Hello: Just wanted to ask.....

For your diploma exams, were the copies of music supplied for the examiners beautiful, clean unused copies? Or well loved, written on ones? I've always bought lovely new crisp copies, but the budget is a little stretched this time. Do you think it makes a better impression with nice clean copies? or no difference?

Also re editions: Bach sonatas. For research purposes, I have several different editions of the same piece. Does it really matter if I hand over a different edition to the examiner than the one I'm using? (not vastly different, I'm thinking editors articulation marks, rather than urtext).

Thanks in advance for your help and advice.

I provided clean photocopies of most of my pieces as I didn't want to double up on buying extra books, nor did I want to a few bars where I had written on the notes or counting. However, I did provide a copy of Bach Partitas and made sure it was the same edition as one copy I had that was a different edition had totally different directions to the ones that I was doing.

I think clean photocopies of the actual editions you are using are in order. The ABRSM insist on publisher permission being granted for such copying and you should bring the permissions to the exam with you for possible inspection. Other boards are more relaxed about it...

I had almost all of my programme memorized the first time and all of it memorized for the retake, so it wasn't much of an issue, but the first time I borrowed an extra score (different edition) from my teacher for the piece I was playing from music. You may want to ask your teacher/musical friends whether they have copies of the works you are playing that you can borrow on the day, or maybe get them from the library if you have access.

I'd like at this point to say thank you to forumites Deborah and CJB, who provided examiner copies from their collection for me.

When my son did his diploma he borrowed copies of his pieces from his teacher and another of her students. I imagine they did have things pencilled in, but they were the same editions as the ones he played. If you can, I think it's best to avoid giving the examiner a different edition from the one you're using, as it could cause confusion.

That's what I did. The photocopies were accompanied by print-outs of emails from the publishers giving specific permission to publish for that named exam on that date, with instructions to destroy the photocopies afterwards (which detail the ABRSM and/or steward undertook on my behalf). I highlighted the relevant sentences with highlighter pen (pink, I think). If I remember rightly, most of them insisted on the words "reproduced by kind permission of . . . " being printed on the front of each photocopy. (Quick check back in the emails . . . yup, that was it) .

The person after me had 2 original copies of the books with the music in - I assume borrowed for the purpose.

Good luck

Has anyone given the examiners a print out from the IMSLP which contains out of copyright editions?

This would be the easiest/cheapest way to provide copies of anything a bit older. I'm thinking that although this doesn't breach any copyright the examiners might not be hugely impressed.

Photocopies//permission wouldn't be a problem to produce: I'm not in the UK and work for a music institution. We can photocopy for persona/educational use, as long as each page has a certain sticker (they are expensive to buy!) I guess my question is, should I buy a lovely new copy for the examiner?

Ooh, mentioned in dispatches

When I did mine I had two copies of two of the pieces in any case, and borrowed a copy of the third from a pupil. I gave the examiners the piano part rather than the solo part, so there were significantly fewer scribbles against the line on which I was being assessed.

What you give the examiners is supposed to be a copy of what you're playing, not a near-approximation by a different editor, so if you give them an out-of-copyright edition you should be:
a) playing the out-of-copyright edition and
b) prepared to justify your choice of edition in the viva (an answer worth preparing anyway regardless of which edition you're using) .

Do NOT assume that all editions are the same - they can vary enormously.

The easiest approach is simply to copy the edition that you are going to use in the exam, and get any necessary permissions from the publisher. Using different editions is risky; buying new copies for the purpose seems an unnecessary expense.

If you're providing copies of an accompanied piece, do you give the examiners a copy of the solo instrument's part or the accompanist's part?

Do you do different things for different boards? I've read 2 syllabuses and not found the answer to this in either.

I would assume the accompanist's score considering that it contains the solo line anyway...

I would have thought the accompanist's score so that they have the whole picture.

Thanks ansatz and sbhoa. Something I've been curious about for a while.

I only gave the violin music and there has never been any complaint/feedback that this wasn't sufficient.
I would hope they'd know all the stuff on the syllabus pretty well anyway!

At diploma level, for every instrument, not necessarily. There is the minefield of different editions, for starters.

If they are a specialist in the instrument, as Trinity aims for, then they really ought to know the repertoire - the violin repertoire on the syllabus isn't exactly huge, anyway (unfortunately!), and items played from off-sylllabus have to be agreed in advance.

As for different editions, the differences surely couldn't be so huge that they wouldn't know the piece and the solo line would certainly show any editorial marks that might make a difference to the performance.

Perhaps I'm just being tight-fisted, but as I don't think there's anything that says it has to be the complete score I'd be reluctant to spend money on that if I didn't have to.

But presumably there would need to be a complete score for the accompanist anyway... Would the accompanist not be allowed to play from photocopies? But even if not, it shouldn't be hard to find a complete score in a library or to borrow it from a teacher/friend. And most repertoire on the syllabus is in the public domain anyway, so IMSLP can usually help...

Certainly not "most"

It really depends on what it is. A lot of the viola repertoire is music that was written for other instruments. Some transcriptions can be quite different - an octave up/down here, and a few notes missed out there, which can be very different from one edition to another. Generally recognisable, but sometimes the differences can really take you by surprise.

Also, I have seen a very odd edition of Harold In Italy of all things, which (if I remember rightly) was so very different from the recommended edition for Grade 8 that it is not allowed for use in the exam. I'm not sure if this was something to do with the reduction from viola & orchestra to viola & piano, or what. Very odd.

The syllabi for different instruments have different time range distributions, so for some instruments this may not be true - I was thinking in terms of piano/violin, where most standard repertoire doesn't go later than the early 20th century, but now that I think of it this wouldn't work for viola. But I would imagine the "average" (based on the tastes and expectations of most students) piano or violin Dip/L programme is likely to contain maybe one piece in four that can't be found on IMSLP.

I often think that if you can afford the fee for a Dip, you can afford not to be too tight on the sheet music front.

I don't think that being reluctant to fork out for two copies of everything is being tight.

Just had a quick look on the central library in Manc and sadly beause it's closed until 2013 it seems all the sheet music is unavailable for now. Boo.

Even if you can afford the music it seems a little wasteful to purchase extra copies unless you're likely to have a future need, though I suppose you could do someone else a favour in the future.

It's temporarily homed at the City library

I was replying to the need for providing the accompaniment score as well as the solo part alone.

Obviously noone would use an unreliable edition for an exam, particularly as it says (somewhere!) in the regulations that it must be a reliable edition. As for different transcriptions etc - all that would be on the solo part provided.

I can see both points of view here. Compared with the entry fee, an extra few pounds for additional copies isn't much, but it's adding to the cost of an already expensive exam. Far cheaper to borrow additional copies (from pupils, teachers, friends, fellow Forum funsters, libraries - including inter-library loans), but obtaining publisher approval to photocopy is one option if finances are tight and no loan or free legal download copies are available, as is buying second-hand (perhaps from a well-known internet auction site ) or even selling the redundant copies on afterwards.

I wrote to the publishers to ask for permission to photocopy the music - all were very prompt and even wished me luck for the exam! Newer music isn't available on IMSLP either. A friend recently did one of the dips and I was able to lend her a clean copy of one of her pieces, but that's not always an option.

As to the cost, I'm afraid some of us have had to save quite hard to afford to take the dip exams in the first place and the prospect of paying out another ?20 -30 to provide the examiner with a new copy of the music we're playing. Selling on afterwards isn't always that easy either and I really wouldn't want the hassle. Borrowing from libraries is a good idea if you live near one (which I don't, being in the sticks!).

So, photocopies it has been for me.