Music Degree - Out of Reach? Options

[TLydia]

I'm currently in year 11 doing all my GCSEs and things, and have started looking towards what I'm going to do next. Recently someone put the idea into my head that I could do a degree in music after college, but I'm starting to doubt that I'll ever get a place. In school my grades are really pretty good, and music is the one thing that I love most and if I had choose to spend the rest of my life doing one thing, that would definitely be music.
I'm doing my grade 5 violin in the next couple of weeks and grade 3 in piano and theory (both of which I started about a year ago). A side from grades I also play the fiddle - and I'd say that's the area I perform best in. But is it realistic for me to be even considering a music degree?

[liseypeasy]

Hello, and welcome.

Well, you have a couple of years to work towards getting on to a course - it all depends really what sort of course you want to do - there are academic music degrees which will ask for a wide range of requirements depending where you apply to. 'Top' universities will probably want high academic grades as well as grade 8 - Manchester uni prefers it if you have a distinction for example (if you don't have a distinction, someone else will).

To be honest you're in the ideal place to really work towards something - you've come along quickly if you're on grade 5 violin in around a year, though I appreciate you're a fiddler anyway. Make sure your teacher knows where you want to work towards and talk with them about the amount of practise needed (busy years ahead), and what you need to do to get there. Knowing what is required, in advance, is the best place to start. Ensure you maintain all your extra curricular performance / musical involvement as this shows your commitment and genuine enthusiasm as well.

There's nowt wrong in looking at what universities offer now, then you can really tailor your A Level choices when the time comes and have a goal, and a backup goal. A teacher of mine was at grade 5 clarinet when they started 6th form and got into a conservatoire on sheer determination. In short, no it's not too late.

[TLydia]

Thanks for the encouragement - although I should probably point out now that is has taken much more than a year to achieve grade 5 on violin its the piano and theory that I have taken up more laterly (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[owainsutton]

No, not out of reach. Keep working hard at your violin, because getting Grade 8 would give you an edge if applying to places that don't necessarily require it.

Do your research, too. Some music departments are heavily focussed on the European classical tradition, whereas others have a wider view. As you're a fiddler, you might want to look at places which have a stronger emphasis on ethnomusicology, and Queen's Belfast and the University of Ulster both have an emphasis on Irish traditional music, as you might expect. I'd assume that some of the Scottish probably have equivalent elements of Scottish music, too.

[gwyntdi-enw]

Someone please correct me if I use the wrong terminology here, but there are (at least two) options to consider. Studying music as an academic subject is usually quite separate from studying it as a performer, ie at a conservatoire. The first option I think would not necessarily require the same level of performance standard as an entry requirement, and could also possibly be studied as a joint option, alongside another subject.

It is not too soon to be using your careers library to look at the detail of courses on offer and their entry requirements, which could influence your choice of A levels.

Good luck!

[owainsutton]

Someone please correct me if I use the wrong terminology here, but there are (at least two) options to consider. Studying music as an academic subject is usually quite separate from studying it as a performer, ie at a conservatoire. The first option I think would not necessarily require the same level of performance standard as an entry requirement, and could also possibly be studied as a joint option, alongside another subject.

This is correct, and all university courses have performance as only one portion. There's a great diversity within that, though, from those who expect G8 distinction standard on starting the course and where a final recital can determine a quarter of your degree, through to those where performance is a very small element indeed.

[Arundodonuts]

No, not out of reach. Keep working hard at your violin, because getting Grade 8 would give you an edge if applying to places that don't necessarily require it.

Do your research, too. Some music departments are heavily focussed on the European classical tradition, whereas others have a wider view. As you're a fiddler, you might want to look at places which have a stronger emphasis on ethnomusicology, and Queen's Belfast and the University of Ulster both have an emphasis on Irish traditional music, as you might expect. I'd assume that some of the Scottish probably have equivalent elements of Scottish music, too.

There is a folk music degree at Newcastle university too.

[Deborah]

No, not out of reach. Keep working hard at your violin, because getting Grade 8 would give you an edge if applying to places that don't necessarily require it.

Do your research, too. Some music departments are heavily focused on the European classical tradition, whereas others have a wider view. As you're a fiddler, you might want to look at places which have a stronger emphasis on ethnomusicology, and Queen's Belfast and the University of Ulster both have an emphasis on Irish traditional music, as you might expect. I'd assume that some of the Scottish probably have equivalent elements of Scottish music, too.

There is a folk music degree at Newcastle university too.

Many music degree courses have a project element as part of the course, and this project can cover almost anything - or at least, that's how it was in my day, mumble decades ago. Projects covered by my year group included studies of Mozart operas, Kenneth Leighton's output, light music, desk top publishing in music; in short, wherever people's interests were. If this is still the case I see no reason why there shouldn't be something about folk music too.

Anyway, to get back to the original question. TLydia, what do you actually want to do? Is it actually necessary for you to go to university at all to fulfill your career ambitions? Does it have to be a music degree, or do you just have to be of graduate calibre? With Grade V at 16, music at university isn't out of the question, but different institutions have widely differing entry requirements. All of the universities to which I applied held auditions, some requiring performances on both clarinet and piano. Make sure you research properly to avoid wasting your time and theirs!

Good luck with whatever you decide (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[TLydia]

Thanks for all the advice (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)
I had heard quite a lot about the folk degree in Newcastle, I've got a few close friends that are there, and it does sound brilliant- the only downside being that I really don't want to narrow my options after university so much, and with fees hitting ?9000 it may not be the best use of money when looking at careers in folk music.
Also recently doing GCSE music and playing more in youth orchestras I have found that the music I enjoy isn't quite as restricted to folk music as I had thought.
Does anybody know more about any particular universities and their entrance requirements for more academic music degrees? Particularly ones like mentioned above with opportunities to do some project based work on specific areas (that could maybe include the folk traditions (IMG:style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif) )

[owainsutton]

Does anybody know more about any particular universities and their entrance requirements for more academic music degrees? Particularly ones like mentioned above with opportunities to do some project based work on specific areas (that could maybe include the folk traditions (IMG:style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif) )

You'll find the typical entrance requirements, both A Level and instrumental levels, listed on the music department pages of university websites.

[flugelbeth]

Does anybody know more about any particular universities and their entrance requirements for more academic music degrees? Particularly ones like mentioned above with opportunities to do some project based work on specific areas (that could maybe include the folk traditions (IMG:style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif) )

You'll find the typical entrance requirements, both A Level and instrumental levels, listed on the music department pages of university websites.

I've just applied this time:
Manchester offered me AAB and grade 8 1st instrument (preferably distinction), grade 5 piano or equivalent (interview only)
Oxford offered AAA, grade 5 piano or equivalent (multiple interviews, submitted written work and audition)
Nottingham offered BBB (no interview)
Royal Holloway (University of London) offered AAB (no interview)

Hope this helps (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Flossie]

Does anybody know more about any particular universities and their entrance requirements for more academic music degrees? Particularly ones like mentioned above with opportunities to do some project based work on specific areas (that could maybe include the folk traditions (IMG:style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif) )

You'll find the typical entrance requirements, both A Level and instrumental levels, listed on the music department pages of university websites.

These will be the current entrance requirements for 2012 entry (and may change before you apply) but should give you a good starting point.

Another good source of information is the UCAS website. This lists all the music degrees in the UK (including joint honours programmes where you study 2 subjects) and has information about current entrance requirements.

For a top department you are likely to need grade 8 and good A-level grades. Places like Cambridge and Durham are now typically asking for A*AA at A-level and I'd expect the top departments to range from this to around ABB. However, (and this is where it can get confusing!) the 'top' departments aren't necessarily the best ones - particularly once you take individual interests and preferances into account. It's also worth remembering that some of the new universities can be excellent for particular subjects and may have a better course than some of the 'top' universities. For example, I teach a traditional academic subject (but not music) and for my subject Oxford Brookes, UWE, Northumbria, Plymouth and Staffordshire outperform some of the 'top' universities such as Birmingham in terms of the quality of their undergraduate programmes, but have lower entry requirements.

A lot depends on how much progress you make between now and when you need to apply, and it is impossibel for any of us to judge this as we don't know you at all. I suspect that there will be degree courses which would accept you at your current playing standard. However there would potentially be a trade off in terms of the quality of the degree (this does depend on the nature of the programme - for example, a degree programme which places more emphasis on things like music technology and popular music will be looking for different skills and qualities, and will probably place less emphasis on things like classical ABRSM grades, compared to a more traditional academic music course focused mainly on Western classical music and its performance).

[BitterSweet]

Make sure you check what instruments are required too.

For example, University of Edinburgh music department wants Grade 8 first study, and Grade 5 piano, plus A-Level/Higher music. Edinburgh Napier, on the other hand, does not have the piano requirements, only the first study.

You will have to work hard. If you don't make the Grade 8 by the end of school, why not consider taking a gap between school and university if you want to get into a really top place and focusing on your music, while saving some money, or getting other kinds of experience like volunteering with music-based projects? Remember the traditional school, and then direct to uni route isn't the only way to get there.

Good Luck!

[Floss]

Just thought I'd add that I got onto a music degree in a very good music department with "only" grade 5 violin and theory (I was playing at ~grade 8 standard but had no piece of paper to prove it). If you have a goal, aim for it and don't let anyone tell you otherwise. You have some very practical advice in this thread - go for it! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[freda_bloogs]

I was more or less in your position too. By the end of my A Levels I had grade 8 level piano (my first instrument), and actual grade 8s in voice and theory. If you work hard, you can do it well. However, if you coast like I did, you'll only end up doing it!

I didn't end up doing a Music degree but I did apply for French and Music at Leeds and, if I remember correctly, was offered BBB off predictions of AAAAB. Unfortunately, it's your predicted grades in your academics that will play the biggest role. Be nice to your teachers.