Deleted

Some people have found that forum concerts can help.....

You are not alone. Even experienced professionals still suffer from nerves. I don't know of anyone who has tried hypnotherapy, but like all natural remedies, it will work for some and not for others. I would think you need to "believe" in hypnosis to start with - I know for certain I'd be impossible to hypnotise because I'm very strong willed and wouldn't be open to the mental influence of others.

Some people suggest that eating a banana can help calm nerves, but I did a bit of research on exactly what's in a banana. There's lots of potassium which is very good for pepping up the energy reserves, but no calming ingredient in them whatsoever, so again, it's most likely to be a mental thing - if you believe something calms you down, it often will.

Failing all else, and for the real knee-knocking shakes, there's always beta-blockers...and a surprisingly large number of musicians, both amateur and professional, use them when they've got to play a solo piece. If you finally feel the only answer is a drug that artificially lowers the blood-pressure and heart rate on demand, then you'll need to consult your doctor and explain things. One tablet about an hour before you play is enough to stop the gut-wrenching feeling and sweaty palms. Despite the bad repute some people would give beta-blockers, when used on a 'only when absolutely required' basis, they are not habit-forming and will do you no long term harm.

Hi Iona,

I tried hypnotherapy a few years ago, not for stage fright, but for fear of flying. It really helped calm me down a bit (but I was still very nervous), but after that what really helped was just doing a lot of flying, so it was a good start but not a complete cure. I would still recommend it for anyone suffering any kind of nervous problem.

Alison

Thanks everyone. I suppose I ought to clarify a little.

I have tried various strategies over the last few years.I've tried the banana thing, sitting quietly on my own beforehand, taking time out to meditate as best I can, all the usual calming things. I am aware of beta blockers and know of people who take them, but thought I'd like to leave that as a last resort. Hence - hypnotherapy. I've made myself play for people, (I've had performance assessments at Uni) and instead of improving I've actually got worse. There's no explaining it. It's completely irrational. (In fact I used to be a performer in a different field, and although I would get nervous, the adrenaline rush was a good thing). This is a completely different experience, and I panic so much I have a difficult time not fainting. This is me now trying to get to to grips seriously with the situation before it gets so far out of control that I have to give up.

My thought is that hypnotherapy will only leave my pocket a little lighter if it doesn't help. meds I think really must be a last resort. The thing is, I think the time for that last resort may be fast approaching
-Iona

I had a friend at university, who had used self-hypnosis to help manage insomnia caused by being a teenager; he could also hypnotise people, and hypnotised me before a pass-fail oral exam. The experience was very interesting - I dislike "car-crash TV", so haven't watched stage hypnotists at work on telly, and would never consider going to a show; this means I can't compare my experience with what goes on elsewhere.
I felt more than usually alert, but utterly relaxed, and oddly enough, in control. The weirdest experience was of being told that my arm was unbelievably strong - and sure enough, the hypnotist was unable to move it for me - I was aware of his effort to do so, but did not feel I was making any to keep it where it was. I never felt that he could have made a twit of me doing silly capers - I'm not the sort of person to find that funny, as I prefer to make an idiot of myself on my own terms. Afterwards, I was relaxed, and the next day, the oral exam was fine. Having said that, I can't tell if it'd have been fine anyway, nor can I be sure that the hypnosis really worked- I also don't know if my experience is typical or not. I'd be very chary of the sort of stage hypnotists you see headlines about - but if you can find a recognised practitioner (there are GPs who can do this, for instance), then, if all else doesn't work...it may help. Someone who could teach you self-hypnosis would be best - not a course of tapes, a person. Don't get ripped off.
By the way - my friend also let me have a go at hypnotising him! That was funny, because I was so nervous about trying it, then relaxed, and he grinned, because my voice had gone "right", which just made me tense up again! Not a great success.

Don't rule out asking the doctor about beta-blockers. I doesn't mean you're a druggie and it doesn't mean you're artificially enhancing your performance. Some people just experience a more physical reaction to nerves that others, and maybe you're one of them - for me beta-blockers were a God-send at one time, as I was having what could only be decsribed as panic attacks in relation to playing in public. They don't actually make you feel any different; they just keep a lid on the adrenalin levels that cause those symptoms you described. Once you've done it a few times, the self-perpetuating spiral is broken, and you'll probably find you won't need them any more! They are not addictive in this situation; I actually found them to be a long-term cure.

I knew a very experienced choral singer who tried hypnotherapy to get herself through an audition. She had no problem singing in front of several hundred people, but the idea of singing in front of just one was horrifying. The hypnotherapy allowed her to visualise several hundred people who weren't actually there, but it still didn't work and she failed the audition.

Didn't mean to rain on the parade there, but that's all I know about hypnotherapy and music.

If it's a panic thing, it might help to know that slow, deep breathing makes it physically impossible to panic, in the same way that lying down on a boat makes it physically impossible to be seasick (I used to be prone to seasickness but it has never been a problem since a doctor friend gave me that useful bit of information).

Another friend - a hypnotherapist this time - recently explained how those stage shows work. The people who act like chickens or whatever are the ones who are happy to make fools of themselves in public anyway. The preamble with the audience before anyone goes on the stage is designed to show the hypnotist who would be prepared to do that - the ones who wouldn't ("You can't unfold your arms!" "Of course I can - look") don't get through that process.

Hypnosis is not a cure in itself - but a medium through which 'therapy' such as cognitive behavioural therapy can be made more effective. Paradoxically, people with good intelligence and a fair imagination can be hypnotised readily - like getting absorbed in a good film. Still, it's not for everyone, obsessive compulsives and very 'analytical' people often have difficulty. Only reason I know this is I'm doing a diploma in clinical hypnosis at UCL - and although music performance is somewhat outside my remit - I have done hypnosis for exam performance before. If at the very least, it helps you relax, then that can be no harm.
If you are interested, then pm me and I'll send you a link to an mp3 recording of the music performance hypnosis. I would appreciate some feedback if nothing else.

HVL

Good morning Heitor. I thought Stravinsky was very unfair about you and I hope you didn't take it personally

I'm not sure if this story will help, but for what it's worth:

I had to go to the dentist today for an extraction, which I knew was going to be particularly difficult, so as you can imagine I was not very relaxed.... However, I was lying in the chair and the dentist was just prepping up, when Solveig's Song came on the radio. I found myself tapping the beat with my finger and I was really enjoying the music and didn't want to miss it when the dentist came to start. So I asked him to turn it up a bit, and then I made a conscious decision that instead of paying attention to what the dentist was doing, I would focus completely on the music, so I asked him not to talk to me this time about what he was doing.

And it really worked Instead of being a nervous wreck, virtually clenching my fingers to the bone, my hands were completely relaxed as I beat time to the music. When the drilling got a bit too loud for me to hear the music, I switched from "listen" mode to "play" mode and started playing one of my G3 pieces in my head. I had to start humming it in order to concentrate, but I thought, well why not - at least the dentist has got a nice relaxed patient here So there I was, humming away and beating time to my G3 piece and concentrating on the dynamics, happy as a lark, while there's all sorts of mayhem going on in my mouth

Anyway, the moral of this story takes me back to something which cropped up in a recent thread started by Sarah-flute:

Nerves, Acting, Feeling/appearing Confident

Sarah-flute talks about getting "lost in the music" and going into a zen-like trance of being completely absorbed. I connected with that concept at the time and described it as putting the music first instead of yourself and your nerves.

It's all about focussing on something else other than what's happening to you personally. So in my case it was the music I was concentrating on to take my mind off my dental treatment, and similarly in the case of Sarah-flute's performance confidence, it was a matter of realising that the music is more important than yourself.

So I'm not sure if any of this is of any help, but if I can do it at the dentist for an extraction, it must be worth trying for a music performance!

Incidentally the dentist had heard me humming my piece even though I was trying to do it very quietly, but fortunately he played the trumpet before family commitments took over so he quite understood And it turned out that Solveig's Song was one of his favourite pieces to play

That was a really thoughtful post....I missed Sarah's post about putting the music above one's self and am glad you brought it up.

I've just read through the thread again and discovered this quote from CJB:

"... the only thing I've found that helps me in this is being with someone who is more nervous than I am. I concentrate my energy into reassuring them and forget to be nervous for myself."

It reinforces what I said above about concentrating on something other than yourself. It obviously works! I also noticed how many people said at the time what an interesting thread it was - well worth reading again.

I've always suffered terribly with performance nerves - getting the runs and nausea, and alternating between getting the shakes, and stiffening up. Not ideal for a pianist! I tried all kinds of things, and in the end before my final recital at Uni, I went to the doctor and he prescribed me a beta blocker. I wasn't thrilled about taking medication, but I'd worked so hard for my recital, I didn't want to self destruct and ruin it. To be honest, I believe it worked really well. I didn't notice anything after taking it, but the recital went well. It seemed to prevent that last minute hysteria where your heart is beating so fast and so loud you think it's going to pop out of your body. It also meant that I didn't start at 3x the tempo!

I do believe that you only should take them as a last resort - but if nothing else works, and your nerves can completely ruin your performance, the only other option is not to perform - and that often ISN'T an option!

Deleted

Just as an aside - the beta-blockers that the doctor prescribed for me, are also prescribed for migraine!

What you're getting when you suffer these sympoms is a fight or flight type reaction. This is great in a survival situation, as the extra adrenalin is needed for an instinctive reponse, but can be disastrous when what you actually need to do is calm down and concentrate on subtleties and technicalities. If you imagine a graph with adrenalin on the x axis, and performance on the y axis, the curve will reach a peak at a certain level of adrenalin, after which it rapidly dips. Beta-blockers will simply ensure that you don't get so far past this peak that you start experiencing the physical panic symptoms that you describe. Don't think of them as an absolute last resort; as long as your doctor is happy to prescribe them for you (there are contra-indications for asthmatics, for example) they are wonderful - a lot less hassle than hypnotherapy, and a lot less expensive! I still have some in the cupboard from the time when I was exactly like you, but have not felt the need to use them for some time now, as they actually showed me that there is no reason why I can't do in public what I can do in private. I have said this before in a response to another thread some time ago, but I'm saying it again in case you didn't read it! I whittled (sp?) myself down to half a 10mg tablet per performance or church service, and first attempted to do it without any when my chemist friend told me that the effect of this amount would be totally negligible. It had done its job when I was taking two tablets, and I was by that stage unknowingly managing without.

Isn't it frustrating though. I really hoped I'd grow out of it - I didn't. I've tried all the non-medicated suggestions, and they just don't work for me. I've read every book on managing performance stress as well.

I did read that Horowitz's wife used to have to push him out onto the stage to perform, because he suffered so badly from nerves. I don't know if that makes me feel better (that someone of that level suffered) or worse (that performing regularly is NOT going to necessarily help!).

If I have two performances close to each other, the second is usually good! It's probably because I'm kicking myself for the first and adopt the attitude that things can only get better - and also because other people are much less critical than one's self; I'm often pleasntly surprised when something goes down well that I felt was well under power due to nerves. So if something important is coming up, it's a good idea to try to press-gang a preliminary audience for yourself, even if it's only in your own house. It's also a good way to test-drive the effects of hypnotherapy/beta-blockers/whatever.

Same here. The more solos I had to perform - especially at music college exam recitals - the worse my nerves would affect me. In the end the frustration it caused was too much to bear. I'd come out of the room thinking what a twit I was to have been so wound up. I knew the works I was playing inside out and yet having to stand in front of three examiners reduced me to a quivering lump of jelly who struggled to hold the bow let alone play the notes. I had to resort to bete-blockers in the end and will still use them if I've been summond to dep in a chamber work. As far as solos are concerned, I avoid such events like the plague. Only a very large cheque would persuade me to do otherwise...and I'd probably need an entire box of beta-blockers to get me through it

Don't know about anyone else who's written on this thread, but I find it more intimidating to play in front of other musicians, especially if they are string players of top-notch soloist quality!

What - because I ripped off his music? It's all derivative you know - besides, I know where he lives!

Oh dear... it all seems a bit mad...

I think it's been good for my nerves singing with a barbershop chorus, having compteted in front of 2000 people. At the time I could hide behind fifty odd other men, and so I got used to the experience.

Basically, it comes down, as all my singing posts seem to do, to sing barbershop...

I believe bananas contain tryptophan which is converted into serotonin. This gives a relaxing effect. They also contain B-complex vitamins which are said to calm the nervous system. Try extending your research by typing "calming bananas" or "banana nerves" into Google

Regarding your comments on Hypnosis, this is something of a myth. It is not about the strength of your will, rather factors such as your strength of imagination come into play. I've used it to lower my own general stress levels (for example) and found that it worked a treat. In fact when I first started using it I stopped biting my nails more or less overnight, after countless years of trying.

Although I've never really suffered too badly from stage-fright, I had a self-hypnosis session before going on stage not too long ago and was staggered by my own level of calmness. My absence of nerves was commented on by members of the audience.

I'd urge anyone who suffers from stage-fright to try it.

I know how you feel about being nervous before a performance, because I get nervous as well. I shake after as well which I dont understand.

What helps me is being reassured by friends, family and teachers... I know that they want me to do my best and that is what I try.

I have a performance coming up which I dont want to do for various reasons, but I hope you do well with yours

I guess the thing to do here is to echo the previous posts and let you know that "everybody feels nervous" - apparently!


I can also tell you, however, that gong baths are supposed to be very helpful!

Gong baths??????