Second hand flute Options

[kharris]

Could someone give me some advice about buying a second hand flute please!!!

My daughter started to learn the flute in November last year and a friend of hers kindly lent her old flute to her. According to my daughter's flute teacher, she could take ABRSM grade 5 this summer if she wanted to and her current flute is not the easiest to play at all. So I've started to research on second hand flute.

I was told Yamaha is good to get and apart from that, I don't have any idea at all.
Even Yamaha 211 seems to have different models (211s, 211uk etc...) and I'm totally confused. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)
I'd also like to know what sort of questions I should ask concerning the conditions of the flute.

Please help me.

[andante_in_c]

Buying second hand is a bit of a minefield, even for an experienced player. The safest option, although not necessarily the cheapest, is to buy a second hand instrument from one of the main flute retailers: Topwind, JustFlutes or AllFlutesPlus. JustFlutes requires all owners to get their flute inspected and if necessary repaired/serviced in their workshop before they are listed and AllFlutesPlus gives an indication of the instrument's condition on their website, so you have another opinion about the flute's condition.

If you are some distance from London you may wish to find out if your local music shop sells second hand instruments, although these may not have been examined by a flute specialist. Alternatively your daughter's teacher may know of a pupil who is upgrading and selling her instrument.

Yamaha 211 S models and UK models will both be fine (the UK ones are more recent). Other models beginning with 2 will have slightly different specifications and you would need to check with the teacher whether these would be suitable.

Good luck! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Flossie]

You need to take your daughter somewhere to try out different flutes. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Don't just buy one without trying it and others. Different flutes play differently (related to things like embouchure hole shape and cut, crown weight, riser, metal thickness) and therefore different players suit different flutes. Yes, Yamaha does good entry level flutes (and the 311 is a decent upgrade instrument) but they don't suit everybody. I know quite a few people - including myself - who don't get on particularly well with Yamaha flutes, and others who wouldn't want to play anything else.

If you're looking on the second hand market then you ideally need to go to one of the specialist flute shops, because that way you can be confident in what you're buying. General music shops tend to be less reliable. If you can't get to a specialist flute place then it's best to take someone with you who understands flutes. Either way, make sure you get the instrument on approval for at least a week (if the instrument's just been serviced then this can hide problems with the mechanism, which would then gradually appear as the instrument gets played more) and get the flute checked by her teacher before you agree to buy it.

One thing to consider is whether you want, at this point, to buy her a better flute. It might be worthwhile going straight for an 'upgrade' or 'step up' instrument with a silver lip plate, headjoint or tube, such as a Yamaha 311, Pearl 665 or 765, Trevor James Cantible or Virtuoso, Azumi 2000, or a student flute with a professionally made solid silver headjoint. Flutes in this range can easily take her beyond grade 8, whereas if you buy a student instrument you will probably need to upgrade it when she's around grade 6-7 standard (which may only be a year or so away, especially if she's grade 5 standard now after 6 months of playing).

[Pixie*Porsche]

Whereabouts are you?

My partner and I run a workshop servicing, refurbishing and retailing flutes and clarinets. Our website is in my signature, though we have more instruments than the ones on there. You are most welcome to come over and have a chat with us at any time!

I agree with what has been said so far.

Flossie - I get on with Yamahas really well, yet I've had customers who don't at all - buying a flute is such a personal choice. We have an Altus 1007 coming in very soon and I can't wait to try it! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Try lots and you'll find the right instrument for you (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[barry-clari]

Would second a_i_c's recommendation of Myalls/JustFlutes (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Bagpuss]

...and I will third it!

Second-Hand-Bag x

[elidatrading]

What is your budget?

Liz

[IanG]

As a family we have bought a few secondhand instruments over the years. All have turned out really great - our daughter took her violin up to grade 7, son his clarinet up to grade 7 before they went to uni. My wife plays in a pipe band (oh no I've let that cat of the bag!) and I'm just learning..
Our experience for what it's worth:
Daughter's violin - her teacher borrowed a selection from a local dealer and they both tried them out before deciding on one.
Son's clarinet - bought new when local store had a very good offer on (may have been a demonstration model).
Son's sax - after trying his teacher's and with us being guided every step of the way, we bid for a Yamaha on Ebay. The instrument had barely been played and our 'advisor' pronounced it to be worth double what we paid.
Wife's pipes - a lot of research, a lot of watching and waiting and eventually bid for a set on Ebay. They are a reputable make and perform extremely well (and loudly!!)
My clarinet - a beautiful Hanson T5 bought on Ebay after a lot of research and including a bit of advice from Alastair Hanson himself. Alastair has since looked it over for me and pronounced it a 'very good buy' - one day I hope to get good enough to do it justice.
You'll notice a trend here and many will be horrified - but if you are prepared to accept the risk and research carefully there are bargains to be had on Ebay.. maybe we've just been very lucky.
All that said without a doubt the best is to try before you buy - the ideal was the way we got our daughter's violin.
Ian
Whatever you do don't rush into it - and get the best advice you can!

[kharris]

Buying second hand is a bit of a minefield, even for an experienced player. The safest option, although not necessarily the cheapest, is to buy a second hand instrument from one of the main flute retailers: Topwind, JustFlutes or AllFlutesPlus. JustFlutes requires all owners to get their flute inspected and if necessary repaired/serviced in their workshop before they are listed and AllFlutesPlus gives an indication of the instrument's condition on their website, so you have another opinion about the flute's condition.

If you are some distance from London you may wish to find out if your local music shop sells second hand instruments, although these may not have been examined by a flute specialist. Alternatively your daughter's teacher may know of a pupil who is upgrading and selling her instrument.

Yamaha 211 S models and UK models will both be fine (the UK ones are more recent). Other models beginning with 2 will have slightly different specifications and you would need to check with the teacher whether these would be suitable.

Good luck! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Thank you for your advice.

I thought 211 S, UK etc are pretty much similar , just different model names for updating the same model.
I suppose if you don't know what you are looking at, the safest thing would be to go to the specialist shop.

You need to take your daughter somewhere to try out different flutes. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Don't just buy one without trying it and others. Different flutes play differently (related to things like embouchure hole shape and cut, crown weight, riser, metal thickness) and therefore different players suit different flutes. Yes, Yamaha does good entry level flutes (and the 311 is a decent upgrade instrument) but they don't suit everybody. I know quite a few people - including myself - who don't get on particularly well with Yamaha flutes, and others who wouldn't want to play anything else.

If you're looking on the second hand market then you ideally need to go to one of the specialist flute shops, because that way you can be confident in what you're buying. General music shops tend to be less reliable. If you can't get to a specialist flute place then it's best to take someone with you who understands flutes. Either way, make sure you get the instrument on approval for at least a week (if the instrument's just been serviced then this can hide problems with the mechanism, which would then gradually appear as the instrument gets played more) and get the flute checked by her teacher before you agree to buy it.

One thing to consider is whether you want, at this point, to buy her a better flute. It might be worthwhile going straight for an 'upgrade' or 'step up' instrument with a silver lip plate, headjoint or tube, such as a Yamaha 311, Pearl 665 or 765, Trevor James Cantible or Virtuoso, Azumi 2000, or a student flute with a professionally made solid silver headjoint. Flutes in this range can easily take her beyond grade 8, whereas if you buy a student instrument you will probably need to upgrade it when she's around grade 6-7 standard (which may only be a year or so away, especially if she's grade 5 standard now after 6 months of playing).

Thanks for all the information.

I did wonder about better (more expensive) models than Yamaha 211 sereies.
I was looking at eBay yesterday and someome was selling his/her 211. He/she described it as suitable for beginner up to Grade 5, which my daughter seems to have achieved already.

Whereabouts are you?

My partner and I run a workshop servicing, refurbishing and retailing flutes and clarinets. Our website is in my signature, though we have more instruments than the ones on there. You are most welcome to come over and have a chat with us at any time!

I agree with what has been said so far.

Flossie - I get on with Yamahas really well, yet I've had customers who don't at all - buying a flute is such a personal choice. We have an Altus 1007 coming in very soon and I can't wait to try it! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Try lots and you'll find the right instrument for you (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

We live in Aylesbury, Buckinghamshire.

What is your budget?

Liz

At the moment, I don't have a clear idea. We upgraded her cello recently and are thinking of selling her old one. Hopefully we could get around ?250, so out budget would be around the figure. Would we be able to get a decent second hand flute?

[jazzycat]

I did wonder about better (more expensive) models than Yamaha 211 sereies.
I was looking at eBay yesterday and someome was selling his/her 211. He/she described it as suitable for beginner up to Grade 5, which my daughter seems to have achieved already.

I would disagree ever so slightly with this (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) I did my grade 8 on a Yamaha 211, and would no doubt still be playing it had it not been stolen in the last year of my music degree. When I started work I bought a Yamaha 311; that was twenty-something years ago and I play it regularly (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[elidatrading]

I did grade 8 on a battered old Emperor - the examiner is not marking the instrument!

OP - I know of a good used flute for less than your budget. It isn't a Yamaha though so if you are set on a yamaha you won't be interested. If you are interested send me a PM

Liz

[notmusimum]

At the moment, I don't have a clear idea. We upgraded her cello recently and are thinking of selling her old one. Hopefully we could get around ?250, so out budget would be around the figure. Would we be able to get a decent second hand flute?

If your daughter is still at school then you should be able to buy on assisted purchase if you go for a new instrument. That will give you a saving of 20%.

We went down the Yamaha route on advice from a teacher. It never really suited our daughter but we got as much as we paid when we traded in a year ago. I would echo what everyone else has said and try to find some that your daughter can play to get a feel of which one might be right for her. Even if you try new ones it doesn't mean you can't buy a similar model secondhand.

[kharris]

I did wonder about better (more expensive) models than Yamaha 211 sereies.
I was looking at eBay yesterday and someome was selling his/her 211. He/she described it as suitable for beginner up to Grade 5, which my daughter seems to have achieved already.

I would disagree ever so slightly with this (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) I did my grade 8 on a Yamaha 211, and would no doubt still be playing it had it not been stolen in the last year of my music degree. When I started work I bought a Yamaha 311; that was twenty-something years ago and I play it regularly (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

I still like the idea of Yamaha 211. 311 looks nice, but is rather expensive. Also I know that Yamaha 211 would be a huge improvement from what she's using at the moment anyway.

I did grade 8 on a battered old Emperor - the examiner is not marking the instrument!

OP - I know of a good used flute for less than your budget. It isn't a Yamaha though so if you are set on a yamaha you won't be interested. If you are interested send me a PM

Liz

I don't know anything about flute and only decent make I know is Yamaha. Also my daughters' cello teacher's wife who teaches flute said Yamaha is good.

[Misti]

While there is a lot of good advice on this thread, I would observe that you shouldn't feel guilty if you can't justify spending the ?800+ for an 'upgrade' flute, or the time/expense of a trip to a shiny London shop. At the end of the day, most young flautists don't have parents with lots of time, money, interest or knowledge to buy the 'perfect' flute for the pupil. By asking questions on this forum, you're already much further along than most parents!

Obviously playing as many flutes as possible and picking a favourite is the ideal, but I selected my upgrade flute from a choice of 2. I've played other 'nice' flutes since, which has confirmed that the one I ended up with (one of the older Yamaha models, equivalent to a 311) suits me well enough. Maybe I was just lucky though.

Another nice thing about Yamahas is that they do tend to be indestructable (as flutes go), which is definitely an advantage when its getting lugged about all over the place and exposed to other children/teenagers. Mine has never been serviced in its 7 or 8 years of life, and still isn't showing any major issues.

One thing I would add is to make sure you involve your daughter in the decision as far as possible. I was G5 and about 13/14 when I selected my 'upgrade' flute - she'll know from playing them what feels right and which ones feel less suitable. If she declares that a Yamaha is unplayable, you may well have to think again!

[kharris]

While there is a lot of good advice on this thread, I would observe that you shouldn't feel guilty if you can't justify spending the ?800+ for an 'upgrade' flute, or the time/expense of a trip to a shiny London shop. At the end of the day, most young flautists don't have parents with lots of time, money, interest or knowledge to buy the 'perfect' flute for the pupil. By asking questions on this forum, you're already much further along than most parents!

Obviously playing as many flutes as possible and picking a favourite is the ideal, but I selected my upgrade flute from a choice of 2. I've played other 'nice' flutes since, which has confirmed that the one I ended up with (one of the older Yamaha models, equivalent to a 311) suits me well enough. Maybe I was just lucky though.

Another nice thing about Yamahas is that they do tend to be indestructable (as flutes go), which is definitely an advantage when its getting lugged about all over the place and exposed to other children/teenagers. Mine has never been serviced in its 7 or 8 years of life, and still isn't showing any major issues.

One thing I would add is to make sure you involve your daughter in the decision as far as possible. I was G5 and about 13/14 when I selected my 'upgrade' flute - she'll know from playing them what feels right and which ones feel less suitable. If she declares that a Yamaha is unplayable, you may well have to think again!

Thank you very much for your advice.

It would be great if we could take her to a nice music shop and let her choose what she likes from the selection of instruments. I don't know anything about flute, but do know good instrument would help enormously.

I am leaning more towards Yamaha, but as you said if Yamaha isn't the one for her, that's fine. We look for somethig else as long as we can afford.

Thanks again.