I'm taking my grade 8 in piano in a few days, but after that I wish to take diplomas. My piano teacher has taught me for about ten years, but he said that if I wanted to take a diploma that I would have to go to a specialist music college. He said, he wouldn't be able to teach me. I'm 17 at the moment.

How do I take diplomas? Where do I have to go to learn how to take them, just like my piano teacher taught me to take graded piano. I know I have to be 18 to take a teaching diploma, but I could use the year to study for it.

Anyone got any advice about how they learnt?

Hi Jen,

It depends which diplomas you 're interested in doing, but it may just be a matter of finding a different teacher, one who is used to teaching to diploma standard. Then you would prepare in much the same way as for your grade exams.

Hopefully you will get some replies from people who 've done the AB diplomas, and they will give you some clues as to how they did them.

Also you could write to places like Trinity College in London and get details of their diplomas (or try the website). Some of their diplomas can be taken externally (ie you don't have to study at the college to take them.)

If there's a music college in a town near you it might also be useful to get information from there - they might be able to put you in touch with another teacher.

Good luck with your grade 8

Maggie

I haven't personally done it but I know someone who is doing it; there are quite a few people on the forums here who have done it too; there are three topics in the Students' forum which you may find useful, have a look in there.

What sort of diploma would you be wanting to do: the performing diploma or the teaching diploma? If it's the teaching diploma then before you do it you need to have taught a number of students (I think it's at least five) to different levels and have some teaching experience: it's more of a test of your teaching abilities than something that teaches you to teach. If you want to do the performing diploma (or the teaching diploma for that matter) you don't need to go to music college: many people do them with a private music teacher sometimes the same one that they had from grade 1; other people do them without a teacher. If your teacher doesn't feel comfortable with teaching to that level there may be another teacher in your area that would teach you; or it may just be that your teacher doesn't know what's involved and may be more comfortable with it if they knew what was required, try talking it through with them. The link to music college is that the standard is intended to be equivalant to that of someone who has completed the first year of music college, and is thus quite high, but you don't actually need to be at music college to do it. All the information ABRSM's information on the diplomas is here.

Well I'm 17 and I'm doing my diploma next week! (performance though). I've had the same teacher for four years and so they've taught me right through the grades. The performance diplomas are just like an extension of the graded exams- just a higher standard and no scales and aurals (yay!). There's no need to go to a specialist music school. You enter yourself for a diploma- you can send away to the ABRSM for an application form or download one from the website, then you just fill it in and send it back with the rather extortionate £105 they charge you for it! If you want to do a teaching diploma then as far as I know you need to have at least six months teaching experience, as well as Grade 6 theory, and you need to be over 18. But why don't you just do a performance one? It'll probably take at least a year after grade 8 to reach the standard for a diploma, maybe more. I don't really know what you mean about how someone would 'learn' for a diploma. You just play your instrument! At the diploma level it's more than just playing all the notes right- you have to show that you have musicality as well. It says in the syllabus that the Dip.ABRSM is broadly equivalent to the standard you would reach after a year doing music at a third level institution!

my story is a bit different....

recently, i have decided to study music . im 17. i just had this urge one day.
but the problem is, i havent taken any music exams or watsoever.
Next year, i have to take grade 5 theory and flute practical. im finishing grade 2 theory soon.

but im doing A levels at the moment. i complete A2 next year.

so i was advised to complete A levels, complete grade 5 music exam, and go straight for the diploma.

im taking 3 years at a college to do a diploma course...
i may find it difficult at first because i will be at just grade 5

i think the diploma they offer at the college is a performing one.

but thats perfect because i want to perform!

am i doing the right thing?
but i really really really want to study music

has anyone had this urge that they were meant to do music and/or happy to do music?
i just feel so different from the rest...that fact that i want to do just music a few months ago eventho i know that i may suffer a bit first

QUOTE (missfabflute @ Jun 21 2004, 06:45 PM)

but thats perfect because i want to perform! am i doing the right thing? but i really really really want to study music has anyone had this urge that they were meant to do music and/or happy to do music? i just feel so different from the rest...that fact that i want to do just music a few months ago eventho i know that i may suffer a bit first

hi missfabflute!
please don't be offended or take this the wrong way, because it's only my opinion which really shouldn't matter to you at all......
but I think you should seriously reconsider what you want to do. The fact that you will only be grade 5 on your principal instrument when you leave school will put you at a serious disadvantage compared to 99.9% of flautists who have the same dreams as you. The flute is a seriously competitive instrument- in my experience there are nearly as many flautists as violinists, yet there are ten times as many violins in an orchestra-therefore, playing the flute is roughly ten times more competitive! I mean, sooo many people play the flute, and there are many ( i know at least 10 people in my year at school [lower 6th] who have done grade 8 flute and know they aren't good enough for a performing career) flautists who would be better qualified than you competing for any jobs you would like. I'm not trying to be mean, I'm just trying to be realistic- it would be extremely difficult for you. Of course if that's all you want to do and you know that for certain, then I suppose you have to do it, but I'd advise you to think VERY carefully about it. I mean, most people who play instruments do it because they are 'happy to do music'- surely that's the point of it? Maybe you're confusing the fun and satisfaction you get from music with this 'urge' that you were 'meant to do it'. I'm the same age as you and I know how confusing it is at the moment, trying to decide what to do when you leave school, but don't just decide on a whim. If you've only been playing for a short time then how do you really know it's for you? What sort of performer would you like to be? Have you got any orchestral experience? I feel really mean saying this stuff but if I was in your position I'd really like people to be honest with me. Anyway, just think about it!
xox

Hey guys,

Thanks very much for your advice. I thought I'd have to go to some specialist music college and pay their nine grand tuition fee! I know my piano teacher has actually done the performance and teaching diplomas so I think me and him need to have a good chat!

I teach piano to three people, so the teaching diploma looks like my best bet. It sounds like the performance diploma will need more work from what I've found out about it.

To all those who have done the diploma, my piano teacher said that to do a diploma, one would have to do it on a full time basis. In other words, put a lot of time and effort into it. Piano up until now for me has been an extra. As I've been playing piano since I was 7 and I'm now 17, piano was never an "if I have time thing". I practiced for hours even if I did have loads of other work to do. Is it possible to do a diploma, get on with your life, and not do what the professionals do: devote half your day to playing the piano?

Thanks a bunch

I'm sure you can do a diploma on a part-time basis.

I did mine while I was studying at college anyway, sort of alongside similar things, so that doesn't really count as part time in quite the same way.

Do have another chat with your current teacher. If you have worked together for ten years and you have been happy with the teaching (got to grade 8 so something has worked !!) it would be a pity to part company now if you needn't.

And start collecting information. If you already have students, that's a good start if you want to do the teaching diploma. I can't remember how many students you have to have minimum, but someone will know.

Maggie

QUOTE

I teach piano to three people, so the teaching diploma looks like my best bet. It sounds like the performance diploma will need more work from what I've found out about it.

Is more work necessarily a bad thing? Either diploma will involve work and there is no point in taking one diploma just because it seems more manageable than another if you aren't clear in your mind which you want and why.

I took grade 8 almost exactly 8 years ago and have carried on playing since. I occasionally think about doing the performance diploma, mainly because of the work involved and getting new pieces to a high standard (I love starting pieces, but am bad about polishing them!), then I decide I don't want the certificate enough to learn pieces all from that list so I haven't taken it yet... there are so many exciting things to do with music other than slave for an exam unless you know you really want it and why!

You can definitely do the diplomas part time: they were brought out because there were many people who play to a high standard but not enough places at music college: so if these people aren't at music college they must be doing something to earn money/some other studies or something; although they could be full time music teachers studying for a teaching diploma, which I suppose one could class as a 'full time' thing. I certainly know that the performing diploma can be done in 'spare' time: I know someone who is doing a full time (completely unrelated) PhD as well as the performing diploma. Having said that it does still require a reasonable amount of time and effort, but if it's something you enjoy doing it shouldn't feel like effort anyway, just fun!

I agree with errad too; make sure you do the one that you want to do not the one that you think will be the easiest, you'll get more out of it in the long term; think about why you're choosing the one that you select: do you want to be a teacher or do you just enjoy performing and want further qualifications? Even if you do want to be a teacher a performance diploma is still very useful: some people view good performance abilities as a very important aspect of teaching, and coupled with experience it could be as good as the teaching diploma, particularly for teaching very advanced students.

Hope your grade 8 goes well!

QUOTE (JuicyJen_uk @ Jun 22 2004, 09:01 AM)

Is it possible to do a diploma, get on with your life, and not do what the professionals do: devote half your day to playing the piano?

of course it's possible to do a diploma in your spare time! (at least, I hope so- I haven't passed yet!). This term I've had 5 AS levels to do as well as my Grade 8 theory exam, as well as lots of piano practice and extra school work (cos of where I'm applying to university)..........and I still manage to squeeze in what is hopefully enough horn practice to enable me to pass the diploma (which is now in 5 days ). Sometimes I have to force myself to fit everything in, but if you are really determined to do it then it's fine! I think you should go for it!
Good luck!

I have a related but slightly different dilemma.

This year I took Grade 7, and I will probably take Grade 8 at Christmas, although I might leave it to the Easter session. After that though, I'm not sure where else to go. By that time I will be at college, doing the International Baccalaureate (possible spelt wrong? stupidly long word, but I guess most people won't be familiar with 'IB'!) I intend to join the college orchestra, but apart from that, I won't have much else going on musically wise.

I have nasty feeling my father will die of shock if I told him how much the diploma costs, and my teacher is retiring anyway. Beyond that I'm not sure if it's really suitable for me to attempt it when music is simply my hobby (and my second one at that) My parents have also made it quite clear, they won't pay for me to have lessons on a new instrument, so what can I do?

I don't really want to end up like so many people I speak to saying, "Oh I used to play the whatever, but gave up, I haven't played for years" any suggestions?

If you're not sure then why don't you just carry on playing for pleasure in the orchestra. You can always do a diploma later after you have finished college. When you are working you will be able to pay for it yourself and take up another instrument if you so wish.

hi!

i'm taking my grade 8 piano at christmas all going well! and after that i would love to do a diploma, but my teacher doesn't well teach (!) that advanced, does anyone know of any good piano teachers in the worcestershire area which could take me that bit further?

and does anyone know if grade 8 theory is necessary to get into music college?

thanks alot!

sorry, am a newbie! 4got 2 add on my reply!

tasmin i really think that you should keep on playing! so perhaps try and do some accompanying work? i accompany a string orchestra, which is good, and can actually be quite challenging! what i would love to do would be to set up a chamber orchestra, but no one at my school is willing 2 do it!

thanks for the suggestions, after college I'm almost certainly headed for University so I guess there will be some musically related opportunities there too, does anyone know how good university orchestras are etc? I guess it depends on the university, bearing in mind of course, that I definetly won't be studying music!

Tamsin- it is definitely possible to get involved in musical life at uni even if you're not doing music. Just because someone is doing a music degree does not mean they are more musical than you - maybe they just couldn't do anything else!

There are usually lots of orchestras so you will be able to find one which matches your talents! The top of the pile is usually the University Chamber Orchestra, followed by the University Orchestra followed by the second orchestra followed by the "college" orchestra, followed by endless others!

QUOTE (tamsin @ Jun 26 2004, 02:06 PM)

I guess it depends on the university, bearing in mind of course, that I definetly won't be studying music!

Why not music?

In all seriousness though, I got really involved in the musical life of my uni (all those years ago), but then it was a very musical Welsh uni. We were very lucky to have three choirs - I was in the music society and university choirs - as well as a couple of orchestras, and there was a lot going on with concerts, recitals etc. Then Oxford - well, that was something else, but couldn't really afford to make the most of what was gping on! Music is a great way to meet people too.

Looking back now, I wish I had taken music as part of my first degree course. In Wales you have to do three subjects in the first year, similar to Cambridge and a few other places. I did Engligh, Linguistics and Theology, but I'd love the chance to do music now. I think I might try another Masters, either at Leeds or Exeter with music and something else... but I need to do a bit more theory first!

Hey
I looked into taking the teaching diploma last year and decided for many reasons it would not really be possible. As far as I remember, you need to be able to play at G8 and performance diploma level, so you'd have to look at the syllabus anyway.

QUOTE

I teach piano to three people, so the teaching diploma looks like my best bet. It sounds like the performance diploma will need more work from what I've found out about it.

I think you also need to be teaching up to grade six level - I have been teaching for five years now and none of my students are at this level yet - are yours? It may be worth doing the performance first, then do the teaching one when you're a more experienced and confident teacher - with better students!

QUOTE (Emma C @ Jul 2 2004, 06:05 PM)

similar to Cambridge and a few other places.

First I've heard of that, in 15 years of living in Cambridge.

Apart from all Welsh, Scottish and Irish universities, I think only about 1 in 20 English universities have the 3 subjects rule.

I also think it's an absolutely terrible rule, unless there really are three subjects you love.

Thanks for all the replies, they've been really helpful.

All my students at the moments are at grade 1/2 level. I've heard that you have to teach students to all different levels so I think that I will look into the performance diploma. It will take a lot of work, especially as my sight reading is terrible. I'm willing to work at it, but I think it will take me about a year to do it. As I'm only 17, and you have to be 18 to take the teaching diploma, I think I will take the performance diploma first. Thanks for the advice!

QUOTE

In Wales you have to do three subjects in the first year,

i did my BMus in Cardiff and only did two subjects in the first year, which course did you take?