Hi guys!

Well, shouldn't be too much longer before I realise my dream of finally having music lessons and so I'm now trying to decide which instrument to start with: cello or viola. In the end, I want to learn both, but here are some of the things I've been considering:

Cello:
+
Loads of repertoire - playing music actually written for cello!
Plenty of teachers
Very popular instrument and sound - almost everyone loves cello
Learning cello first will teach me 3 clefs and I feel it will then be easier to play much cello music on viola without having to buy loads of new manuscripts. Well, same strings, right???
-
Large - v small home with increasing storage space problems, (although I should manage to get it in my wardrobe when not in use), and hard to carry with me - I don't drive.
Expensive - money is a problem....=(

Viola:
+
Lesser learned instrument, so more novelty and 'usability' in terms of ensembles when I get to that stage.
Smaller, easier to find space for in a tiny flat and to carry around.
Cheap compared to cello, both rental and purchase - around 1/3 of the price.
-
Sparse repertoire - lots is just adapted for viola and not written for it.
Hubby's not big on viola - thinks the alto range is rather dull. I would like him to really enjoy what I do.
Fewer teachers, although this is not a big problem really
If I learn viola first, then move on to cello, well, I've heard that advanced beginners of other stringed instruments can't really learn on the cheapest instruments as they're 'beyond' that stage. That would mean a relatively expensive cello to start with, rather than the other way around. Money may be less of a problem in the future, but this can't be guaranteed, so.....

Can't even say which I like best at the mo as I'm getting into finding nice viola music to listen to. Still love cello though.

What do you guys think? Of course, I'm going to make my own decision in the long run, but I'd like to know what other +s and and -s you can think of to help weigh things up fully.

"Learning cello first will teach me 3 clefs and I feel it will then be easier to play much cello music on viola without having to buy loads of new manuscripts. Well, same strings, right???"

I think though different fingering as the spaces between the notes (being longer strings and an octave lower) will be wider.

AmandaL is the one to advise as she is expert on both.

In the end I would go for what your heart tells you, and I sort of feel it sounds like its cello

I'm no expert... but I think that if you got used to playing cello music on the viola (from cello clefs) it could be confusing... the cello is pitched an octave lower than the viola, and everything is written at pitch, so when you then got to play viola stuff written as it's supposed to be it *could* get confusing.

I don't think cello ever uses alto - bass tenor and treble as far as I know - going from tenor clef on cello to alto clef on viola would be confusing enough, playing things that you had been used to playing from cello tenor clef music up an octave on the viola to reading alto clef could be a bit mind-boggling!

As to which to go for - my best advice is to plump for the one that really enthuses you.

Yes, I know what you mean, but what I meant was that you would just know what the note was, even though it was an octave higher in terms of what you were hearing, and it wouldn't be anything like as much of a challenge as playing music 'between' other instruments might be, (i.e I recently heard a clarinet piece done on viola - transposing instrument AND treble-alto clef!!). You're right that cello doesn't use alto. I would learn to use the alto clef properly as well, I promise!!!

As to which enthuses me, it's hard to say. It fluctuates so much that I'm not at all sure. I think, at the mo, viola interests me more, but next week it might change back....!!!!!!! They both do, and I'm not sure that it's not just the 'novelty' value of viola that's pulling me at the mo, as well as the £$£ problem. If I listen to more cello music, I'll go back in that direction. See what I mean???

Yeah Jane, I thought that must be the case too - about the fingering being wider for cello. The sheer size of it!! Still, it seems that when you've learnt one bowed string, you seem to need to do little more than adjust technique for the others. I don't fancy violin much though, prefer the mellow end of the scale.

Oh, do you mean in terms of knowing what it's supposed to sound like? In which case, yes, I think that would help

Looking at your positive and negative points for both, it seems you'd actually *enjoy* the sound of the cello more; whilst your viola points are about demand in orchestras and the price.
I think if you saved up enough and got over that money issue, you'd be happier with a cello! It's far more worthwile, but just my opinion.
At the end of the day, both of them are really good instruments- so good luck!

I've been messing about on a viola I've recently acquired, having already started to learn the cello rather more formally. I read the bass and treble clef fluently, and I have to say, if anything, I think it makes the alto clef harder to learn. I'm used to certain notes being in the spaces on the staff, and I find the fact that C, for instance, is on a line not a space very confuzzling. The fact that the same notes on the same strings are written in a different way on the alto and bass clef is particularly difficult to get your head round. I'd say don't rely on playing one making the other any easier, and definitely don't think you could - at least in the early stages - transfer from one to the other with the ease you're describing.

I like the sound of both. I'm not a big fan of the violin, which I used to play as a child, as I find it too shrill that close to my ears! But I love the sound of the viola, and the cello is the instrument dreams are made of.

Why not see if you can have a little try of both the viola and cello, before making a decision. I know there is a huge difference in cost, but if your heart is set on the cello, then maybe sacrifice something else to raise the funds.

Storage space......hmmm.... ...something of a problem for me at the moment. Trying out different double basses has left me with two in the house at the moment and they take up a terribly large amount of space in an ordinary sized living room. There are lots of compact sized cases available for cello, so there shouldn't be too much of a problem finding something that keeps the instrument safe, but tucked away in a corner at the same time. Cello cases are also fairly light these days, so it won't add a huge amount to the weight of the instrument and most come with back-pack straps so that the case can be mounted comfortably on your back. Not every cellist I know owns a car either, but they seem to manage carrying the instrument quite well on public transport.

Repertoire. Well, there is a bit more available for viola than you might think. It's more a case of searching for it. Regrettably, a lot of music shops don't stock much viola music - because they don't think it will be very popular. Well, if they don't stock very much then they won't attract many viola playing customers, so check out websites instead. The cello uses the bass, tenor and treble clef. The alto clef is exclusive to the viola, so there is no advantage to learning one instrument or the other in that respect.

Teachers. Yes, a huge amount of cello teachers are out there. For the viola, you will probably find at least 50% of violinists will also play and teach the viola, so finding a teacher shouldn't be too much problem.

I couldn't decide between the viola and cello....and look what happened to me, I ended up playing both! Now I'm taking up the double-bass as well, and yes, being advanced on other instruments does make you picky and musically beyond playing a cheap student instrument. I can hear my bank account creaking again and the bank manager screaming..............

Wish I could, but it's not my decision and, sadly, the Council won't let us live rent free so I can take music lessons!!! I don't really do anything else that costs money at the mo, but things may improve financially once Sir is back in work more hours a week, (he's been doing an MA this academic year, so not much ££ around). We shall see. I'll get a Uni or College of Music student to teach me, so that will keep costs more reasonable at least. Can't even think about starting until the autumn though.... Might make a start on some theory before then and get more of an idea of the repertoire by listening to more classical stuff. E-bay for CDs!!!

I like your idea of trying both though and I'll give that one some serious thought.

I love the sound of both actually, which is one thing that makes it so hard to decide!! My heart isn't set on either really, thus the dilemma. First it was cello, then viola later, but now I'm pulling in the opposite direction. Hmmm.

Not in the least worried about multiple clefs as I'm also a keen linguist, so I see it as like reading something in different languages. I actually like the idea of that challenge!! Mad, or what?? Having said that, I wasn't thinking of taking up the 2nd instrument until about G5 on the first. That sound more reasonable??

Thanks for all the ideas and keep 'em coming if anyone else has any bright 'uns to share!

Can you rent for a bit? My daughter's cello rental costs £30 a quarter, which you might find manageable? Viola's are cheaper.

Yup, that's exactly what I'd planned to do - rent for the first quarter to make sure that I take to it. It's about £60 for a cello locally and I think it was £25 for a viola, although their website says 'rental scheme for children' and they didn't answer my enquiry e-mail, grrrrrr. Discovered an on-line place that does instruments for hire purchase today too, so have bookmarked that one for further investigation. Actually, I think buying an instrument as a beginner is nuts! You might not take to it, then have the fuss of having to sell on an expensive instrument.

Well, whichever it turns out to be, I'm itching to start!

Sounds like you need to find a better rental place? It does auger well if they're not returning your enquiries! (If you're coming to Leicester for the concert, I'd recommend you drop by sheehan's while you're here - they're great).

Yeah, I thought that too - that they need to pick up on their customer service standards, but as it was only one e-mail (and sometimes things go astray), I'll give them the benefit of the doubt and try again. I will certainly mention it when I go in.

Leicester's too far for me, I'm afraid. I have no transport and wouldn't want to take a hire instrument on the coach/train!!! There may be another alternative here in Leeds, but I don't need to make any decisions as yet, so I've time to shop around, so to speak. Thanks for your thoughts though - nice to know someone else loves poor service as little as I do! Shockingly (and increasingly) common though.....

If it were me I would go for the viola, then move on to the cello. Just my opinion ... Or why not try both and see which one you fall in love with most, perhaps rent, like the others have said ...