I'm curious to find out what do other violin students learn during their very first lesson?
I've only learnt the position of holding violin, bow, start the bow and to play the A string only!! It's only a 30 min lesson though...

For a half hour complete beginner lesson it was plenty. Ensuring that you get a good firm foundation in the basics - and that includes holding the instrument and bow correctly - is an excellent footing to start on.

Apart from anything else, your left arm and shoulder needs time to build strength and stamina in order to play. A tired arm and shoulder encourages bad posture, along with the classic "frying-pan hold" on the violin neck. A tired or stiff right arm creates a sawing action with the bow.

You will soon be learning about changing the height of your right arm in order to play on the other strings and this will possibly form part of your next lesson.

Be patient!! if you want to make good steady progress, then you need time for your brain and body to assimilate the information being given to it. Time taken now to work on what may seem simplistic, will be time well spent when you do move onto more difficult things. Believe me, learning to play the violin is an exponential curve - it starts off on a shallow gradient but it grows into a steep slope.

Amanda's absolutely right - the slower the better in fact. The bow hold alone can take ages to get right so actually I think you learnt rather a lot for a first lesson!

Violinia

THANKS Amanda and Violinia!! Well, i guess it's really important to have a strong foundation before i move on to more difficult things!

I recall I had some exercises to do with the bow alone, such as walking my hand spider-like up and down it with the bow vertical.

I also remember just practising holding the violin under my chin with no left hand....seems so easy now, but then I had to do it over the bed as the fiddle kept falling off.

That's actually quite alot...

In my first ever lesson I was thought to hold the violin and the bow, practise moving the bow and then grip the instrument without supporting it with my left hand. The bow hold was a little tricky at first (my thumb kept bending back the wrong way for some reason... ) and it took quite awhile for me to grip the violin firmly without it sliding down. Mine was a 30 minute lesson too.

In my first lesson, I just plucked the A and D string hahaha. Keep up the good work!

The slower the better? From an education point of view this is a bad teaching method... This is what happens in school where they set the students pace. In a generic student this has a variety of benefits but when the student is particulary intelligent his or her brain can assimilate quicker thus requiring contant stimulation else the student is going to get bored.

Whereas I agree a lot of student try to run before they can walk a careful balance needs to be struck to ensure the student fully enjoys the lessons, afterall the teacher shouldnt be encouraging lessons at all, rather self study techniques which transfer the mundane of the lesson to that of pleasurable practice by the student.

It isn't done like this however as every teacher wants the money they make off lessons, thus encourages ten billion lessons.


You did about what i did in my first violin lesson which like yours was 30 mins. In my second she made me sing!!! I'm quite sure you were given exercises to strengthen your arm and grip, (elevators, windscreen wipers etc) with the bow.... do them as often as you can, also practice holding in front of a mirror so you can get posture correct from the outset.

Yup i think self-studying is a way to motivate me to learn. Currently, i'm learning more on violin from the internet. However, the facts given are rather limited. So anyone here have other ways to do self-learning on violin? books? Please recommend me some!


To: tiger_vio

I'm curious! How long did you take to get to grade five?

I used Tetratunes to start off which is all pizzicato and starts by using tab instead of regular notation. It meant I got to actually play a tune in my first ever lesson which I reckon is the best way to do it for young starters...or impatient ones!

An embarassing amount of time! Let see.. ummm.. 9 years! I didnt do grade 1 for 3 years, because I was with 5 other people in a group so we didn't get much done in lessons. I also virtually stopped violin over a year because I never turned up for lessons as I felt I wasn't being pushed.

I put it down to not being pushed enough- especially in those first 3 years. I've taken up a lot of instruments since then and they're overtaking violin VERY fast. Although my sig says grade 5, standard wise, im about grade 6. It's only my technique that lets me down, as I could quite happily sight read a grade 6 piece.

My advice would be to just not rush yourself. My technique wasn't given any attention in the early years, hence all my problems now. Take your time with your technique first and it will benefit you in the long run =)

Sorry Fusian but I've inherited literally dozens of pupils who were taught violin too quickly from the beginning and picked up bad habits which are incredibly difficult to shift once they've taken root in the muscle memory.

'T'he slower the better' doesn't have to mean so boring the pupil loses interest - it's up to the teacher to keep it interesting and inspiring while the pupil slowly absorbs the correct technique. You can use fun backing tracks for the pupil to pluck along to at home while they learn finger positions, ditto for open string bowing, and with little ones you can play all sorts of games in lessons to keep the pace up and keep them absorbed and entertained as they learn.

Why do you think Yehudi Menuhin spent 3 months with his 12 complete beginners playing around with pieces of wood until they learnt good enough posture to start playing a real violin? None of them dropped out through boredom; OK, you could say this was because he was Yehudi Menuhin, but does any beginner deserve a teacher who treats them less carefully?

Perhaps violin just isn't the right instrument for anyone who lacks the patience to learn how to play it with style and grace. This isn't meant harshly, but I get so fed up when I inherit yet another pupil with a 'frying pan' left hand, a claw-like right hand and a sound that makes you want to hold your ears and scream. And those are just the first 3 things that spring to mind.

In other words, what's 3 months in a child's life? What's wrong with waiting till each step has been thoroughly absorbed before moving on to the next one, while keeping it fun and light along the way?

I had a new adult beginner start with me 8 months ago. We spent the first 4 lessons working on the left hand and the violin hold before moving on to the bow-hold; he's just joined the local 'All-Comers Orchestra' and tells me there are others there who can't do as much as he can who've been learning for 4 years - I'd lay a bet they were rushed in the beginning - I've seen it so many times. All you need to do (apart from keeping lessons fun and varied) with an impatient pupil - child or adult - is keep telling them why you're going so slowly with the technical stuff and explain that it's so they can go faster - and so much better - later on.

Old stories and analogies spring to mind, like the hare and the tortoise story, or 'more haste less speed'.

But I hope you get my point.

Violinia

PS Teachers wanting pupils to go slowly so they can coin it in? Do you really, really believe that???

I had a lesson with a new beginner pupil today (9 yr old). My plan was: demonstrate posture, explain the names of the strings, get her to pluck A string (crotchet beats in 4/4 time - though I didn't tell her this bit, of course!) while I plucked a tune over the top on my violin, just so she could feel she had started with the 'music' and we had done our first duet. However, she explained to me that she doesn't just want to learn Twinkle Twinkle etc., she wants to learn 'grown-up tunes' and wants to read proper notes on paper and wouldn't let me leave until I had written some musical notation down for her (which I wasn't planning to do for a while - I hope it doesn't get in the way!).

My main question is (and perhaps AmandaL and Violinia can answer this) : How do you introduce bowhold to a beginner pupil? I learned to hold it with the thumb underneath the frog as I think they suggest in the Suzuki books (I was not a Suzuki student, though), rather than the 'correct' way which I had to learn at about grade 3. Do you think this is a good idea, or should I teach my pupil to hold the bow correctly from the beginning?

Thanks!

PS My other pupil was 'rushed' at the beginning by her former teacher, I believe. Consequently. after a year and a bit we have still not managed to correct the lazy left wrist, despite me having tried a number of methods. It's quite disheartening, but then again I know she doesn't do much practice because of other commitments...

Introducing the bowhold is rarely as straighforward as you'd like it'd be, and there isn't one method that suits all. I clearly remember the way I was taught it, and have tried this method with pupils and found it not to work!

Practising on a pencil can be very good, or on a bamboo cane. Sheila Nelson recommends starting halfway up the stick as it's easier to balance first off. All the 'incy wincy spider', 'blast off!', 'windscreenwipers' and 'stirring the witch's pot' ideas came from Sheila Nelson and I think they're excellent, as they help the student to turn the bow into a sort of relaxed extension to their arm.

Keeping the thumb bent particularly when playing at the heel is crucial, otherwise your hand becomes stiff and by extension your arm. Keeping the little finger curved and relaxed is also very important. I like to encourage them to turn their wrist to the left, but not all violinists do this and some play nicely without particularly doing it. Some teachers like the first finger extended to the left; I don't, as I think it causes tension.

The Suzuki 'thumb under the frog' thing works well for some although I don't use it myself, and some experts think it's an appalling idea!

Once your hand is so relaxed (yet firm enough to be in control) to such an extent that it virtually tingles with 'rightness', then you know you've arrived. Sometimes it can click early on, other times it can take years to click. What I do know is that a good bowhold (and a resultant good bowing technique) is absolutely crucial to good playing, so it's well worth spending time on getting it right.

Good luck!

Violinia

To: tiger_vio

Yup! I've come to realise the importance of getting my foundation right!