Hi,
I have a piano teacher who just puts me through exam after exam. Since i was 6 i've just been doing exams. I don't do any fun pieces, or anything that involves any pedals. I am playing grade 6 pieces, but feel asthough i'm only about grade 3 or 4 standard. Should i force (because thats the only way i'm going to manage it) my teacher into letting learn some fun pieces with technical stuff? or should i just keep going on the exams?

Thanks x

Definitely do some fun pieces! Grades are quite important stepping stones, but don't make that the be all end all of your musicianship. I'm only speculating here but it sounds like you don't enjoy the piano as much as you could, because of this exam-after-exam thing. If you don't play non-exam pieces, you won't be enjoying music as much - and enjoyment should be the primary reason for playing a musical instrument. Plus you will be quite limited in your repertoire if you are only playing the exam pieces. Although grades might be important to you or your teacher right now, say in 30 years time you wouldn't really care much about what grade you got up to, as long as you'd be able to play the piano for enjoyment to play pieces that you want to, not because you're forced to.

Pedal is a crucial skill in piano playing and I think loads of pieces require/could do with the pedal at around Grade 6 level. You could start by playing the other pieces in the selected exam pieces, and perhaps get some collections of pieces? The Hours with the Masters and Classics to Moderns has always been good. People here would doubtlessly have loads of suggestions. Or are there any other famous pieces that you know that you thought "Oh, I really want to be able to play this" before? For example I had always wanted to be able to play one of Bach's cantatas and so that's been an incentive to start practicing it, and so I have a clear target to work towards too.

Remember, if worst comes to the worst just practice different pieces by yourself. Also, if you come in with a well practiced piece that just needs some advice from your teacher, I'm sure she'd be able to spare you that moment.

That came out as a long rant... and I do sympathise, because that is the situation with my clarinet. Admittedly I take group tuition, and at school, so the quality of teaching is quite poor - but my teacher doesn't seem to realise that music outside music grades exist. I've passed my Grade 3 with good marks and am working towards Grade 5, but I have only played a total of about 10 pieces so far because we're only doing one exam after another, and I don't think I'm at Grade 5 standard - more like Grade 3. I know I should do something about it, because this is making me start to dislike playing the clarinet, so I don't practice, and it goes in a vicious cycle. So don't become like me - ask your teacher to let you play some fun pieces. It might turn out that she didn't realise she had been forcing exams on you and will let you play some fun pieces.

Hi, In my opinion fun is one of the most important things in playing music. Is there really need for you to do the exams? If there isn't it may be wise to talk to your teacher and see if you can take a break from exams and expand your repertoire with pieces you really like to learn. Good luck!

I just had to quote this, I am in exactly the same situation. Started learning clarinet September 2004, and I took my grade 5 exam the other week. I'm now moving on to grade 6. I think I might move teachers - I don't like to say it, but he's not really that much of a good teacher (despite having a B Ed ), and I think I have to move on. Don't get me wrong, I think he's a great guy, just not what I'm looking for.

*gets back on track*

My piano, however, I enjoy much more because I have only really learnt the pieces that I want to, because I have no teacher. Not suggesting that you leave your teacher or anything! If your teacher doesn't want to do any 'fun stuff', then you can always do fun stuff outside of lessons! Ask us for any suggestions of pieces of certain standards and we'll help you out, no problems

Good luck!

This is definitely not what a teacher should be doing. Doing exams only is feeding their pupils a serious musical malnourishment. Do other stuff.

Oddball. your teacher has a Bed: so he has a qualification in teaching school classes and delivering their curriculum, but can he teach clarinet??

Anakrron's ideas look good. I can add Bach 2 part Inventions and Wedgwood's 'Up-Grade' (which ever level is most appropriate. There are more experienced pianists here, I just had to comment on this scandalous method of 'teaching' using only exam syllabi. Change teachers!

I agree with the advice given above - you've chosen to play the piano, I'm sure, because you enjoy playing it. Music is not just about getting grades, it's about the love you have for your instrument, and the enjoyment you get from playing it.

So please deviless, try playing some pieces you enjoy!

Oddball - yes, I agree with you. If your gut instinct is to change teachers because you feel your current teacher isn't right for you, then I'd do so. Hopping straight from passing grade 5 to studying towards grade 6 is something that I'd avoid - again, I'd now play some pieces that you want to play. To be a slave to the examination syllabus is not going to help you long term, useful though the grades are - you ought to do other pieces too.

DEFINITELYDEFINITELYDEFINITELYDEFINITELYDEFINITELYDEFINITELYDEFINITELYDEFINITELY


Learning should not just be exam after exam after exam after exam....... there are too many teachers who do this, but fortunately also a lot of teachers who, like me, get very angry about this too

MUSIC SHOULD BE FUN

nooooooo surely not!

Couldn't agree more.

Your "teacher" isn't teaching you, deviless. I should try to find one who will.

Steve

DEFINITELY



Playing fun stuff as well as exam stuff is what kept me sane and ket me loving music.

I would say to play fun pieces alongside your graded pieces, if you are happy doing the exams. At the minute, my pupils are finding duets fun to play, perhaps you could suggest that to your teacher. Good luck with your playing, and yes, have lots of fun with it

Yes, you need to be doing fun stuff, and other classical stuff - just learning 3 pieces from each syllabus is no fun and will do you no good in the long run - it won't give you much sight-reading practice, you'll have a narrow repertoire, and you'll be bored stiff. Not much good.

thank you, you're right anakrron, i've got so bored and frustrated with the pieces i hate playing the piano, and so my pieces get worse so every time i play them i get more frustrated! i'll talk to my teacher, and if she won't let me, i think i will talk to my mum about changing teacher. I play the flute too and i have the same teacher, i have an audition for the band i'm in and she's making me do a piece that i'm not comfortable with, so i think that either i'll make her let me play the piece i want, or change teacher.

If she won't let you choose what you want to play she should NOT be a teacher in the first place!

Yes, yes, yes - of course you should be doing fun pieces!

Don't make the same mistake I did and just go along with whatever your teacher says! I wasn't pushed through the grades and I learnt a broad range of repertoire but it wasn't the kind of music that appeals to teenagers. My teacher focussed on Bach, Mozart, Schubert, Haydn, Beethoven, Debussy... all great composers and I learnt some brilliant pieces, but I wish I'd learnt a few jazz pieces or some Broadway show tunes or rock songs etc!

I would suggest going along to your local music shop and browsing through the music - buy something you like and ask your teacher to help you learn it. Remember, you are the client! You should have some choice in what you learn.

I ended up giving up lessons aged 16 after taking Grade 7 and it is one of my biggest regrets. I never stopped playing - in fact, when I "gave up", I actually started playing far more because I could play the music I wanted to play. My teacher would probably have never agreed to doing popular music, so for me, the best decision would have been to change teachers.

Talk to your teacher about this.

As others have said, yes, you should be able to enjoy (most at least, of) what you play.

One of the first questions I ask a new student is "what kind of music do you want to play?"

We explore new pieces together, and try to find the ones that generate a spark of interest.
Sometimes it's good to encourage students to try something they might not immediately choose. If something "grows" on you, you'll extend your area of appreciation and that's also something a teacher should encourage. But I like students to talk about their pieces, and to tell me if one isn't "working" after the first week or so. A dead horse usually goes nowhere! If a piece is being enjoyed, it will move on. Playing pieces you don't like, just because you have to learn them is pretty deadly in my opinion. If there are pieces that you "need" to learn for some reason (eg exam) and they don't much appeal, they need to be balanced out by lots of other enjoyable stuff that you have some choice in.

Talk to your teacher. He / she may be unaware how much you dislike your pieces.

do some fun pieces with high level of technical difficulty!
I had once played Bartok's Mikrokosmos Progressive Piece No 153.
It was challenging and brain-consuming.
I enjoyed the "excitement" in the song and it was indeed fun!

Not another teacher using grades as hurdles in a steeplechase! really I hate this approach even though I enter pupils for exams. I had a singing pupil bring me the theme from "titanic" this week. it's not exam music but we had a great time, and I was able to make salient points about her technique too.

The music you play for fun needn't all be classical either. There are some good arrangements of film music around, some Jazz piano books too. Yes Classics to Moderns are great, but the more varied your repertoire the more fun you will have.

Find a teacher who has the interest of you as a complete musician at heart not one who just concentrates on Exams. Even my exam candidates learn more than the minimum number of pieces they need to. I have a grade 1 candidate who will be able to choose her three piece out of six, two from eaach group. It's much more fun for her!

It has been said on this forum many times, but it's worth repeating. Exams should firstly be a means to an end, rather than an end in themselves. Most people trawl themselves through exams so they become better musicians by the end of it. This process is entirely useless if you are indefinately shoved into exams without putting your newly acquired skills into learning the repertoire you dream of playing.
Most teachers are thrilled if their students are enthusiastic and have ideas of their own, and if you need to battle against yours, then i would suggest changing pretty swiftly.
Schubertiad

I must be really lucky - my teacher actually discourages me from just taking exam after exam - she insists I do 'fun' pieces and exercises between. She also encourges me to perform at recitals - only pieces I enjoy - and I'm sure would never push me towards the next exam for the sake of it.

Heed all the advice - have some fun!!

Yes, I agree 100%. Ask around about other teachers, and when you find one, find out their method of teaching before you jump on board. Like someone above said, you are very musically 'malnourished' by learning in this way. You may find that your true level of ability will not be as high as your current exam grade, but don't be disheartened by this, you need desperately to broaden out and you will really begin to enjoy playing more, and become a much better pianist.

But you don't have to wait to change teachers - go to a music shop and look at the huge selection there. Ask the shop assistant what is popular at grade 4-5 level if you are not sure. The suggestions already given are well worth looking at. My pupils love Pamela Wedgwood, Mike Cornick and Christopher Norton for the jazzy touch, and there are loads of compilation classical books to give you experience of new pieces.

Have fun.

When I was a pupil as opposed to a teacher, I didn't ask what I could play; I just took myself off to the music shop and bought it! I soon learnt that it was a mistake to take the music along and say, "Can we try this?" because she usually wouldn't give it the time of day. However, if I got it well underway on my own, and THEN produced it at a lesson, she was usually impressed with my efforts and willing/keen to help.

As a teacher now, I can see where she was coming from; when you take a break from exams with a pupil, it's easy to slip into the scenario where the pupil wants to jump from one thing to another continually, without ever really perfecting anything, and without really gaining any new skills either. (When a piece is not being learnt with a specific goal in mind, the pupil often decides, when it gets to a tricky bit, that maybe he'd rather play something else instead...) Several months later, aforementioned pupil is disgruntled because his friend is about to take the next grade, while he hasn't really made any progress himself! (Sight-reading is a different issue; I insist upon that regardless.)

Just thought I'd throw a slighltly different perspective on this! I think goals are very important, whether they be exams, concerts, festivals, whatever. I DO think you should be playing music you enjoy, but don't allow yourself to drift. Even if you think to yourself, "I'll give myself three weeks and then I'm going to play this for Auntie xxx," then you're striving for something, and will be satisfied when you've achieved it.

Arm yourself with some cash and take yourself off to the music shop!
Good luck with the teacher - I'm sure he/she has your best interests at heart.

(P.S. Do you have anyone you could play duets with? There's a LOT of fun to be had there - the piano can be a lonely instrument. There's also a lot to be gained, musically.)

Good luck!

I am thinking about duets, but i have to work in times to meet up with my friend (one and only) who plays piano, allong with the flute duets i play with her, which could work out ok. However, i have school and band work to do too. It all just depends what i can get my teacher to agree too (fingers crossed for monday!)

Has anyone got any recommendations for duets for around grade 3-5? (my friend is about grade 3)

Thank you everyone!!

The slow movement of Mozart's Sonata in D for 4 hands is lovely - about Grade 4 at a guess. (The whole sonata is lovely, but the other movements are about Grade 8.)

She's MAKING you do a piece you're not comfortable with?!?

Why?

Please consider changing your teacher deviless. You sound as though you're unhappy with the one you've got, and music is about enjoyment, over and above anything else.

Maybe it's a mistake having the same teacher for two instruments...? But that's another matter - I can't help feeling that if this teacher has served you well with good technique and good results, then you should be careful about doing anything impetuous. Try being more assertive with her before you rush into changing to another teacher; she may not realise that you're unhappy. Make sure you have positive suggestions ready when you bring the subject up, or she may just think you're being stroppy!!! Now, I'M not saying that! Far from it! You really ought to be getting more pleasure from your music, but I think you should try going down that road with your current teacher before you do something you might regret. Do you get on well with her in other ways?

she hasn't served well in good technique, but ok results, appart from having to retake grade 3 piano, and grade 5 piano and grade 6 theory 3 times (probably my fault not practicing properly...)

I do get on with her, we both have a wicked sence of humor, but that still doesn't make up for the fact that she controles my musical life!!!

Ok, you've swung me...maybe a new teacher's a good idea after all...

Definately take time out ot play fun stuff. Just not too much time!!

It is possible to play fun stuff and improve at the same time.
And anyway, it's not a race, playing SHOULD be mostly fun.

You definately should. By playing only exam pieces you're limiting yourself. By fun pieces do you mean anything other than exam songs or jazz, pop and the like? My teacher makes it a point to assign me jazz songs all the time besides my main pieces. And I've actually learnt quite alot of techniques from playing them... also its a relief to be able to play something relazing and fun after a hectic exam practice session.

Sounds like a control freak. Anyway, if you are technically able to cope with grade 5-6 music there's lots of music out there that you could probably tackle on your own and make some choices for yourself.

Good luck!

Two of my children played in Bromley Youth Concert Band years ago (bassoon and trombone) and had a great time with it.

I'm in the Brromley Youth Training Band and it is great fun!!

Anyway GOOD NEWS!!!! i spoke to my teacher, and after i pass my grade 5 piano, she will let me go through a few pieces. The books i got were full of pieces which she loved and already knew so that went down a treat! she also thought they were great for sightreading if i played the first line of each of them!

I am also sight reading through a few pieces on my own, which i find fun. Now i am actually doing something different i have motivated myself to practice my scales etc. every night!! (allong with the £50 bribe my mum has put so that i pass this time!! lol)

the rest of the Good News follows. I found the flute and piano version of Fur Elise by Beethoven, and my teacher said that it might be fun to go through that too!! so YAY!!!!!!!!

I am going to ask my mum for a few more technical lessons with a teacher i know. So it all seems to have a happy ending!

Thank You everyone who had advice or just the odd sympathetic comment!! All very very appreiciated!!

Thanks again,
Julia!! xxx

Have you looked at www.virtualsheetmusic.com? You can download lots of flute/piano music and lots is free. (Print it out on thin card - it lasts longer!)

Glad to hear things are looking up! Keep at those scales!

Hi, Deviless. There are some FUN music books out there that are also "technique" books. May I recommend "Alfred's Basic Piano Course Top Hits - Solo Book" (from Levels 1 - 6) which feature popular Broadway music. I completed the Levels 1 - 4 books under my previous teacher (along with my graded John Thompson, Bastien, Czerny and Alfred's Basic Learner's books) and my current teacher just "bought" me the Top Hits Level 5 book, so that my practice is not "boringly" confined to classical/exam pieces.

There's another WONDERFUL piano book series called "Upgrade" (by Pamela Wedgewood) with original pieces composed by Ms Wedgewood and meant as practice pieces before you start a higher grade. The music selection comprise of varied styles (jazz, classical, etc.) and each piece evokes a different mood ("brightness", suspense, jazzy, romantic, melancholy, western/cowboy, etc.) and is beautiful, melodious and FUN to play! And they're good for improving "techniques". Maybe your teacher will approve of this piano book series.

Personally, I love classical and movie music and have dozens of sheet music and music books which I bought on my own and practice the pieces I like privately, just for FUN (my teachers don't know I have these books ). I usually can't play these pieces well because they are technically beyond my "level" (but I like to collect them for the "future"). And I'm sure my teacher wouldn't approve of my tackling these music because I might neglect practice on my "lesson" pieces. But I'm gearing for exam next year, and must focus on what's important now which is to practice more on my scales and classical/exam pieces. I will be more worried if my teacher doesn't focus enough on preparing me for the exam and instead encourages me to play "fun" pieces!

Deviless, you wrote that you "sometimes got so bored and frustrated with the pieces". Well, I experience this too. But I think, usually when a teacher pushes one to practice on a boring/difficult piece, it's with good intention. If the piece is appropriate for the grade one is in, I think it's good to practice until one gets it OK. It always feels great when I've completed a difficult piece, and the teacher tells me, "Very good. See what continuous practice can do for you? Now you've gotten rid of this piece and we can move on." And I would go like, "Phew!" There were some pieces I ABSOLUTELY hated practicing on (two immediately come to mind: Beethoven's "Minuet in G" and Clementi's "Sonatina"). Technically, these are not very difficult pieces, but for some reason, it still took me weeks to minimize my mistakes and it got to the point where I really, really hated the music!! I was sulky whenever my (former) teacher said to me, "OK, you need more practice on this. Try to concentrate on this bar and this bar where you made the most errors on, and I hope you do better next week." Sometimes, it was my teacher who 'sulked': "Didn't practice enough, did you? This is an 'old' piece, isnt' it? I hope I don't have to ask you to repeat this piece again next week." Now, if a piece is particularly dry/difficult/boring, I try to concentrate more on it to get it out of the way, so that I don't have to "look at it" again (ever!). Right now, I have a difficult piece to practice on i.e. Burgmuller's "The Young Shepherdess". It's in C major, but some bars are just so difficult to get right. I've to do tonic, 1st inversion and 2nd inversion (all in appergio) and in mixed order, from top/right hand side of the keyboard down to the left, and the chords for treble and bass clefs aren't the same!