I need to work on my string crossing. Not clean at all. What suggestions do you people have?

Anyway, I don't understand why I can never move from the E string to the D string without making some sort of noise during crossing. There must be something I'm doing wrong and it's so annoying!

Hi Ann

It must be your bowing. I'm sure you will find something in Sevcik's book of bowing exercises to help you.

Try opus 2 part 1 the second part of exercise 3 for starters.

make sure your violin has been setup properly, the bridge may be too high/low making it hard to cross strings clearly.

I do 30+ minutes of open string bowing per day. Although I still have some appauling habits, doing things like rapid string crossing at the tip and heel, with the down bow on the high and low strings, played legato, stacatto, spicatto and however else you like, helps greatly. You just have to be reeeeally picky with yourself. Pressure on the bow can be misleading too - if you don't have the right amount of pressure, when you change strings it may sound scratchy, crunchy or something else weird. But if your problem is your bow getting to a string before/after you want it to (creating a sort of "doubled note") then you just need to work away at it - slowly - and preferably with a mirror in front of you
Playing long legato notes on open strings for 15 minutes at a time might sound very beginnerish but it does wonders for technique...

Try the Paganini Capricii

Grade 5 level!!!! Oh dear

*jane goes off to practise some more*

Hi Jane, Chris, frumpybabes and bohemian!

Frumpybabes:-
Thanks for all your suggestions.. what is considered a bridge that is too high or low? How can I tell?

Jane:-
I'll look into that sevcik. So far, I've only been working on the Herbert Kinsey Set II, 3rd exercise to improve string crossing.

bohemian:-
Yes, my teacher makes me do long legato bows... from 20 beats per bow down to 1 beat per bow. I don't know how that helps string crossing, but can anyone explain how does that help? I know you'll be able to control the slow bows better, and bow more evenly but what else?


Chris:-
Paganini? Oh dear, I feel like quiting the violin already

I was kidding

Here's a great trick for learning how to do clean string crossings:

Play the first note and when you finish the note, stop your bow on the string and immediately swing the bow to the string the next note is on, as quickly as you possibly can. Do this a number of times. Now do the same thing, but playing the two actual notes from the passage concerned. Make sure the string crossing is really, really quick and that you actually stop the bow on the string before performing the string crossing and stopping the bow on the next string momentarily before playing the next note.

Now try the passage at its correct tempo and I guarantee you it'll be a lot cleaner if not perfect. Every time you come up against a tricky string crossing passage, whip out this exercise and see what happens.

Violinia

It's all about pivoting the bow, at speed, silently. Not easy to do, but I can see how violinias' suggestion will help. Resist the temptation of taking the bow off the strings and moving it - this slows things down considerably, induces the possibility of bow bounce, and breaks up whatever you are playing.

It all comes with practice, lots of it.

If you want a pure string-crossing exercise, you could try playing a one octave scale in broken octaves, starting on the open G-string. You should do this all in 1st position without shifting. You would then go on to cover all possible permutations of up/down, ascending/descending, and slurring from detaché to 2/3/4/6/etc notes per bow. Obviously, start really slow.

Thanks Violinia and Amanda. I can see that you're really good teachers. You make the practice of technique easier even if it's really quite difficult. I can see that would really help. I'll try that tomorrow if I have time.

Storini, that sure sounds difficult, but I can see that it would help too. I need to persuade myself to make an effort to do that though!

Any ideas for improving vibrato? Mine is a slow, rather imperfect kind which doesn't quite take off

Another thing I'm a bit concerned about.. my teacher says orchestras normally tune to A = 442', but so far everyone on here and my previous teacher too says it's A = 440' Which is correct? When I asked him, he said pianos are normally at 440' and orchestras at 442. So I expressed my concern about pitching when tuning to the exam piano when he tunes my violin to 442. He says just a tiny bit won't make much difference after all a piano can never by perfectly in tune. Sigh... now who is right??

The pitch standard chosen varies by orchestra and country. In the UK A-440 is pretty standard, whereas in Germany A-444 is more common. Pianos would typically be tuned to the standard prevailing in that country, as otherwise there would be problems in concertos.

You have to tune to the piano in most circumstances, and hope for the best. Some piano in poor condition can be up to 1/2 tone flat!

Yes they are. I've been fortunate enough to have a workshop from them both!


That would be a Baroque piano then..

Only half a tone? The piano that we had in the house when I was young, till we upgraded, was about a 3rd out...

Put the scroll against the wall and set your metronome to 60. Vibrate your finger just once per click until you can do it solidly at that speed. Then up the speed by 5 and repeat until you get to about 80. Then do the whole thing again but with 2 vibrates per click. Then again with 3 vibrates per click. Then increase from 80 (with one vibrate per click) till you get to 200. Or you could make up your own system! The idea is to create a strong vibrato at a slow speed and then reproduce it at higher speeds. This serves two functions: you strengthen your vibrato, while also learning how to control and vary the speed.

However, you do need someone who really knows their stuff to look at the shape of your vibrato before you attempt all this, to make sure you're doing it in the right way. Not a good idea to reinforce a bad habit which will then be even harder to break! Also bear in mind there are several different ways of approaching vibrato; Sheila Nelson likes the upper arm to wobble, so the wrist/hand is vibrating in a more sideways direction. Other people think the hand should be moving from a more scroll-wards direction. Then there's arm vibrato, wrist vibrato, string vibrato...

The more old-fashioned fast, narrow vibrato was more of a finger vibrato. The wider vibratos you hear more these days tend to use more arm. Personally I tend to prefer the sound of the narrower, faster vibrato because I prefer the sound of the older players - others will differ in their preference. Get a professional to have a look at your vibrato, show you the different styles, and then work on perfecting your preferred vibrato sound(s). In the end you will need a variety of different vibratos for different modes of expression. What a complex subject!

Violinia

In addition to Violinia's suggestions, do a search in the Viva Strings forum for vibrato and you'll find more helpful info than you can shake a stick at Violinia, AmandaL and others have all posted helpful things about how to do vibrato and when to use it, etc etc.

During one orchestra practices, my friend told me that 442 is for air-conditioned room and 440 is for non air-conditioned room. I myself am not really sure of it, but found that the pitch is a bit out if i tune my violin to 440 in air-con room.

Your teacher tunes your violin before going into the exam room, assuming the piano is tuned to 442? In my opinion, upright piano is 'never' tuned REALLY correctly. So, if you are really particular about the exact tuning for your instrument and piano during exam, better tune it in the exam room itself unless you have no one to help you do it or you don't trust yourself

@Violinia...If you don't mind me asking, are you based anywhere in the South of England?
I live in Dorset an just wondered where you practice your workshops???

Hi Sculptor

Actually I may not be too far away from you, depending on which part of Dorset you live in. I'm in Bath. I give small jazz workshops in my house (for up to 3 people), and also give individual lessons in jazz or classical violin (will teach to grade exams if required), as well as folk, blues, Klezmer, Latin styles. I'm also very happy to give lessons focussing on specific areas of technique if required.

If you're interested and think you could make it up to bath I could you with my tel. no and we could discuss this further.

Cheers

Violinia

Hi all! Yup, sounds like a sensible way of approaching vibrato, Violiania. I was just asking about it because there were suggestions on beginning vibrato, but not quite how to improve it. Anyway, my teacher seems to favour the arm vibrato. He told me not to move my wrist. And he said that the finger joints below the knuckle have to be loose to do it. It's a good idea to do it with the metroneme from the start to get it even and controlled. Thanks Violinia!

As for pianos that are out of tune, I think mine has dropped to about a tone! That's because I'm hardly ever home to use it, nor get it tuned.