Memorisers, What goes through your head while you're playing? Options

[Roseau]

Until earlier this week I would have said emphatically that I was not a memoriser and that if I was obliged to play from memory I would have a mental image of the score running through my head as I played.

However, as I have posted elsewhere, earlier this week I decided as an experiment to rehearse with an accompanist without having the music in front of me and, to my great surprise, found it to be a liberating experience.

I have been experimenting further at home and have discovered that if I stop trying to visualise the score then I can play far more of the piece from memory than I thought I could. I'm finding the prospect of playing from memory both exciting and frightening; exciting because it is offering me expressive possibilites that I didn't have before but frightening because I don't trust this newly discovered skill.

What I would like to know is what is going on in the heads of those who like playing from memory. Do you just hear the piece in your head and trust that your fingers will play the right notes?

[lingle]

welcome to the gang! Did it feel as though you were using a different part of your brain? That's how it is for me.

I had an analagous experience to you with art when I let myself forget about perspective rules and just tried to let my eyes connect to my hand (though I think you are a much better musician than I am artist).

Anyway, to answer your question, yes, we natural aural learners rarely visualise the score (I might a bit with piano when I'm looking for the hand shape).

I think a lot of what we do is follow the ebb and flow of the harmonic journey (if that makes sense). If someone said to me "start at bar 67, the bit that goes like this" I might struggle. But if I'm allowed to go back to the beginning of the musical "paragraph" or idea - which might be at bar 60, then bar 67 just comes.

I don't think many of us aural learners naturally memorise "by rote". It's more than we are "living" the "journey" of the harmonies and build-ups of rhythm. I "read" the tonal logic as others might read notation.

I will tend to refer back to notation for fingering (totally different somehow - I suppose because that's a kinetic memory not a musical one?). I also have to refer back to it sometimes where harmonies are more subtle - perhaps where there is an inversion or the third is missing from the triad. So for instance, learning the Bach C major prelude, I know with absolute certainty whether I've moved to the correct chord, but as the harmonies get more complex I had to check back to see if the chords were inverted (especially those left thumb notes about 3/4 of the way through).

[Hubicka]

I have it in my muscle memory, i have to not think about notes, if i do then i lose it!

[sbhoa]

For that things that I do memorise I use a mixture of things.
Part of it is aural though this is stronger on clarinet than on piano. Part is just knowing the piece well and until recently on piano I'd only memorised (accidentally) music with a very obvious harmonic structure). Thinking of the score plays a part but not really in a seeing the notes on the page way. There is some muscle memory involved too but I think that's stronger on piano than on clarinet.
The combination varies throughout a piece.
With the accompaniment added the memory was not so secure as I needed to practise that way in order to fix it in my memory that way.

[Roseau]

Did it feel as though you were using a different part of your brain? That's how it is for me.

It did indeed (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
That's probably why it feels scary - I didn't know I still had parts of my brain to discover (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wacko.gif)

I have it in my muscle memory, i have to not think about notes, if i do then i lose it!

That's what I was finding - when I started thinking about the notes, I found myself hesitating but if I just went with the flow of what was in my head then my fingers seemed to know where to go.

But that leads on to the next question - if you perform without the music, how do you know you have got to a point where you can trust your fingers to know where to go?

[corenfa]

In response to your original question-

I have four parallel things happening in my head when I play from memory:

(not in any order)

1. Aural: what does it sound like?
2. Visual: what did it look like on the page? where would I be now on the page?
3. Physical: muscle memory
4. Analytical: what key am I in, do I need to go back to the tonic now?

The act of memorisation is active, I really have to work at it to get all of these there. I don't trust only muscle memory and I certainly can't remember every note and write it out. Having all of these things makes it feel much more secure because I feel as though all four have to go wrong before things REALLY go wrong.

I am good at remembering what things sound like so my way of not getting lost is to "play back" the piece in my head and follow along.

Did it feel as though you were using a different part of your brain? That's how it is for me.

It did indeed (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
That's probably why it feels scary - I didn't know I still had parts of my brain to discover (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wacko.gif)

When I was little I read something about how humans only use 10% of their brains and that made a big impression on me - I constantly find that I am unearthing new mental abilities (wow I sound like some sort of superhero mutant (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) ) and a lot of it is through music. I can't really explain this, I just feel like different things are using different parts of my brain.

But that leads on to the next question - if you perform without the music, how do you know you have got to a point where you can trust your fingers to know where to go?

I have to have all the other three things above going on besides the muscle memory - and I also have "checkpoints" so that if I get lost, i can always start from one of them. I have had to use this before... see this thread

[lingle]

"That's probably why it feels scary - I didn't know I still had parts of my brain to discover (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wacko.gif) "

ah, that's lovely I'm pleased for you (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Yes - don't whatever you do think about notes - if you do that, then I suspect that you'll be slipping back into using the analytical "naming things" part of your brain (different neural pathways and all that (she says - O Level Biology so must be an expert) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) ).

Going back to the analogy with my drawing efforts - if I think "ah, there are four legs all the same size so that leg should be bigger but hold on it's further back so smaller" then I'm back at square one. The pathways I want to use - the ones that go from eyes to hands without words - are pretty weak and it takes practice to build them up.

"But that leads on to the next question - if you perform without the music, how do you know you have got to a point where you can trust your fingers to know where to go?"
[/quote]

Well, three years ago I would have said that I simply could not and would not sight-read any music I couldn't already "play in my head". Now I can. I did it by short episodes of practice - I was in a quartet with three notation-junkies and they simply forced me to sight-read for the first 5 minutes or so of each session. Now I can sight-read an early Mozart quartet with some degree of relaxation....the pathways are stronger than they were (though to be honest I'm following my knowledge of the tonal logic as much as the dots but hey ho it's not Nielson) so I guess you will have the same journey but in the opposite direction......

Do enjoy it, it's so lovely to be able to make eye contact with other musicians/audience.

[dorfmouse]

welcome to the gang! Did it feel as though you were using a different part of your brain?

I've found I have a very different perception of the passing of time. I've fairly recently, at horrendously advancing age, learnt how to memorise, though it is still a long drawn out process. I've noticed in the small number of pieces that I have managed from memory, that it's almost like being in a timeless dimension, you get in a zone and suddenly it's over. I find the expression sometimes takes on a life of its own in this state, but it doesn't bother me.
In my more usual stare-at-the-music-like-a-frightened-rabbit mode I'm aware of every note and every little uncertainty, it all seems to take much longer and my brain is in it's critical mode .....
From memory is definitely a nicer, more wholistic experience when it happens.

[JamesK]

Depends on the piece. when I'm not struggling,
a Dance: I look out to a space between the audience and piano (an empty sapce: Wall), to see a pair waltzing for example
A heroic piece such as a march is obviously a march.
If the piece is patriotic: the audience standing and singing

PIANO

When I'm looking at my fingers: watching them 'dance' on the piano. I watch the keys getting pressed down as my finger do at the same time. It's amazing - you are doing that, not the instrument!

HORN

Eyes closed and picturing the music in my head.

In GENERAL

I 'watch' myself play live at that moment in time from the eyes of the audience (Think of an Out-of-Body-Experience). This is an annoying trait when I'm alone since it forces me to check my back and around me. Or I picture other soloists perform that piece/ passage.

*This post sounds weird because it is very hard to put into words.

[lingle]

*This post sounds weird because it is very hard to put into words.
[/quote]


not weird but very interesting!

interesting that you do different things with different instruments.

I like what you do with the walzes, etc. It's like you're shifting the focus away from yourself.

[BadStrad]

I play the violin, but I have also learned to play odds and ends on the piano (Moonlight Sonata anyone) and for me the memorising aspect is the same. I just play along to the sounds in my head. I think some people refer to it as muscle memory, but I tend to think of it as an association between the sound in my head and what my hands are doing is an automatic response to that. Kind of like when you speak. You don't think "Oh I have to adjust my vocal chords like this and move my lips and tongue like that and now I can say the word DOG." You just think DOG and the word comes out - the muscles involved create the shapes needed automatically, as a result of the association between the word/thought and the positioning being built up over hours of learning to speak.

So generally when I play from memory I am just playing along to the soundtrack in my head. Much the same when I improvise. Sometimes I think of the score, or sometimes a particular pattern of fingers rising and falling on the strings will pass through my consciousness, but then it's just an image associated with the sounds, not really a distraction.

As others have mentioned there is a sense of using another part of my brain - but that's only because I'm still a learner and the process is not yet as automatic as saying DOG, but then that took some while to learn to do too. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[linda.ff]

So generally when I play from memory I am just playing along to the soundtrack in my head. Much the same when I improvise. Sometimes I think of the score, or sometimes a particular pattern of fingers rising and falling on the strings will pass through my consciousness, but then it's just an image associated with the sounds, not really a distraction.

I'd say it was very much like that for me when singing or conducting or playing any "melody" instrument, but I find it that much harder on the piano because there are too many possibiities of texture. I need to remember whether this is a place where the LH is in octaves, or whether the undulating inner part is in the RH or the LH at this moment. I can memoprise whole operas, but find a sonata movement on piano, or even the accompaniment to a song, much harder.

But then, I've rarely been called upon to do it, so I don't know how I wold get on if I had to make an effort over the sections I'm not sure of.

[BadStrad]

I find it that much harder on the piano because there are too many possibiities of texture.

But then, I've rarely been called upon to do it, so I don't know how I would get on if I had to make an effort over the sections I'm not sure of.

I suspect the only reason I was able to memorise the Moonlight (first movement) was that I couldn't sight read it in the bass clef and certainly couldn't read it at playing tempo. So I learned it pretty much bar by bar. I was having lessons with a friend who agreed to help me work on that as long as I also worked on the basic stuff. So the end of each lesson was a chunk of the Moonlight. Luckily for me I have huge hands so all those octaves sat easily under my hands. That was more than ten years ago and I can still play huge chunks of it from memory. It's odd - I'm not really renowned for my feats of memory - usually I'm a list maker.

[steinberger]

I find it that much harder on the piano because there are too many possibiities of texture.

But then, I've rarely been called upon to do it, so I don't know how I would get on if I had to make an effort over the sections I'm not sure of.

I suspect the only reason I was able to memorise the Moonlight (first movement) was that I couldn't sight read it in the bass clef and certainly couldn't read it at playing tempo. So I learned it pretty much bar by bar. I was having lessons with a friend who agreed to help me work on that as long as I also worked on the basic stuff. So the end of each lesson was a chunk of the Moonlight. Luckily for me I have huge hands so all those octaves sat easily under my hands. That was more than ten years ago and I can still play huge chunks of it from memory. It's odd - I'm not really renowned for my feats of memory - usually I'm a list maker.

I memorise all my piano exam pieces because as an adult learner, I cant read fluently. One of my grade 8 pieces, Rondo, by Beethoven, is seven pages long, so after learning each small section (perhaps 8 bars) at a time first the right then the left hand with correct fingering, i combined both hands together and then go onto dynamics etc. The smaller sections eventually give way to larger sections or 4 chunks in the Rondo example. So After nearly two years of practising, instead of memorising 210 bars, i memorise just 4 chunks.

[flobiano]

I'm really not sure how much I memorise and how much I read. I think the music becomes more of an aide memoire rather than something I read, except for key points.

I was thinking about this as I was trying to memorise something on the oboe (though ended up running out of time). I think I need to be able to do a mixture of building muscle memory, beign able to sing it through in my head so that I know how it goes, and then consciously learning certain key points or chunks.

I think when I play the music provides the "key points, which chunk comes next" part of memorising and within each part the muscle memory takes over.

It hink the mind is a very strange thing though. One of the pieces I learned to play on the piano over 20 years ago was Doctor Gradus Ad parnassum from Children's corner suite. I could not play a note of it without having the music on the piano music stand....but when I play it ,especially for the last page, I don't actually look at the music or read the notes. It's as if having the prop there allows me to access the muscle memory that has built up and without the trigger I can't access it. Very odd.