Just got enough of the syllabus music to start level one. I have a lesson scheduled for tomorrow evening.

I'm looking forward to getting rid of what I am sure are years of incorrect technique and moving through the levels.

Still don't know where I'm going to take the tests as there doesn't seem to be any here in Nevada (U.S.)

Wondering how others are doing working through the guitar syllabus.

Jonathan

Hello Johnathan, hello and welcome I see you are relatively new here..

I see from your signature you have some ABRSM exams or grades as we refer to them..its slightly different to how you in the USA refer to grades as in school years.. I have an American friend an Oboist who is completely thrown by the concept of graded music exams..

I am sure that the ABRSM has graded Guitar exams and there must be an examination center nearby you in Nevada..you can research it here in the ABRSM Exams section heading at the top of the page..

Good luck I hope we hear more of what you are doing and how things are going along

Andrew

Here you go..if you click this link you can scroll down to North America..see whats nearest to you..

http://www.abrsm.org/exams/regs/internatio...l#america:north

Andrew

Yes I am familiar with the guitar syllabus. I was just wondering if there was anyone else out there taking the guitar grades. If there isn't an exam in Nevada there is one in California (just a four hour drive) so I'm not in too bad shape.

Only four hours.... A mere hop skip and a jump then..Sheesh thats a long way I presume you would stay overnight..

Hopefully somebody else will be taking the guitar journey here as well and you can share the experience..

Andrew

I did grade 2 ABRSM Classical Guitar a couple of years ago. I've since switched exam boards to LCM as I like the way I can get all the music in one book. I'm not sure if LCM is available in the US.

The best forum for classical guitarists is http://www.delcamp.us/index
You can get a few thousand sheets of free music there too.

HMMM...A four hour drive out of town seems somewhat normal to me. That part of California is nice so I might stay over night and take in a show (you'd be surprised how much live theater there is in Los Angeles)

LCM doesn't seem to be in the U.S. the commute to Thailand would be even longer.

I agree that getting all the guitar music in one book would be nice. Just to get enough of the music to cover the three pieces was expensive.

Alicia, what was your experience with the exam? Did you feel like getting ready for the exam made you a better player?

I think if I was new to music I'd have got a lot more out of it. I've done shed-loads of music exams already and so it was more a test of performance skills.

I found the logistics of getting myself and the guitar and the music and the footrest into the exam room was the hardest part. Then the chair provided was at the wrong height for me (it was way too high) and had arms. I've since been told (by my teacher) that I need to take my own folding chair or small stool and get a little trolley to put everything in.

I didn't enter the exam until I was good enough to pass and then it was ages and ages playing the same three pieces and practicing those scales. Since the scales and arpeggios can be played in lots of different positions on the guitar I practiced all the alternatives too. And then in the exam I dithered about trying to decide which one to do.

Since I have no problem with sightreading or aural tests I'm not sure the AB graded exam is good value to me. In the future I'll be looking at either the ABRSM Performance Assessment or the LCM "Leisure Play" exam (but only if they change it's name as it's cringing). Both these options give the chance for examiner feedback on performance without the sightreading/aural tests/musical knowledge or scales.

What's really valuable though is the chance to actually perfect the pieces.

Hi Jonathan,

Welcome to the Forum.

I did the ABRSM graes a few years ago. I started at Grade 5 and went all the way through to Grade 8 in 2 years.

It was all rather intense, but extremely worthwhile. Each exam was a stepping stone to the next and at each level my playinmg and technique developed.

Obviously you don't just stop at Grade 8, but it's lovely now playing the pieces I really want to play, rather than have them dictated to me by the syllabus. I also now have the confidence to attempt pieces that I simply would have not been able to play before.

I was fortunate to have a fantastic teacher - and I still have weekly lessons.

So good for you - enjoy your journey - I'm still enjoying mine!

Kind Regards,

Nigel

Hi Jonathan, welcome. I assume from your e-mail you already play the guitar, so not sure what grade you would start at.

Rather like Nigel, I started with grade 5, and did grades 6 and 7 later within that 12-month period. Having been self-taught as a teenager, on a steel-string, I converted to classical and found myself a teacher to help with this. Was preparing for grade 8, but thanks to a broken left wrist, it probably won't be this year now.

Although the ABRSM exams weren't new to me (as I once played the clarinet), I found the exam experience really valuable. It forces you to perfect your pieces, whereas it's all too easy to fool yourself that you can play something when you really can't! I don't know whether you are self-taught or have a teacher, but I think I would find it hard to progress beyond an intermediate standard without one.

There aren't many guitarists on this forum, so it's good to hear from you, and please let us know how you get on.

Well I have been learning now for 5 days, and I love it. But don't know if I will take any grade exams.

It is nice to play such a simple instrument (compared with the mechanical complexity of a piano). There seem to be more components in the action of a single note on the piano than in a whole guitar.

JME - That's exactly how I started, self taught as a teenager - and I guess thousands of others too!!!

Sorry to hear about your broken wrist. I would have thought that playing the guitar would be good therapy as long as you don't overdo it.

I completely endorse your suggestion regarding a teacher. I know I wouldn't have progreseed as far as I did without mine.

Kind Regards,

Nigel



Hi Tom,

Glad you are enjoying the guitar.

You make an interesting point - I love the intimacy of the guitar and the way that just your fingers can change the whole sound. I also love feeling the guitar's reverberations as I play.

The Bill Evans piece "Waltz for Debby" I mentioned a while ago is coming along really well - I'm still completely obsessed by it, even though Ralph Towner's arrangement for guitar is a tad difficult!

Keep Pickin' and a Grinnin' !!!!

Nigel

Well just over a week and already I have a quandary.

I have been comparing different ways of plucking the strings, and the sound made when they are plucked with the nails (as they are meant to be) is so much more beautiful than when you use the finger tips (which is what I have been doing).

I tried some of those individual picks that fit over the ends of the fingers, but they feel all wrong compared to using the nails.

So my problem is, can I grow my nails log enough to pluck guitar strings properly, yet leave them short enough that they don't interfere with my piano playing?

Or is there some other solution?

Hmm let's see-
Guitar -
Decide which string to play the note on.
Fret the string.
Pluck (the correct) string with other hand.

Piano-
Press key.

Yes. Just about. It's a compromise but I find that about half a millimeter of nail is enough to get the guitar sound and not too loud a clack on the piano key. It's only three nails on one hand. The thumb can be quite a bit longer, and you don't need a pinkie nail unless you're going to play Flamenco.

All this guitar talk is making me want to go and brush mine off and get started again!

Another self-taught teenager, I was more or less welded to my guitar from the age of 16 when I started to play to mid 20s when life caught up and unfortunately it was one of those things I no longer found time for.

I have lots of guitar music, including a wonderful book "Classical Guitar Serenade"* which contains easy classical arrangements of cheesy 70s pop songs ("How deep is your love", anyone? ) and old standards (Moon river, etc). I used to play them in an Italian restaurant every Friday as a student - earnt 3 quid and a free meal for doing it! Happy memories...

Keep it up Mad Tom, it's a lovely instrument and very rewarding to play.


*That particular book was one of a set of 3 and as penniless students, 3 of us bought one each and borrowed each others'. Unfortunately they are now long out of print but if anybody ever sees a copy of "Classical Guitar Romance" or "Classical Guitar Sentimental" anywhere do let me know - it was a formative part of my experience and I'd love to complete the set!

I think MT was talking about the inner workings of the piano vs. the guitar, not the complexity of playing it. When you pluck a string on the guitar, you get sound and it's fairly obvious where it comes from. When you press a key on the piano, lots of mysterious stuff happens inside the piano and sound comes out almost magically

Mad Tom. Playing with the fingertips (as opposed to nails) is sometimes known as no nail playing. It has historical precedence, as many of the great 19th century Guitar composers such as Sor played without nails. It is not the normal method for modern Classical Guitarists. Having said that, there are a healthy minority of Guitar players who use finger tips, many who take their technique from Lute or early Guitar. Do a search on Youtube for 'Rob Mackillop', he plays Sor on a copy of a Panormo Guitar. He also has a video where he plays a very nice Antonio Lauro piece. I would find it difficult to understand anyone who doesn't like the tone that he gets from his no nail playing. Rob is just one, there are many others.

I cut my nails really short Tuesday last week for Chets. Today they are just about long enough to play Guitar how I am used to playing ie with nails. They are not as long as they usually are but still workable. So, in answer to your question - if you are going to give a Piano recital you will probably need to cut them short, if you are going to give a Guitar recital you may need to grow them a little longer but for everyday piano/guitar you will find a compromise. Otherwise, keep them short and play without nails but for me that would be impossible - I would rather not play the Guitar.

Fired up with enthusiasm after reading this thread I got the guitar out yesterday and had a go. Then another one today.

The good news: my ability to read music is light years ahead of how it was when I was regularly playing. And I can even remember a few (admittedly very simple) old favourites - including some I don't have the music for.

The bad: unsurprisingly after more than 20 years without touching the guitar, "rusty" doesn't even begin to describe it. "Better than somebody who's never picked up a guitar before" is about as good as it gets.

The frustrating: Ouch! I had forgotten how little time you can actually spend playing when your fingers are all soft.

To the guitar experts out there: is there a fast way to toughen up fingers, apart from just playing for 10 minutes a day or until they hurt?

What do you mean by 'toughen up fingers'? The finger tips or the actual fingers themselves?

The tips. I can put up with the occasional clunking noise as my muscles regain their strength to hold down the strings properly but my finger pads are so sore that I can't play for more than a few minutes
I don't remember this being such a problem when I learnt as a teenager. Either I have blanked the memories out or I was less of a wimp in those days!

Fretting fingertips turning to pulp? I had that for the first few months. Lots of nerve endings there too.

Getting through it was a combination of endurance, and learning that the strings need to be pressed just enough to get a clear sound and any extra pressure is just causing damage. I found some scales practice where I concentrated on how lightly I could fret to be a useful exercise.

Thanks! You're right - I've been pressing too hard. The biggest problem is actually unrealistic expectations - I can remember when I could play for a couple of hours without feeling it, and have to keep reminding myself that I can't do that just now!

I think it is actually harder to return to something you used to be competent at than to start something new. I'm getting really frustrated that I can't just whizz through grade 5 repertoire that I used to rattle off with no problems. But if I were to take up something like the flute or violin, which I've never played, I suspect I'd be quite happy just to concentrate on making a sound, and be happy with every new milestone.

One last, unrelated question: I am left handed but always played right-handed (the "normal" way). This was never a problem - I've got a lot more strength and coordination in the left hand and at least in the early stages, this is a positive feature for making chord patterns.

BUT: I have heard it said that it is better for a left-hander to restring and play the instrument left handed, since the actual music (ie the plucked note) is then produced with the preferred hand, leading to greater musicality.

I do admit that I always found it difficult to get a good technique with the right hand and tended towards the school of "use thumb and index finger as much as humanly possible, only engaging the other fingers where absolutely necessary", much to my teacher's despair.

So the question is: do other quitarists agree? Should a left-hander play left-handed to maximise their eventual potential? And if so, given that I have lost 90% of my playing ability, is now a good moment to start the other way up (losing about 10 years of deeply buried muscle memory and experience in the process, making my guitar unplayable to anybody else, but potentially gaining in the long run)?

There's lots about that question heree - http://www.delcamp.us/search.php?keywords=...p;submit=Search

In fact the whole forum is really where you need to be for CG talk.

That is such a difficult question to answer. More than likely that there is no 'right' answer or perhaps there is but it might take years of trying each one to find out. Life is probably too short anyway.
If at one time you could whizz through Grade 5 pieces then your plucking fingers must have been half decent, plenty of right hand arpeggio studies at Grade 5.
I'm quite sure there are many lefties who play Guitar Right handed, probably because they only had access to a Guitar strung that way. Pretty sure it's the same with Violinists, left handed Violinists are pretty rare.

Thank you both for your replies

@Alicia Ocean: I'm going to have to register for that site to see the search results, but it looks like a really good site so thanks for pointing it out!

@michael N: I used to be an expert at picking all the pieces that didn't have too many arpeggios!

But having done a few experiments (short of actually restringing the guitar, but turning it upside down and playing as if it were, ignoring the weird harmonies that came out) I think I'll stick with it as it is for the moment but this time round, really work on that right hand. It would need a lot of work anyway, to get it to work as a fretting hand, so I may as well take advantage of the fact that I don't need to retrain the left at the same time.