Abrsm Editions - What If They Are A Load Of Rubbish?! Options

[cellotim]

I have a cello student who is wanting to do Grade 8 cello. One of the pieces is a late baroque cello sonata with recent additions in this particular edition made by leonard rose (for those who don't know, he was one of the greatest cellists of the 20th Century, and taught Yo-Yo Ma)

. I am predominantely a baroque cellist and its fair to say I know a thing or two about this sort of music. What is in the edition that the ABRSM have specified is absoulte rubbish, not only 'unauthentic' (whatever you interpret that to mean), but musically jibberish - it often doesn't even make basic harmonic sense! I have great respect for Leonard Rose as a cellist but now very little as an editor....!

What licence do we have as teachers to alter the notes - and I mean not just the odd sharp to a natural, but lots of the notes, the accompaniment included? I really feel that a lot of the writing in the piece is totally pointless and stupid. its clear what is editorial - the bits that don't make sense, even by my student's admission. But, if it is for an exam perhaps I should just accept it and get on with it as I don't want to lessen the student's chances of getting a good mark because she deserves one.

All advice gratefully appreciated....

Thanks,

Tim

[JohnS]

You could contact ABRSM themselves at

syllabus@abrsm.ac.uk

Let us know what they say!

[Melody Amour]

Would your student fail the exam if he doesn't play it as ABRSM want it?

[ad_libitum]

Yes if you have your own edition you could use it instead. I think as long as it's not simplified it's acceptable but I'd have to double check.

[all ears]

Yes, check with the ABRSM!

f) Candidates may use any edition of the pieces listed in the syllabus, except where a specific arrangement or transcription is indicated. The editions quoted in the syllabus are given for guidance only and are not obligatory.

(Lifted from UK & Ireland Exam Regs)

I think that if you have doubts, you should go ahead and enquire - we recently ordered music for a violin exam which was specified by publisher only (Wot about ISBN? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif) ), it only became obvious that the correct edition must have been a different edition of that piece issued by the same publisher (IMG:style_emoticons/default/mad.gif) when a very simplified edition arrived. However, a student who didn't know the piece and had never heard it performed may have happily assumed that the simplified edition was the correct one - the question is whether it would be accepted for a Grade 8 exam, since it was indeed from the listed publisher?. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/ill.gif)

Take a look at the General Regs for Bowed Strings. It says useful things about using any bowing or fingering as long as it's practical and good, omitting tuttis in concerti if that seems appropriate, and giving any cadenzas the axe.

However, if you hate the editing of the piece, I imagine the safest route is to contact the ABRSM and specifically seek approval for the edition you'd rather use, or persuade your student to consider another piece.

[organ_dummy]

I have a cello student who is wanting to do Grade 8 cello. One of the pieces is a late baroque cello sonata with recent additions in this particular edition made by leonard rose (for those who don't know, he was one of the greatest cellists of the 20th Century, and taught Yo-Yo Ma)

. I am predominantely a baroque cellist and its fair to say I know a thing or two about this sort of music. What is in the edition that the ABRSM have specified is absoulte rubbish, not only 'unauthentic' (whatever you interpret that to mean), but musically jibberish - it often doesn't even make basic harmonic sense! I have great respect for Leonard Rose as a cellist but now very little as an editor....!

The subject of your post is somewhat misleading. You are complaining about an edition that is cited in the cello syllabus, but this is not an edition published by the ABRSM, right?

I actually encountered a similar situation with one of my students. And it is an ABRSM edition that I am not happy with (see my thread on the Scarlatti Sonata set for Grade 7 piano). For the purpose of the exam, I am having my student follow the editorial markings, with an understanding that the music can be played in many different ways.

[ad_libitum]

I actually encountered a similar situation with one of my students. And it is an ABRSM edition that I am not happy with (see my thread on the Scarlatti Sonata set for Grade 7 piano). For the purpose of the exam, I am having my student follow the editorial markings, with an understanding that the music can be played in many different ways.

But you know they don't have to follow the editorial markings on their copy? At grade 7 especially they are looking for stylistic awareness, and that doesn't mean blindly following whatever markings are there. If it sounds better played a different way or articulated a different way then I do it!

I didn't like the articulation for a grade 8 scarlatti sonata so changed it, and it was my highest scoring piece. I had 3 editions of the same sonata all with different suggested ways of playing, so it's not written in stone that you have to play it the way suggested in the AB book. It's just for guidance really.

[cellotim]

Thanks for all the advice. I'll have a look and see if the edition/arrangement she has is the officially specified version or if there is some freedom there. If not perhaps I can make some improvements.

But you know they don't have to follow the editorial markings on their copy? At grade 7 especially they are looking for stylistic awareness, and that doesn't mean blindly following whatever markings are there. If it sounds better played a different way or articulated a different way then I do it!

I've already changed just about every articulation in the part! I'm thinking more along the lines of cutting out big chunks of it (or re-writing those chunks) that just don't make any musical sense! Its usually at the cadences which are just a series of chords, right? But in this edition each 'interesting' cadence (i.e. one that moves the piece into a different key) results in a half page Romantic cadenza - the result being that you totally lose sense of the overall harmonic motion and therefore the musical direction.

Anyway, I'll have a think and come up with something. I might have to do some investigating for the original edition or something and see what is in that!

Thanks again.

[harmony2]

I often use different editions than the ones quoted, especially with baroque flute music, and frequently change articulations/suggested breath marks as some of them are terrible! However, I would try to find an edition that you are more or less comfortable with rather than change/omit sections.

[cellotim]

yes, I'd much rather find a better edition that makes sense rather than mess around with this one. But it looks like ABRSM have specified this particular edition in their list, so I'll ask them what I should do.

Thanks,

Tim

[ad_libitum]

I've already changed just about every articulation in the part!

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Anyway, I'll have a think and come up with something. I might have to do some investigating for the original edition or something and see what is in that!

Thanks again.

Good idea. Hopefully you'll find one that is still the "original" version but more along the lines you are thinking of.