Want son to give up flute, because he won't practice! Options

[tonedeafmum]

Oh dear. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/blush.gif)
I am obviously quite the nastiest parent on the forum. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/ph34r.gif)
My relatives pay for some of the children's music and/or dancing lessons on the understanding that THAT is their Christmas/Birthday present from that person.
And I expect them to practise or I won't ask for the same present again next year (same principle as, if you ask for a toy car at Christmas and then never play with it, there's no point asking for another one for your birthday.)

I don't do it because I think it's a brilliant parenting technique but just because there wouldn't be the money for everything they do otherwise.

My family do like being involved though. MNW is there a family 'good guy' who could step in and start paying for the flute lessons? My children love the fact that their 'cool' uncle pays for some lessons - especially as he pays out cash bonuses for performances, exams and other evidence that practice is being done and progress is being made - which the Unco-operative Bank of Tonedeaf certainly doesn't.

[MNW]

Has pulling out of the exam had any effect on his motivation? Is he practising more or less since deciding not to go ahead? If less, perhaps he does need a goal (not necessarily an exam) to work towards?

Is there something he really wants that you can dangle as a carrot to get him moving? Bribery always works a treat with my boys!

I pulled him out of the exam because of his lack of practice and the fact that he managed to always "forget" his flute in the holidays! I find his ideas on music quite contradicting. He hates music, he hates the fact that the house is filled with music (well, when I'm here!) and there is a lot of singing in the house - he loathes singing! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif) So, he never wants to practice and he was furious when I booked him into an orchestra week with his brother and he moaned every day about it. But, he loves playing in ensembles and I know he enjoyed the final performance on the last day of the course.

He is good at music and has the potential, as he knows, to be great so I don't believe it's a self-esteem issue.

When he moves school, if he can continue to play in ensembles without having lessons then I think this is the route to go down. BB has a bassoon teacher who he goes to in the holidays so I could take him to her occassionally to make sure he's not developing bad habits.

I suppose the title of the thread was incorrect. I don't want him to give up the flute but I no longer want to pay for lessons if he won't put in a little bit of work. Yes, 15 minutes 5 days a week for 26 weeks may be ok but if he was at home he wouldn't do any practice and when he moves onto senior school they have to practice in their own time and that is not going to happen, especially in his first year! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

[notmusimum]

Has pulling out of the exam had any effect on his motivation? Is he practising more or less since deciding not to go ahead? If less, perhaps he does need a goal (not necessarily an exam) to work towards?

Is there something he really wants that you can dangle as a carrot to get him moving? Bribery always works a treat with my boys!

I've been in the situation with two children playing instruments. My eldest is musical and could have been a reasonable musician. She enjoyed music to a certain extent but found it very difficult that the youngest really took off. Eldest wasn't ever much of a practiser, if I'm honest, but the older she got the more she saw herself as useless when compared to younger sister.

We didn't compare them as a family and I kept on paying for lessons even when it was obvious she had lost interest and was really going through the motions. I tried pulling her out of an exam (mostly because she wasn't ready to take it), bribery, and offered other goals but nothing really worked. I have always had the belief that she could have done it if she wanted but it's hard for the child when they are in that sort of situation.

I can understand the frustration and believe me I felt like pulling her out of lessons as she did no practice whatsoever. She did stay in various ensembles right up until the time she went to uni and was valued as a tuned percussionist.

At 18 there is still some resentment of her sisters music making and I'm sure some of this is down to her personal feelings of failure. I have talked to her about the circumstances being different and the youngest really putting a lot of her time and effort into something which is a passion.

I don't regret allowing the eldest to continue lessons as I do think there were things to be gained. I wish she had fulfilled her musical potential (for her rather than for me) but that wasn't to be and I'm happy about the skills she is developing as a person in her own right.

[sbhoa]

I will ask him if he doesn't practice, would he like music lessons as a Christmas present and then it will be a gift and he doesn't need to practice! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) I think he'll decline!

I do understand the sentiment though - you're a kinder mum than me!

But don't we as parents (i.e. the adult) need to look a bit "bigger" than that. If I said to my child who goes to a fee paying school (on a chunky bursary) "would you like me to pay your school fees as a christmas present?" then I'm sure I know exactly what she would say! She's a teenager after all. A dedicated, hard working, balanced (I hope (IMG:style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif) ) teenager but still one who would tell me thanks but no thanks! Why would I expect her to say anything different? To ask your son the same about his lessons is the same idea and I can guess what he would say too (even though I've never met him)

As a teenager I would have happily accepted music lessons as a Christmas present but wanting to play was always my idea and I didn't get my piano lessons until I was 14.
The situation seems to be that he does practice (ok, maybe because it's timetabled but sometimes we need this with a full life) and playing in school ensembles can also count as practice.

[Deborah]

The situation seems to be that he does practice (ok, maybe because it's timetabled but sometimes we need this with a full life) and playing in school ensembles can also count as practice.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)
Yes, I find myself timetabling each day, something along the lines of "I need to do ABCDE today, so that means today's schedule is piano practice at X o'clock, followed by shopping, housework, posting nonsense on the internet (IMG:style_emoticons/default/ph34r.gif), lunch, clarinet practice, teaching, dinner..."

Ensemble playing most definitely counts! Whilst he might not be learning pieces set by his teacher, he'll still be developing other ensemble-type skills, such as the importance of playing in time and in tune, listening to others, learning when to come forward and when to hold back.

Now, how to persuade some of my teenagers to practice for fifteen minutes a week. Maybe I should draw them up timetables!

[RoseRodent]

Honestly it sounds as if your issue is more with the school and their bucket-shop financial approach than it is with your son. How very frustrating that he has to take this other bit to get the bit he wants. I know sometimes life is like that (you have to get your G5 theory to carry on with practical and that makes most young musicians rant and rave a bit!) but this is one of those situations where it has no need to be like that. I'd be taking it up with the school as to why they have this policy since you have cleared thing up with him and what he wants, where he wants to go with everything. Just because this is what they do and it's what they've always done doesn't mean that a rethink is out of the question. You pay them a lot of money, after all.

[viola-mad]

when my 5 sons did

Whoa, five sons? Respect! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/notworthy.gif)

(Sorry, I know it's off-topic....)

[violincjj]

when my 5 sons did

Whoa, five sons? Respect! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/notworthy.gif)

(Sorry, I know it's off-topic....)

Thank you, they have taught me a great deal! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Actually they have. 4 are grown up now, they all played music to a high level and had a lot of happiness from it, they all still have music in their lives to varying degrees, singing and playing regularly.

I have learned (at last) to give them ownership of their music - I hated that phrase for years! But I worked out that although it was very nice for me to have sons who were very able with music (and it IS nice to be proud of their Grade 5s at age 8, their JRNCM places, their NCO concerts, their BBC broadcasts...) the music was for them not me and that at its most important it could really, really help them emotionally. One son had a nightmare teenage couple of years (and I don't mean his room was a mess) and the singing he did probably kept him alive. Kind of gives the whole thing perspective.

[viola-mad]

when my 5 sons did

Whoa, five sons? Respect! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/notworthy.gif)

(Sorry, I know it's off-topic....)

Thank you, they have taught me a great deal! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Actually they have. 4 are grown up now, they all played music to a high level and had a lot of happiness from it, they all still have music in their lives to varying degrees, singing and playing regularly.

I have learned (at last) to give them ownership of their music - I hated that phrase for years! But I worked out that although it was very nice for me to have sons who were very able with music (and it IS nice to be proud of their Grade 5s at age 8, their JRNCM places, their NCO concerts, their BBC broadcasts...) the music was for them not me and that at its most important it could really, really help them emotionally. One son had a nightmare teenage couple of years (and I don't mean his room was a mess) and the singing he did probably kept him alive. Kind of gives the whole thing perspective.

To say that music has been a really positive thing in their lives seems like something of an understatement, given the above. What an incredible gift you gave them in music, and particularly the son you singled out in your post. Glad to hear they have all kept music as part of their lives. Best wishes.

[jod]

Reading between the lines, your flute playing son is fed up of being controlled by his mum.

This sounds really harsh, but as a mum who has to work really hard not to fall into the same trap it and currently is only just on the right side of it, I do feel able to mention this as 'there by the grace of God go I' and yes it is really hard.

Pay for his lessons. Praise him for what he actually does. Say pleasant things about his flute practice. Ask him before you book him onto the next course, and respect it when he says no.

It is your son's life, not yours. If you continually try to live your life through your children then you are going to have the worst case of 'Empty Nest Syndrome' in a few years time and are going to be thoroughly miserable.

Tweens and Teens are hard work. They do end up resenting you however much you love them. Try taking a step back and allowing this son to be himself. Both of you will benefit.

You will find this hard, and you will be cross with me for having the audacity to even suggest it in the first place. However, it is because you are a loving mother you are behaving like this and not a bad person. You just have taken that love a step too far.

[STRINGMUM]

Jod some sensible advice there for parents in general. Reading between the lines I did come to the same conclusion.
MNW I'm sure you are a lovely caring mum but sometimes it does sound as if you want to be totally in control. It just shows how we can all interpret the writtn word differently.
If he still enjoys playing the flute and you can afford the lessons let him continue. He may yet find a renewed love for it and learn to practise.

[MNW]

So asking questions on a music forum equates to being in control? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

Unfortunately for my children, I happen to be one of the laziest people on the planet and I am no earth mother. This means that I don't have the will to "make" them do anything, hence boarding school and Purcell are perfect as the schools take over all academic and musical pursuits. In general I post on here enquiring about lots of opportunities and I do this because I am happy for my children to have access to lots of things but they are the ones that choose whether to do them. With DS1 that means he does nothing except spend as much time as possible on the PC and with DS2 it is singing all day long,playing cricket in the garden and playing on the PC. They have so many activities they could do but choose to do none of it. I'd be interested to know how many activities some of the children do on here, from the posters who think I'm controlling. Somehow I think it will be far more than the zero my children do.