Where Are All The Oboists These Days? Options

[A.U.K]

Well done Louise, glad it went well and that the reeds are behaving.

I too had a lesson today, first one in a long time and we revisited some interesting old friends such as Madeline Dring and Micheal Head. Nice to play through some old standard repetoire and have some fun..I was partly reading them whilst playing them as it's been so long since I played them but a lot of it fell under the fingers through force of habit and memory muscle.

Spent rather a lot of time working on scale runs in C#minor and B major neither ones particular favourite keys but good for the soul (I kept telling myself that)..Oh and joy of Joys my old reeds which I had reworked played like a dream from a decent forte down to a really soft PPP which was a great relief.

I am thinking of and sort of planning a small recital locally, a lunchtime program of English music I think, nothing terribly fancy or demanding but something that an audience can sit back and relax with rather than be educated by if that makes any sense. I always get slightly irritated with programs that force education down an audiences throat..Most people just want to hear lovely music beautifully played and aren't worried about the technical wizzardry that we can get tangled up in. The aim is by the summer so I had better get my Pianist shaking and busy and get my reed knives out. if it goes ahead and anyone wants to come I will be playing in Marlborough Wiltshire I think, subject to venue and availability..and Yes Kate I expect you to come in from Costa Rica.. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

So a good day, a long overdue good day, fingers went well, tongue behaved and Oboe and reeds sounded gorgeous so I am a happy bunny.

Happy Blowing.

[katica]

Well done Louise, glad it went well and that the reeds are behaving.

I too had a lesson today, first one in a long time and we revisited some interesting old friends such as Madeline Dring and Micheal Head. Nice to play through some old standard repetoire and have some fun..I was partly reading them whilst playing them as it's been so long since I played them but a lot of it fell under the fingers through force of habit and memory muscle.

Spent rather a lot of time working on scale runs in C#minor and B major neither ones particular favourite keys but good for the soul (I kept telling myself that)..Oh and joy of Joys my old reeds which I had reworked played like a dream from a decent forte down to a really soft PPP which was a great relief.

I am thinking of and sort of planning a small recital locally, a lunchtime program of English music I think, nothing terribly fancy or demanding but something that an audience can sit back and relax with rather than be educated by if that makes any sense. I always get slightly irritated with programs that force education down an audiences throat..Most people just want to hear lovely music beautifully played and aren't worried about the technical wizzardry that we can get tangled up in. The aim is by the summer so I had better get my Pianist shaking and busy and get my reed knives out. if it goes ahead and anyone wants to come I will be playing in Marlborough Wiltshire I think, subject to venue and availability..and Yes Kate I expect you to come in from Costa Rica.. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

So a good day, a long overdue good day, fingers went well, tongue behaved and Oboe and reeds sounded gorgeous so I am a happy bunny.

Happy Blowing.

Sounds as though you're doing really well... I'm very impressed (and envious!)! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

I am happy to drop by especially for your concert. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

(That is, if it's between Aug 5 and 17.)

[louise1712]

Lesson tomorrow (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Not as much progress made as I would have liked but progress is def. being made (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Got some pieces from band tonight to look at, some do look rather playable actually, not Send in the Clowns though, oboe solo includes Eb, can't quite get that yet (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

[A.U.K]

Lesson tomorrow (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Not as much progress made as I would have liked but progress is def. being made (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Got some pieces from band tonight to look at, some do look rather playable actually, not Send in the Clowns though, oboe solo includes Eb, can't quite get that yet (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Good luck tomorrow Louise, I hope your lesson goes well.

"Send in the clowns" sounds nice maybe take it with you to your lesson, Eb isn't that terrifying as a note I promise. What key is the arrangement in.?

[louise1712]

Lesson tomorrow (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Not as much progress made as I would have liked but progress is def. being made (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Got some pieces from band tonight to look at, some do look rather playable actually, not Send in the Clowns though, oboe solo includes Eb, can't quite get that yet (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Good luck tomorrow Louise, I hope your lesson goes well.

"Send in the clowns" sounds nice maybe take it with you to your lesson, Eb isn't that terrifying as a note I promise. What key is the arrangement in.?

Thanks (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) the piece starts in Ab maj, changes to Bb maj (where the solo is) and finishes in C maj.

The Eb isn't scary, just my fingers can't quite stretch to cover the holes fully yet (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

[A.U.K]

Lesson tomorrow (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Not as much progress made as I would have liked but progress is def. being made (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Got some pieces from band tonight to look at, some do look rather playable actually, not Send in the Clowns though, oboe solo includes Eb, can't quite get that yet (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Good luck tomorrow Louise, I hope your lesson goes well.

"Send in the clowns" sounds nice maybe take it with you to your lesson, Eb isn't that terrifying as a note I promise. What key is the arrangement in.?

Thanks (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) the piece starts in Ab maj, changes to Bb maj (where the solo is) and finishes in C maj.

The Eb isn't scary, just my fingers can't quite stretch to cover the holes fully yet (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Ah Ab major not the easiest key to start with, maybe best to leave it for a little while. I am guessing that its a band part that's been arranged, they usually come in hedious keys though usually with lots of sharps. There is a nice book, I think it's called my first concert or recital or something I will research it but there are some nice melodies in it and its not childish if that makes any sense. Leave it with me I'll have a dig around and see if I can find it.

[Barry Toner]

Ah Ab major not the easiest key to start with, maybe best to leave it for a little while. I am guessing that its a band part that's been arranged, they usually come in hedious keys though usually with lots of sharps.

Sharps! What are sharps in a windband setting? The clarinets and brass are all transposing instruments in flats and things with sharps frighten them, so the flutes and oboe have to play in lots of flats. (Perhaps we are just better players! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) )

Louise, if you are playing in a windband, get used to flat keys and practice scales in the flat keys until you can do it blindfold and without thinking. The director of my windband wants to perform the Vaughan Williams English Folk Song Suite the next time we perform indoors (next two gigs are open air). This has a couple of lovely oboe solos, but is mostly in four flats. Learn to love your left hand Eb key and make it second nature to use it. (I am still working on this, by the way, this is a doctine of perfection! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif) ) The windband, though, is a fantastic environment in which to play, with a good variety of music available. The one I play with has 12 flutes (when they all turn up), 10 clarinets, around 10 saxophones of different sizes - and just one oboe. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) Makes me feel wanted and needed!

[louise1712]

Ah Ab major not the easiest key to start with, maybe best to leave it for a little while. I am guessing that its a band part that's been arranged, they usually come in hedious keys though usually with lots of sharps. There is a nice book, I think it's called my first concert or recital or something I will research it but there are some nice melodies in it and its not childish if that makes any sense. Leave it with me I'll have a dig around and see if I can find it.

it is a band part yes, sorry, should have made that more clear (IMG:style_emoticons/default/blush.gif) I wouldn't normally start by looking at pieces/parts in so many flats to start with, I think the conductor is just very excited at the prospect of having an oboe in the training band (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Sharps! What are sharps in a windband setting? The clarinets and brass are all transposing instruments in flats and things with sharps frighten them, so the flutes and oboe have to play in lots of flats. (Perhaps we are just better players! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) )

Louise, if you are playing in a windband, get used to flat keys and practice scales in the flat keys until you can do it blindfold and without thinking. The director of my windband wants to perform the Vaughan Williams English Folk Song Suite the next time we perform indoors (next two gigs are open air). This has a couple of lovely oboe solos, but is mostly in four flats. Learn to love your left hand Eb key and make it second nature to use it. (I am still working on this, by the way, this is a doctine of perfection! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif) ) The windband, though, is a fantastic environment in which to play, with a good variety of music available. The one I play with has 12 flutes (when they all turn up), 10 clarinets, around 10 saxophones of different sizes - and just one oboe. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) Makes me feel wanted and needed!

Left hand Eb, thanks Barry Toner (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Most of the band stuff I have is in either three or four flats, which, once I get the fingers stretched to cover the holes properly....... The band I'll be playing in is only small, 4 clarinets, 1 flute, 1 alto sax, 4 tenor saxes, a baritone sax, a bassoon, 2 trumpets and a tuba (when everyone is there) so the environment is a really friendly, supportive one (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[A.U.K]

I guessed it was a band part as in Brass Band and not windband, in my limited experience of playing band parts I recall they usually come in some real charming keys.

I will only dare to suggest that you work your way up through the keys adding a flat each time, and learning it's relative minor, both the harmonic and melodic rather than work your way up chromatically. As Barry has mentioned the left hand Eb, I would have to agree that it takes a little getting used to. I use mine constantly, much prefering it over the right hand one, its actually a quicker fingering in my opinion.

I think you have a lesson today so I hope it goes well. Keep us posted.

[flobiano]

Enjoying reading what everyone is up to. Sounds like good progress is being made by all! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Andrew, which Head and Dring pieces are you playing? I've played Elegaic Dance and Italian Dance, I also have 3 Piece Suite in the pile of things to look at in the future!

Things are going well here, though work has been rather busy so I've been cutting down internet time in order to fit everything else in. I had a enjoyable lesson this week - probably due to having a lovely new reed which has just blown in. Apparently my tone is improving but I need to not put a lid on my playing and go for it a bit more - it's too controlled. I'm still ploughing through the Luft studies, up to no 13 now. The last couple have been a bit slower and shorter - but in 6 flats! Back to easier keys but more notes now. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

I love the Telemann Fantasias! I'm now working on number 2. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wub.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wub.gif) I'm focussing on bringing the phrasing out more. I'm also working on the Mozart Quartet, movement 1. I need to work on my intonation I think, it seems to be going a bit wayward in that for some reason.

I'm looking forward to a full day of oboe tomorrow - afternoon rehearsal followed by orchestra concert. We are playing lots of Russian music so I'm hoping that I manage to make it to the end of Night on Bare Mountain with my lip intact. Certainly will be building up my stamina!

Hope everyone has a good weekend (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[louise1712]

I guessed it was a band part as in Brass Band and not windband, in my limited experience of playing band parts I recall they usually come in some real charming keys.

I will only dare to suggest that you work your way up through the keys adding a flat each time, and learning it's relative minor, both the harmonic and melodic rather than work your way up chromatically. As Barry has mentioned the left hand Eb, I would have to agree that it takes a little getting used to. I use mine constantly, much prefering it over the right hand one, its actually a quicker fingering in my opinion.

I think you have a lesson today so I hope it goes well. Keep us posted.

that's one way of describing them!

Yes I have a lesson tonight and will let you know how it goes, might take a couple of the easier ones... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[A.U.K]

@ Flobiano, I am re doing the Elegiac Dance (Head) and the Italian dance (Dring) both lovely. I particularly like the Dring..Funny part is I don't know much about Madeline Dring so as I am having a quiet afternoon I will have a Google and see what I can find out about her.

God the Luft studies, I used to have a copy of them years ago I must dig it out..

@Louise, yes take some simpler pieces, it's best to get to grips with the Oboe itself as it's such early days. There is a lot to contend with at this stage so you don't want to make life any harder than it is by over stretching yourself with music in unkind keys and left hand Eb's can wait awhile. As you already play other instruments to a certain standard this will be an advantage once you get to grips with the foibles that the Oboe is famous for. It's mainly the reed and the breathing and a fairly complicated keywork system which in comparison to flutes, Clarinets and Saxophones is in a league all its own. So my advice would be to take it steady and in small chunks, build the embouchure slowly, listen to the sound carefully on each note in the scale and try to make them as near perfect and sounding as similar in tone as you can.

I don't know anything about Clarinet intonation or clarinets in general so I can't offer a comparison in tonal shaping. The Oboe can be tonally shaped with the embouchure and a balance through the scale is the ideal. This takes time and hence my suggestion you stick to simpler music whilst you deal with the early stages of playing the Oboe. I don't mean to sound patronising in any way so please take what I suggest in the spirit in which its given. Too many people try to run before they can walk when it comes to the Oboe. There is a reason the Oboe is on the endagered species list and it's these early days that sort out those who will persevere with it and those who won't. A good friend of mine a professional player always says that the difficulties with the Oboe come from the outset whereas the other woodwinds are fairly straightforward from the begining. Then come about grade 6 the difficulties come kicking in for Flutes, Clarinets etc, the music becomes much harder and many fall off from playing. The Oboe deals with a lot of it's difficulties from the outset so the progression is much more continuos. Yes there are hurdles, big hurdles, but get the basics under your belt and you can pretty much plod away and work your way up.

Let us know how the lesson goes later on won't you.

[Arundodonuts]

The issue that Louise is having is slightly different to yours and your firmer reed issue. Louise is experiencing pitch problems i.e being sharp. This may well be because she is gripping the reed too tightly. You on the other hand seem to have a reed that is Too Open and which is proving very hard

But it is only since I've gone back to my soft reed that I've found I'm playing sharp so I do think that playing on the harder reed may have caused me to tense and grip the reed too tightly (in an effort to control the sound). Hopefully I can unlearn that!

Thanks for the advice though; and I will definitely stay away from the harder reed until I've seen my tutor again.

Ah ok yes that make sense now, yes the softer reed has been playing sharp would suggest that you maybe gripping it a bit.

I think there is a general perception that we need to use harder reeds in order to produce a good tone. That is true to a certain extent, but if you can't blow the thing, you won't get a good tone anyway. I'm reminded of something I was told when I started skiing - you can buy flashy ski boots but if they aren't comfortable you won't want to wear them , so you'll avoid going skiing. I know soft reeds can sound a bit pathetic but with practice they can be made to sound very nice indeed - if not as full bodied as a harder reed. It's "just" a case of getting everything right - embouchure, shape of oral cavity, support, speed of air.

I went to a presentation at IDRS 2009 by Guy Porat (Andrew was there too) who was advocating everyone playing on softer reeds that most advanced or professional players would normally deem suitable. He commented that initially you wont like the tone, but by persevering a good tone can be created and the softer reed allows much more flexibility. Indeed some professional use very light reeds (Gordon Hunt for instance) and create a very beautiful tone. OK I admit that my preference is for a big "Germanic" dark tone and that will need a harder reed than I currently play, but it can't be hurried. You have to build up strength in the facial muscles and in the abdomen appropriate to the reed you want to use. That takes time.

I have tried harder reeds than I currently play but ran into the usual difficulty of biting due to fatigue and my pitch going skyward. I've been using Fortay reeds for quite some time and got Steve Forbes to make me some of their blue thread reeds at the "soft end of medium". That helped a lot and I'm now trying out the purple reeds which are similar but with a slightly longer scrape. I find them easier blowing and more responsive without sacrificing tone and my pitch stability has improved dramatically.

There is something else to note about oboe reeds. They change with climatic conditions - day to day. This week my reeds have felt hard and have been open, needing a good squeeze to get them crowing nicely. So you might find a reed that played easily yesterday feels really hard today.

As Barry has mentioned the left hand Eb, I would have to agree that it takes a little getting used to. I use mine constantly, much prefering it over the right hand one, its actually a quicker fingering in my opinion.

I'm inclined to agree with that and I have been tending to favour LH Eb even when there isn't an adjacent RH Db. I think it's easier to co-ordinate the LH 4th and RH 3rd fingers than the RH 3rd and 4th fingers (it's something to do with the physiology of adjacent fingers).

However, rapped knuckles from teacher who tells me I need to develop equal facility with LH and RH Eb (i.e. practice both regularly).

I will only dare to suggest that you work your way up through the keys adding a flat each time, and learning it's relative minor, both the harmonic and melodic rather than work your way up chromatically.

Interesting that. I had a period where I worked up and down chromatically, but came back to relative keys as being the best way to make the accidentals stick.

I am re doing the Elegiac Dance (Head) and the Italian dance (Dring) both lovely. I particularly like the Dring..

I was having a look at that a while ago. It's on the Grade 7 syllabus, but whether I will use it or not depends on how quickly I can get my fingers going.

[katica]

Welcome back, flobiano. Nice to have some oboe news from you. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Great advice to Louise, A.U.K. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) that time invested in learning to "walk" well is very well spent. I have to say, though, that I found the early stages on the oboe much easier than expected and then I ran into the worst difficulties about year 3 of playing (i.e. last year). But then there were all sorts of other interferences, so I think my process was very personal to me. In general, I think you're right that the oboe is tougher early on and easier later. At least, there's plenty of repertoire that is easily approachable once you've got the basics mastered.

I think there is a general perception that we need to use harder reeds in order to produce a good tone. That is true to a certain extent, but if you can't blow the thing, you won't get a good tone anyway. I'm reminded of something I was told when I started skiing - you can buy flashy ski boots but if they aren't comfortable you won't want to wear them , so you'll avoid going skiing. I know soft reeds can sound a bit pathetic but with practice they can be made to sound very nice indeed - if not as full bodied as a harder reed. It's "just" a case of getting everything right - embouchure, shape of oral cavity, support, speed of air.

I went to a presentation at IDRS 2009 by Guy Porat (Andrew was there too) who was advocating everyone playing on softer reeds that most advanced or professional players would normally deem suitable. He commented that initially you wont like the tone, but by persevering a good tone can be created and the softer reed allows much more flexibility. Indeed some professional use very light reeds (Gordon Hunt for instance) and create a very beautiful tone. OK I admit that my preference is for a big "Germanic" dark tone and that will need a harder reed than I currently play, but it can't be hurried. You have to build up strength in the facial muscles and in the abdomen appropriate to the reed you want to use. That takes time.

I have tried harder reeds than I currently play but ran into the usual difficulty of biting due to fatigue and my pitch going skyward. I've been using Fortay reeds for quite some time and got Steve Forbes to make me some of their blue thread reeds at the "soft end of medium". That helped a lot and I'm now trying out the purple reeds which are similar but with a slightly longer scrape. I find them easier blowing and more responsive without sacrificing tone and my pitch stability has improved dramatically.

There is something else to note about oboe reeds. They change with climatic conditions - day to day. This week my reeds have felt hard and have been open, needing a good squeeze to get them crowing nicely. So you might find a reed that played easily yesterday feels really hard today.

This is a really good summary! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) I've been moaning a bit about really soft reeds recently but that's because they really are very old and very soft (though they do, indeed, have a perversely hard day from time to time (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) ) and have run out of oomph. But still useable enough for me to feel that I shouldn't ditch them entirely. I think the question of the right balance between soft/hard is quite personal. I, too, like the sound of Germanic reeds but my best playing option right now is also "the soft end of medium". I am capable of making any reed go sharp - on harder ones when I get tired and on softer ones in a misplaced effort to control them.

My teacher's reeds actually look quite similar to Gordon Hunt's but with a slightly longer scrape (though not as long as current US style). I don't think they sound quite as light. But live I've only heard GH playing Mozart, for which a light sound is rather suitable.

He made another reed early this week from that Jordanov cane I mentioned. It sounded great when made. But I got it out yesterday and almost fainted as I thought it had cracked. In fact, one edge had sort of curled under. Very weird! After a good long soak I could straighten it out and play it but doesn't bode well for a long-lasting reed.

For the kind of of scrape we do here you have to use the same cane that I think in the UK is used for hard reeds, even when making softish ones, because the scrape involves taking quite a lot of wood off.

(Oh gosh, just realised I've gone all reed-nerdy again... hope this isn't putting you off, Louise (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) )

Teacher has been experimenting with slight variations to the embouchure and decided to launch his theory, so far only tested in private, at my lesson this week. I tried the change and it did sound quite good (better projection, which I badly need) but I'm not completely convinced yet...

Arundodonuts, I saw on another thread that you're working at the Albinoni 7/6. How's that going? I started work on it for a recital last Oct but had accompaniment problems so had to change the programme. I found it fun to play but the sort of thing that could also quite easily get stale. I'd be interested to hear what ornaments you plump for.

Just in case folks missed the last time I asked (won't ask again in case I'm boring you) but any ideas for nimble fingering for top end of F# scale would be much appreciated.

[Arundodonuts]

Arundodonuts, I saw on another thread that you're working at the Albinoni 7/6. How's that going? I started work on it for a recital last Oct but had accompaniment problems so had to change the programme. I found it fun to play but the sort of thing that could also quite easily get stale. I'd be interested to hear what ornaments you plump for.

I shall be presenting my findings to teacher first (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Just in case folks missed the last time I asked (won't ask again in case I'm boring you) but any ideas for nimble fingering for top end of F# scale would be much appreciated.

F#. Where's that then? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wacko.gif)

Oh whilst on oboes. I got a tweet from Dartington to say that Aisling Casey is tutoring. I had a look at the diary and it appears the sainted Mr. Daniel is not appearing. Those who have him as a Facebook friend may wish to confirm!