Hi folks, I know this has been discussed on numerous occasions in the past but I just wanted to run this by you all and see what you thought.

I've been having lessons with my teacher, roughly fornightly (I'm studying for diploma), for a few years now and one of my children also has lessons with this teacher (weekly). Recently he/she (I'll not say which gendre just incase they read this ) decided to increase their fee from £30 an hour to £35 an hour (just for adults so my childs fee won't change). Now this may not seem a lot but my teacher knows I have given up my day job to try and concentrate on the diploma (I teach piano privately but only charge £7 for 30 mins and I only have 9 students) and I don't have a lot of money. With this increase it just seems that I've now got to find more money and on top of all that they aren't local to me so I also have the expense of petrol.

I think I want to say to my teacher that if they are going to charge £35 then I just can't afford this and I will have to reduce my lessons to one a month - but I'm a bit worried about grumbling about the fee at all because they happen to be very good. Really my teacher makes £120 a month from me already and I'm feeling a bit seen off by this. Am I overreacting do'y think?

I could look around and see what other teachers are available I suppose......


Oh, and I live in the south west if that's any help to what you may think.

That does seem excessive. I think between £12 and £14 pounds for 30 mins is plenty - unless the teacher is a professor or a well renowned teacher.

£35/hour to me seems on the expensive side, though it does depend on the teacher. As Appassionata has said, top performers/professors may be able to command such fees, but generally £35 is, to me, not cheap.

Hi Ursie,

Go to www.musicteachers.co.uk there you can type in a keyword 'diploma' then an instrument then region, I checked Devon only and there were quite a few, why not contact them? or the county you live in Hope this helps.

The average fees in my area (South East) seem to be between £25 and £30 per hour, irrespective of whether you are studying for Grade 6 or Diploma. These are the charges by the very experienced, qualified teachers working, in the main, with advanced pupils. Less well-qualified/experienced teachers or those working with younger, less experienced pupils can sometimes charge less.

I do know several college professors teaching in London/South East who charge anything between £50 and £70 an hour for lessons but they are the best and so can command that sort of rate. Have you checked out the ISM rates for private teachers? That would give you some sort of guide.

If you think you're not getting value for money that's one issue. If you have simply run out of funding (very reasonable problem) that's another. Can you discuss this at all? Can you increase your own rates (£7 in this area would be very cheap indeed for a 30 minute lesson) to provide the extra funds you need for your lessons? Are there other teachers in the area just as good but, perhaps, a little less expensive?

It seems to me if you get on well with your teacher, it's a pity to just terminate lessons without exploring other options but if you are now truly unhappy with what you're being asked to pay, you will increasingly become an unhappy and discontented pupil. That's not good for you and it's not good for your teacher either.

I'd do some exploration of your options and open negotiations if needs be.

Hope you get this sorted.

I charge £25 an hour. If I charged less, I would feel that my experience, professionalism and all the years of training I went through (and paid for!!) was being compromised. However, I like to remain accessible to as many as possible.

In the area I'm in, it's unlikely you'd find a specialist instrumental teacher for less than about £20 an hour.

Hi

I charge £20 per hour for private pupils but I will be putting this upto £25 when I have my letters. For me and the area I am in, at this time, this is ample.

As to what I would pay, it depends, in order,

a) How comfortable I was with the teacher
b ) Could they help me achieve my targets in a reasonable time
c) have they successfully taught to the standard I require.
d) Their teaching ability
e) Their qualifications


I say this because a cheaper lesson may mean it takes longer to achieve my goal, therefore ending up more costly.

I don't understand why its more expensive for adults - is that irrespective of standard, children seem to take as much if not more time planning etc ...

I admit I charge more for grade 4 - 6 and I will for 7 and above (when I get there... poitive thinking ) but not for adults to children.

Can you put your own rates up? £7 is low - I agree with oboist here.

Hi Ursie
I would definately recommend you talk to your teacher about this. I know mentioning money always seems a bit difficult but you have a problem and it is best if you air it. I used to go to a fantastic teacher who put her fees up regularly every year or so. Eventually it got too much for me. As soon as I mentioned this she immediately said 'no problem' I could continue to pay what I could afford. I paid the old rate for about a year but as soon as I could afford it I paid her new rate. Try and explain you feel awkward about this because you really value his/her expertise and think they're fantastic but you can't actually afford the pay increase. Having less regular lessons is obviously an option.

A couple of times parents of pupils have got into financial difficulties. If my relationship with them is good and the pupil is commited I always drop my fees for them. I have never been taken for granted when I have done this.

Lady Lucius - why do you charge more for higher grade pupils?? I find teaching beginners to be the most challenging with regards to motivation and patience. Teaching my grade 8 and diploma students is a total pleasure - if anything I sometimes think I just charge them less.

Teaching children is rewarding, even more so ... challenging with some yes making it even better.

However, time consuming no .. physically tiring - yes; but not time consuming. Even the marking is a breeze upto grade 4.

However the background work for grade 6, 7 and 8 theory and aural work is so much more than required for early grade lessons, including time for marking and setting future work in theory alone.

The background work for the pieces studied is more for the higher grade pieces than for grade 1 - 4 music which I can teach easily. I can't stand teaching a piece I do not know so each one needs learning first.

The lesson fee includes all the background work preparation and resolution of lesson work.

Hope this helps ...

Mmm, i know someone whos teacher used to charge £100 an hour for most students, but because he was gifted she charged JUST £50!

id have to agree with everyone else here, it really depends on the teachers pedigree, qualifications, experience, and how you personally feel you are getting along with him/her.

Difficult one this. My fees are £26.60 per hour but they will be going up to £28 in September. I am way behind what others with my qualifications charge in my area. 20 miles away (Bristol) the going rate is £35-£40. In fact when I last went to my Bristol singing teacher in 1994 she was charging £25 per hour THEN. Now I am more qualified than she is! My present teacher - the one who I studied with at Trinity College of Music, and who got me through all of my diplomas charges £60.
I charge the same for a child beginner as I do for a diploma. You are being paid not only for the time it takes and preparation for lessons, but also for your expertise and experience, which has taken years and tens of thousands of pounds in tuition fees to achieve. Though I am more expensive that most in my town, I am turning work away. If you are too cheap, people will wonder what they are getting for their money. I would put my fees up so you can keep your present teacher. It sounds as though you like him/her. Good teachers are woth their weight in gold - there is a lot if rubbish out there. You get what you pay for.
Good luck!

Ann

I pay £40/hr for Dip lessons which I see as good value given the reputation of the teacher and the fact I only have a few sessions in the run up to an exam.. This is in the south east tho' where things are almost always more expensive..

Your own fees are quite ludicrously cheap! I dont know what your qualifications are i.e. do you have a G8 and what your years of experience are, or perhaps you dont feels that you are able to charge more than this, but £7.00 p.h. please, a tenner for ½ hour at the v. least!

Talk to your own teacher and I am sure that she will understand and perhaps hold off the increase for a few months and give you some breathing space. As a private teacher I put my fees up annually but am always approachable to those students/parents who I know will feel it and I will give them a term or 2 to come to terms with my increase. However they have to approach me to discuss it.

Thanks for all your replies.

I see that probably my teacher is charging a fair sum. She is a very good teacher and I would say that Oboist is probably right in that I get good value for money but the increase has come at a time that isn't good for me.

As for the charging of my fees - I have grade 8 piano (which I passed with merit - my pieces I passed with 26, 27 and 28 but made a bit of a "dogs meal" of the aurals and sight reading ) and grade 6 theory. I have been teaching for about 3 years now. When I first started teaching I didn't feel that I should charge a lot because I didn't have any experience. I have made a couple increases, the most recent being in September 05. I have recently asked parents to pay 3 weeks in advance and all have agreed and changed to this method of paying without complaint. I don't feel at this moment I can increase my fees again.

I have felt that without a diploma, degree etc that I didn't really have the right to charge the same as those who hold these qualifications. However, I am working towards a diploma and at present considering an OU degree as well and I am also learning flute. My teacher has advised against the CTABRSM course at the moment as she considers that a professional qualification and that I should do the performing diploma first, followed by the teaching diploma. The students whom I have entered for AB exams have all passed with merits and all seem to be progressing within what seems to be considered as "normal" time scales - I have to take from that that I'm not doing too bad a job.

Probaby the bottom line is that I should pay my teacher and just make sure I pass this diploma in December

I'm glad you've got the path worked out now.

Perhaps your teacher doesn't know much about the CT course. It is aimed at all teachers. When I did it in 1999-2000, there were some "beginning" teachers on the course and some who had got many qualifications and decades of experience. My teaching was helped greatly by what I learnt. It is something to consider - perhaps get some more information about it? Lots of others on this forum would say the same thing too. (I think!)

You can send off for more information by using this form.

The MTPP is another course run by Reading University which is for teachers with good qualifications and experience.

To a certain extent I disagree with what has been said, "you get what you pay for". I think a lot depends on where you live and where you teach. I charge £18 an hour , probably going up to £20 in September, which is about average, or a bit higher for round here. If I charged much more than that I'd have no students at all! I wouldn't say that becuase mine are cheaper than in some parts of the country "you get what you pay for".

David

I agree your own fees are low, but also think you might not need weekly lessons- talk with your teacher about how much you can work by yourself. I gave up on weekly lessons after grade 8 and got on fine with fortnightly ones. Do you drive your daughter to her lessons anyway- if not you could at least save petrol by having a longer lesson less frequently, though my brain tends to die after an hour and a half or so.

I was not impressed with the CT ABRSM course when it first came out. An elderly teacher of mine, now passed away, said it was like buying letters.

However after a long break from music due to having 3 children, I decided to take the CT course and I can honestly say I have learnt more than I knew before,done things I would never have considered and I am totally enjoying it.

I would never advise against the CT course - quite the opposite it is worth every penny. You don't need to perform to do the course, a diploma isn't needed.

If I am honest I think I am better preparred to take my performing and / or teaching diploma now and I have only completed half the course and Ia m looking forward to the next weekend.

Rather ironically I think my playing has improved (though we don't have to play) and I know my teaching has.

oh and on the fee of £7/ 30 mins (ws it?) in the end you must charge what you ar happy with, or you won't feel comfortable with it ... to teach well comfort I find, is essential.

I think it does depend on the area. I've got a degree in Music and Ed, but work in computers (don't ask).

My only teaching is a girl I'm doing theory with, who I'm charging £10 per hour (as this is the first time I've ever taught theory). However, I've just taken up the Harp and having half hour lessons every fortnight. My teacher charges £30 an hour, no matter the level of the student.

I think you also should consider moving to fortnightly lessons. I did fortnightly lessons for my G8 clarinet and theory (18 years ago, so was paying £15 for 1 1/2 hour lesson). I only increased to weekly lessons once the exams were in sight...

HTH

Donna

Be warned that fortnightly lessons could be a nightmare! See the thread "displacement without discussion" for details of my own personal nightmare with this one..

I suppose it depends on how busy you are - but I am never going to go down this route again.. Stop me/shoot me if I ever mention thinking about it!!!

Ta very much like

A

If you go for fortnightly lessons with anyone, make sure you get them paid for upfront for half a term or a term in advance. It becomes a nightmare if you book somebody else for the alternative fortnight and then one of them wants to shift a week, throwing the whole thing out of kilter.

If you're paid upfront; you can always shift postponed lessons to another time (like holidays) but without you having to lose any money.

Violinia

I do teach some people fortnightly and it does work, but in most cases I'm left with an empty space every other week, which cannot be filled except for someone else wanting fortnightly lessons.

David

I don't think I explained myself very well concerning lessons. I have lessons roughly fortnightly but my son, who also has lessons with the same teacher, has lessons weekly. I've always had fortnightly lessons and there has never been a problem with this. I don't pay upfront either, I pay cash on the day of the lesson.

Lady Lucius, my teacher hasn't advised against the CT Course she's just advised not yet. The thought being that I'd get more from the course if I have more experience/knowledge etc to take with me into the course. Only those who have done the course (like yourself) can really say whether they would agree with this line of thought. Perhaps I should be doing it the other way round.

One things for sure, with 3 children myself, I certainly couldn't afford to continue with piano lessons and fund the CT Course at the same time.