Having Problems With Music Theory In Practice Grade 5. Can Someone He, Major and minor keys up to six sharps and flats Options

[MiddleC]

Hello there,
I wonder if someone would be kind enough to clarify three points with regards to questions 4© and 4(d) on page 12 of the Grade 5 Music Theory in Practice workbook?

Firstly, in question 4©, the instuction is to name the key. In the corresponding Model Answers book the key is named as E-flat minor. I can see how the D-natural in bar 3 suggests E-flat minor in that it is a sharpened 7th, but it is the ONLY sharpened 7th. Every other D in the extract is D-flat. So, is it the case that it only takes one instance of a sharpened 7th for the music to be said to be in the minor key?

Secondly, also in question 4©, the instruction is to rewrite the extract, including the key signature, onto the two staves provided. In the Model Answers book the key signature is included at the beginning of the first stave but omitted from the second. I thought that the key signature should always appear at the beginning of EACH stave (after the clef). So, have I misunderstood? Are there instances when the key signature appears on the first stave only?

Lastly, in question 4(d), once again the instruction is to name the key. The accidentals suggest a key signature of 5 flats with no sharpened 7th, ie D-flat major. The Model Answers book gives the answer as G-flat major, ie 6 flats including C-flat. But the extract contains no C's, flat or otherwise. Is it because of the extract beginning and ending on G, that it is assumed that it is in G-flat major rather than D-flat major?

Any clarification will be truly appreciated.

[Hils]

Hello there,
I wonder if someone would be kind enough to clarify three points with regards to questions 4© and 4(d) on page 12 of the Grade 5 Music Theory in Practice workbook?

Firstly, in question 4©, the instuction is to name the key. In the corresponding Model Answers book the key is named as E-flat minor. I can see how the D-natural in bar 3 suggests E-flat minor in that it is a sharpened 7th, but it is the ONLY sharpened 7th. Every other D in the extract is D-flat. So, is it the case that it only takes one instance of a sharpened 7th for the music to be said to be in the minor key?

This is quite clearly in Eflat minor. If you think about the melodic minor scale then it is more understandable to have both Db and D in the same extract. I recommend you practise 'hearing' the melody as well as just the scientific approach of counting accidentals though.

Secondly, also in question 4©, the instruction is to rewrite the extract, including the key signature, onto the two staves provided. In the Model Answers book the key signature is included at the beginning of the first stave but omitted from the second. I thought that the key signature should always appear at the beginning of EACH stave (after the clef). So, have I misunderstood? Are there instances when the key signature appears on the first stave only?

I don't have the model answers book but this sounds like a proofing slip to me: the key signature should be repeated.

Lastly, in question 4(d), once again the instruction is to name the key. The accidentals suggest a key signature of 5 flats with no sharpened 7th, ie D-flat major. The Model Answers book gives the answer as G-flat major, ie 6 flats including C-flat. But the extract contains no C's, flat or otherwise. Is it because of the extract beginning and ending on G, that it is assumed that it is in G-flat major rather than D-flat major?

Again if you can hear or play this it will be clear. Can you see how the dominant tonic in the melody (Db to Gb) at the end implyies a perfect cadence? Where the tune briefy lingers on a Db in the 4th bar, in contrast, there is no feel of it coming to rest there, no strong cadence feel of closure in the same way.

Hope this is clearer and not more confusing. Getting your inner ear to work for you is (sorry for the pun) absolutely key.

[icklechick]

Yes, just because it doesn't contain any C's (flat or otherwise) doesn't mean you can discount Cb as an option in the key signature. The crucial thing is if it DID have a C, it would have to be a Cb.

It's like a piece in F major can play all the way through without ever having a B to play - so you need to learn other ways of telling the key of a piece other than just counting accidentals....and that's when the methods Hils describes come in handy (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[MiddleC]

Hello again,

First of all, I'm still getting to grips with how to use these forums so forgive me if my reply doesn't display exactly where it should. Thank you so much for your comments. Having someone make you look at the question in a different way is sometimes all it needs to see things more clearly. Your advice has been incredibly helpful. Many thanks.

Hello there,
I wonder if someone would be kind enough to clarify three points with regards to questions 4© and 4(d) on page 12 of the Grade 5 Music Theory in Practice workbook?

Firstly, in question 4©, the instuction is to name the key. In the corresponding Model Answers book the key is named as E-flat minor. I can see how the D-natural in bar 3 suggests E-flat minor in that it is a sharpened 7th, but it is the ONLY sharpened 7th. Every other D in the extract is D-flat. So, is it the case that it only takes one instance of a sharpened 7th for the music to be said to be in the minor key?

This is quite clearly in Eflat minor. If you think about the melodic minor scale then it is more understandable to have both Db and D in the same extract. I recommend you practise 'hearing' the melody as well as just the scientific approach of counting accidentals though.

Secondly, also in question 4©, the instruction is to rewrite the extract, including the key signature, onto the two staves provided. In the Model Answers book the key signature is included at the beginning of the first stave but omitted from the second. I thought that the key signature should always appear at the beginning of EACH stave (after the clef). So, have I misunderstood? Are there instances when the key signature appears on the first stave only?

I don't have the model answers book but this sounds like a proofing slip to me: the key signature should be repeated.

Lastly, in question 4(d), once again the instruction is to name the key. The accidentals suggest a key signature of 5 flats with no sharpened 7th, ie D-flat major. The Model Answers book gives the answer as G-flat major, ie 6 flats including C-flat. But the extract contains no C's, flat or otherwise. Is it because of the extract beginning and ending on G, that it is assumed that it is in G-flat major rather than D-flat major?

Again if you can hear or play this it will be clear. Can you see how the dominant tonic in the melody (Db to Gb) at the end implyies a perfect cadence? Where the tune briefy lingers on a Db in the 4th bar, in contrast, there is no feel of it coming to rest there, no strong cadence feel of closure in the same way.

Hope this is clearer and not more confusing. Getting your inner ear to work for you is (sorry for the pun) absolutely key.

Thank you so much for your help. I'm so pleased to have somewhere where I can ask questions about things I'm stuck on. I don't have a music theory teacher, nor do I sing, or play an instrument. so I get stuck on what must seem, to others, like the most daft things. Your comments are incredibly helpful. Thanks ever so.

Yes, just because it doesn't contain any C's (flat or otherwise) doesn't mean you can discount Cb as an option in the key signature. The crucial thing is if it DID have a C, it would have to be a Cb.

It's like a piece in F major can play all the way through without ever having a B to play - so you need to learn other ways of telling the key of a piece other than just counting accidentals....and that's when the methods Hils describes come in handy (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Hils]

Thank you so much for your help. I'm so pleased to have somewhere where I can ask questions about things I'm stuck on. I don't have a music theory teacher, nor do I sing, or play an instrument. so I get stuck on what must seem, to others, like the most daft things. Your comments are incredibly helpful. Thanks ever so.

If you cannot get a teacher (and that would be the ideal solution) then which other books are you using you support your learning? You sound like you are doing incredibly well especially if you are not an instrumentalist or a singer ... yet.... But it will be quite difficult just with MTIP I would imagine.