sure it is the one!

As other people have already said, a second (or even a third) opinion is a must, and from people who really know what they're talking about, such as a teacher who has a lot of experience with good instruments (not all teachers fall into this category). Inexperienced players often go for instruments with a lot of "character". They sound impressive at first, but quickly become difficult to live with as they impose too much of their own character on the music. Same goes for fiddles that are overtly very loud and resonant. Some truly great instruments sound distinctly underwhelming under the ear.

If you're buying a violin for a young player, don't spend too much money too soon, and make sure that there's nothing "odd" about the violin (such as unconventional measurements) that would make it hard to sell on. It's quite likely that this won't be your daughter's final violin.

[viola-mad]

Aside from what others have said about sound, feel and condition, I would stress that those are the conditions you should judge it on, and not let yourself be swayed by any label (literal or metaphorical) placed on it by someone else! If you haven't seen it already, have a read of this article about a Double-blind violin test, where professional violinists were asked to play a bunch of violins, and and then pick out the Strad and Guarneri from the group. (There's also a little test on the site so you can have a go! I didn't have a clue, I really couldn't decide which was which, but see if you can do better....)

And lastly, take your time. I don't think it's a decision that should be reached quickly if you're going to part with a significant amount of money.

[BadStrad]

Actually the test was to pick a preferred instrument from old (but not set up) instruments and modern (probably well set up) instruments, not to pick out the Strad or Guin.

http://www.violinist.com/blog/laurie/20121/13039/ has a little more reading from one of the violinists involved. Maybe trying to save face after the headlines, but if what she describes is what happened then it wasn't a "pick the strad" test.

Off topic I know - but thought it was of interest.

[Claudia's Mum]

If you're buying a violin for a young player, don't spend too much money too soon, and make sure that there's nothing "odd" about the violin (such as unconventional measurements) that would make it hard to sell on. It's quite likely that this won't be your daughter's final violin.

No, it's totally conventional, in very good condition (checked out by a reputable luthier) and recommended by two professional violinists who have tried it out so far. I am going to ask a third.

It is the last violin that I am paying for (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) I didn't spend enough last time because progress was quicker than everyone expected so don't want to have the same problem again.