Learning Piano Options

[delicato]

Hello, i am new to forum. I have only recently started learning piano and started in feb 2010, but am now on grade 3 (IMG:style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif) . I just wanted to ask if this seems a bit quick?? Also when i play i still am not very good at reading the music or finding the notes and just wanted to ask if this is normal at this grade? and when does this become a lot easier? I do not know how long it normally takes to get on to grade 3. Hope this makes sense!! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wacko.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wacko.gif)

[aesir22]

Not quick or slow. Its subjective. I'm in the same boat. Some people learn faster. My teacher got grade 8 in 2 years, some people get to grade 8 in 30 years. Depends on the person and their circumstances.

On the plus side putting in the extra work means you get to play more interesting pieces but you may be held back waiting for sight reading and technique to catch up. Just make sure you try and keep your practiced balanced and cover plenty of technical stuff and pieces. No point getting to grade 8 if all you have learned is 3 songs per grade!

[delicato]

thanks for answering, i know it may seemed a bit of a strange question. But it is difficult when you do not know what anyone else does. I do not get much time for practice, which is a shame. Grade 8 in 2 years seems very good to me. I think it is just strange because i can never imagine myself playing piano in a "natural" sort of way. But yes, i think, your right about the technique practice.
Later on i hope to do some other stuff besides just the exam book ----- hopefully. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[aesir22]

thanks for answering, i know it may seemed a bit of a strange question. But it is difficult when you do not know what anyone else does. I do not get much time for practice, which is a shame. Grade 8 in 2 years seems very good to me. I think it is just strange because i can never imagine myself playing piano in a "natural" sort of way. But yes, i think, your right about the technique practice.
Later on i hope to do some other stuff besides just the exam book ----- hopefully. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

I know what you mean. This forum is a goldmine of info, and has people from total beginner to people who have passed Fellowships. Read read read and you'll find out all you need to know (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Grade 8 in 2 years is good. But only because he practiced for 6-8 hours every day, and covered buckets of material, not just exam pieces. If he just did exam pieces he probably wouldn't be a very good grade 8!

I used to be obsessed with how many grades in how many years, but now see its not that important to me. I have taken a break from exams and have rekindled my love of piano by playing pieces I adore.

About playing with ease - I know what you mean. I dream of the day I can play some stuff with relative ease, and look totally natural to anyone listening lol. It'll come. You'll notice how you seem to play with some ease the pieces you know well? It'll get better (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) At least I sincerely hope it does!

Always explore stuff outside the exam books. You should really study non-exam pieces at the same time as exam pieces. Broaden your repetoire, play stuff you love! What kind of things do you want to play? Romantic, classical, modern, the kind of things from films we see today etc etc. Look into getting some of the sheet music you could learn and have some fun. Don't get too centred on the exams. They cover a lot of stuff you will need down the line, but certainly not everything. Playing loads of pieces will help your overall technique, theory skills, aural skills and sight reading.

I used to think grades were the only way to monitor your learning. That was until I read that someone here, Mad Tom I think, said 'Keep playing pieces until you come across something that really challenges you, then learn that'. Or something along those lines. Basically play lots of pieces and keep pushing yourself lol

What kind of piano do you have?

[Solari]

About playing with ease - I know what you mean. I dream of the day I can play some stuff with relative ease, and look totally natural to anyone listening lol. It'll come. You'll notice how you seem to play with some ease the pieces you know well? It'll get better (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) At least I sincerely hope it does!

Playing with "ease" and "naturally" to me seems to go hand-in-hand with playing from memory if I'm completely honest.

[Alicia Ocean]

When new pupils come to me who have already studied the piano I use the exam sightreading book to determine what grade we will be working on. It generally follows that if they can do the sightreading required at a certain grade then if the pieces we work on are at that grade they won't spend a disproportionate amount of time picking through the notes. Sight Reading tests are about two grades below the exam grade.

[Juan Carlos]

Ref. Grade 8 in 2 years. I think that is really too fast and true just up to a point. While it may be true that you can get the pieces for a Grade 8 exam if you practise 6-8 hrs a day for a few months, that does not mean that you're at Grade 8 level, in my humble opinion.
By definition, the learning process requires physiological assimilation and that, except in the case of geniuses, takes time, more or less time depending on the person's circumstances, his/her talent and will-power and on thousands of other factors. You can cram scales, arpeggios, pieces, etc into your head in much the same way as you can learn a language by doing a full-immersion course but that cannot be the same quality of learning or breadth of competence that you would obtain by working at things gradually and reasonably slowly.
I may be wrong but I simply do not believe in "cutting corners" in learning. I tend to think you always pay a price for doing things hurriedly.

[aesir22]

Ref. Grade 8 in 2 years. I think that is really too fast and true just up to a point. While it may be true that you can get the pieces for a Grade 8 exam if you practise 6-8 hrs a day for a few months, that does not mean that you're at Grade 8 level, in my humble opinion.
By definition, the learning process requires physiological assimilation and that, except in the case of geniuses, takes time, more or less time depending on the person's circumstances, his/her talent and will-power and on thousands of other factors. You can cram scales, arpeggios, pieces, etc into your head in much the same way as you can learn a language by doing a full-immersion course but that cannot be the same quality of learning or breadth of competence that you would obtain by working at things gradually and reasonably slowly.
I may be wrong but I simply do not believe in "cutting corners" in learning. I tend to think you always pay a price for doing things hurriedly.

Yup, I agree. If you get through grades that fast, you need to be prepared to fill in the gaps after the grade 8 exam for a while.

[Robodoc]

Ref. Grade 8 in 2 years. I think that is really too fast and true just up to a point. While it may be true that you can get the pieces for a Grade 8 exam if you practise 6-8 hrs a day for a few months, that does not mean that you're at Grade 8 level, in my humble opinion.
By definition, the learning process requires physiological assimilation and that, except in the case of geniuses, takes time, more or less time depending on the person's circumstances, his/her talent and will-power and on thousands of other factors. You can cram scales, arpeggios, pieces, etc into your head in much the same way as you can learn a language by doing a full-immersion course but that cannot be the same quality of learning or breadth of competence that you would obtain by working at things gradually and reasonably slowly.
I may be wrong but I simply do not believe in "cutting corners" in learning. I tend to think you always pay a price for doing things hurriedly.

Yup, I agree. If you get through grades that fast, you need to be prepared to fill in the gaps after the grade 8 exam for a while.

Hmm. I agree that you should never rush or hurry but that is not to say a pupil should not be allowed and encouraged to progress fast if that is the pupils natural rate of progress. To slow a pupils natural rate of progress on the grounds that he or she will lack the "quality of learning and breadth of competence that you would obtain by working at things gradually and reasonably slowly" seems to me to be a recipe for boredom and mediocrity. If a pupil has the ability to reach a high standard quickly it would be simply wrong to hold them back.

As for being "at grade 8 level", the definition of being "at grade 8 level" is that you passed the grade 8 exam, nothing more, nothing less. There may be some "grade 5" musicians who are better players in an all-round sense than some "grade 8" musicians. Indeed, some of the very best players simply never bother with grades (or even classical music) in the first place. Grade 8 practical doesn't test whether you are a wonderful all-round musician. It just tests whether you can play 3 pieces, a selection of scales and a sight reading test and answer some fairly simple questions about musicianship. If you can do that you are a grade 8 musician, even if you can do nothing else.

[Mad Tom]

... and I know someone that started from scratch, passed grade 8 two years later AND had greater breadth and depth of repertoire and understanding than many people (me included) that took many times longer to reach the same standard.

Generalization (from your own experience, or that of a small bunch of acquaintances) is dangerous

[Juan Carlos]

But you see, you're generalising too and I don't see any dangers in generalising.
We all know there are exceptional instances of students that race their way through exams and standards but a generalisation is just a general statement embracing the usual cases and by definition carries with it the inevitable exception(s).
... and the exceptional cases just go to show that because they are viewed as exceptional, they are not the rule.

In general, a generalisation has a general nature and it is generally too general to be 100% true ... generally speaking, I mean ... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Mad Tom]

But you see, you're generalising too

Glad you noticed the irony (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

In general, a generalisation has a general nature and it is generally too general to be 100% true ... generally speaking, I mean ... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/wacko.gif)

[delicato]

thanks for answering, i know it may seemed a bit of a strange question. But it is difficult when you do not know what anyone else does. I do not get much time for practice, which is a shame. Grade 8 in 2 years seems very good to me. I think it is just strange because i can never imagine myself playing piano in a "natural" sort of way. But yes, i think, your right about the technique practice.
Later on i hope to do some other stuff besides just the exam book ----- hopefully. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

I know what you mean. This forum is a goldmine of info, and has people from total beginner to people who have passed Fellowships. Read read read and you'll find out all you need to know (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Grade 8 in 2 years is good. But only because he practiced for 6-8 hours every day, and covered buckets of material, not just exam pieces. If he just did exam pieces he probably wouldn't be a very good grade 8!

I used to be obsessed with how many grades in how many years, but now see its not that important to me. I have taken a break from exams and have rekindled my love of piano by playing pieces I adore.

About playing with ease - I know what you mean. I dream of the day I can play some stuff with relative ease, and look totally natural to anyone listening lol. It'll come. You'll notice how you seem to play with some ease the pieces you know well? It'll get better (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) At least I sincerely hope it does!

Always explore stuff outside the exam books. You should really study non-exam pieces at the same time as exam pieces. Broaden your repetoire, play stuff you love! What kind of things do you want to play? Romantic, classical, modern, the kind of things from films we see today etc etc. Look into getting some of the sheet music you could learn and have some fun. Don't get too centred on the exams. They cover a lot of stuff you will need down the line, but certainly not everything. Playing loads of pieces will help your overall technique, theory skills, aural skills and sight reading.

I used to think grades were the only way to monitor your learning. That was until I read that someone here, Mad Tom I think, said 'Keep playing pieces until you come across something that really challenges you, then learn that'. Or something along those lines. Basically play lots of pieces and keep pushing yourself lol

What kind of piano do you have?

I agree with you totally (not just saying that), I must try and do some other stuff as well, maybe put a little bit of time aside each week. Although i also play violin --- which takes up a lot of time --- which i love. I think, i tend to get hung up on exams because i'm older and feel the need to make up for lost time, perhaps (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) Alhough, i am not really sure why i feel i need to do exams! ---- maybe need to prove a point !!!!! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/ph34r.gif)
Yes, i have a very nice german upright all in rose wood piano, about 1933, called a Goetze, it is a very heavy framed
piano and i love the sound. Is piano your first instrument ??

Ref. Grade 8 in 2 years. I think that is really too fast and true just up to a point. While it may be true that you can get the pieces for a Grade 8 exam if you practise 6-8 hrs a day for a few months, that does not mean that you're at Grade 8 level, in my humble opinion.
By definition, the learning process requires physiological assimilation and that, except in the case of geniuses, takes time, more or less time depending on the person's circumstances, his/her talent and will-power and on thousands of other factors. You can cram scales, arpeggios, pieces, etc into your head in much the same way as you can learn a language by doing a full-immersion course but that cannot be the same quality of learning or breadth of competence that you would obtain by working at things gradually and reasonably slowly.
I may be wrong but I simply do not believe in "cutting corners" in learning. I tend to think you always pay a price for doing things hurriedly.

Yup, I agree. If you get through grades that fast, you need to be prepared to fill in the gaps after the grade 8 exam for a while.

Hmm. I agree that you should never rush or hurry but that is not to say a pupil should not be allowed and encouraged to progress fast if that is the pupils natural rate of progress. To slow a pupils natural rate of progress on the grounds that he or she will lack the "quality of learning and breadth of competence that you would obtain by working at things gradually and reasonably slowly" seems to me to be a recipe for boredom and mediocrity. If a pupil has the ability to reach a high standard quickly it would be simply wrong to hold them back.

As for being "at grade 8 level", the definition of being "at grade 8 level" is that you passed the grade 8 exam, nothing more, nothing less. There may be some "grade 5" musicians who are better players in an all-round sense than some "grade 8" musicians. Indeed, some of the very best players simply never bother with grades (or even classical music) in the first place. Grade 8 practical doesn't test whether you are a wonderful all-round musician. It just tests whether you can play 3 pieces, a selection of scales and a sight reading test and answer some fairly simple questions about musicianship. If you can do that you are a grade 8 musician, even if you can do nothing else.

Had not read this, sorry i do not read things in order! (that would be a bit boring!!!! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) ). Had not thought of this, i mean, about holding students back.
Maybe thats why my teacher pushes me on so quickly, well it feels quick to me, so i feel a bit of a fraud. My violin playing i usually do loads of stuff. Anyway i ought not to worry about this too much (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[TeacherNumberOne]

... and I know someone that started from scratch, passed grade 8 two years later AND had greater breadth and depth of repertoire and understanding than many people (me included) that took many times longer to reach the same standard.

Generalization (from your own experience, or that of a small bunch of acquaintances) is dangerous

Had they already been learning another instrument?