Hello every one! This is my first posting to the Forum which I have found very useful in the past for tips etc. Can anyone help with this one:- Recently I have had a spate of parents who wait until their little darling has had their lesson, then tell me the don't have enough money in the house to pay me!! I reply "Would you go to a hairdresser, have your hair done, and then say you can't pay for it? I think not!"
All I get is shifty looks and feeble apologies with the offer to pay twice next time! I think I know the answer to this, but what do others advise?? Thanks everyone.

If you, like me, like to collect your fees weekly, then there's no need to change, except for the likes of the students/parents you describe. You could try making a joke, and saying, OK then, I'll ask my Building Society if I can pay double mortgage next month! If that doesn't work, say well just this once, but if it happens again I'll have to start asking for my fees a month IN ADVANCE, because if everyone did this, I would have trouble paying my bills.
Don't stand any nonsense!

Ann

Try to get in quick before they offer to pay the following week. Smile and say "whoops....never mind, these things happen...don't worry. Just put it in an envelope and post it through my door this evening after you've had a chance to go to the'hole in the wall"

They'll be mildly annoyed that they will have to go out again in the evening, and that might stop them repeating this.

Say it in a understanding tone that says "end of conversation"

Don't wait for an answer, busy yourself with the next student or whatever you normally do after they've gone

Could you ask for your fee at the start of the lesson? If they don't pay up then no lesson. They'll soon get the message - especially if their little darling is preparing for an exam. Louise's suggestion of asking them to put it through the door later the same evening is a good idea, but it might be worth considering asking for fees to be paid a month, term whatever in advance.

I think that would be really difficult to do though. I know I couldn't do that....so hard on kiddo.

I couldn't imagine having to go back to payment each lesson, but I was trying to avoid that topic as it's been talked about so many times and it such great length

But...since you've mentioned it. Standing order is the way to go

I did it once. Parents have got to realise that private music teachers are there for their child's benefit, not their convenience. For the umpteenth time, mother came in and said 'I'll pay you next week', and I replied 'No problem. I'll teach him next week'. I have very few problems with fees now that they are paid a term in advance. How do you arrange standing orders?

I got a standing order form from my bank, filled in my details and photocopied it. Gave one to each parent as a suggestion. They said "fantastic! The end of my problems! You're brilliant! How creative! I knew we had picked the best teacher in the world! Wow! This is superb!"

Okay...they didn't exactly say that, but they did express joy 90% took up the option.

Yearly fees divided by 12, so I get paid during the hols. I also included all books so that I didn't have to ask for any money (only exam fees).

We all love doing it this way, and they often moan about having to find the money for other instrumental teachers. I think most regular bills are paid this way, so why should we be any different. I know I had to pay for sons scout, gym, dancing class by SO

At our local swimming pool if you haven't paid the term's fee in advance by the prescribed date you don't get to have your swimming lessons. I have even seen some children hauled out of the pool and told to get changed as their fees haven't been paid. Parents then get to look rather embarrassed when they turn up to collect their child who hasn't had a swimming lesson.
Maybe you should ask for the fee at the start of the lesson and don't teach if they haven't got it!

Don't stand any nonsense from these people! You've got a right to be paid for your hard work the same as anyone else, would a dentist/plumber etc waive their fee? I don't think so! Don't let them get away with it!

Advance payment is the way to go in my opinion. I've tried both ways and find the regular invoicing keeps things neat and that you aren't chasing bit and bobs of payment, repeat offenders who think a tenner here or there won't matter to you don't think about the other 6 people who have tried it on as well that week! It is shocking that mums will turn up without the wallet and are promptly told to drop it off asap. The steely look I give usually sorts it out before kiddie's next lesson. Have to say however, it's the parents who sit in on the lesson or come in and wait who never seem to give a problem, I think they'd find it far too embarrassing to sit through as I quietly mention to the child that ' thanks for asking, but I can't AFFORD to go on holiday this year. Really? Paris? Hope you and mum have a wonderful time.....'

It can be so annoying to have to get ratty about payment when you've done the work (have a piano playing job and it is a running joke with the bar staff that I have to constantly have to beg for my payment afterwards) and you have be 'nice' so they don't up and leave and tell people what a mercenary nasty person you are.

Quite often find that though that mysterious absenses are more likely to be either the week the invoices are handed out (so they pay at least a week late) or the week payment is due. I still charge...

It sorts out the whole last minute cancellation and losing the payment thing and then having to ask for the payment for the following week to replies of 'oh but she/he didn't have a lesson then...' I can easily refer them to my contract which spells it all out. I will however always try at least to rearrange if I can but if they cancel that, then I charge, but it takes the heat off me if it's for a non emergency situation or they forget, st least I'll still be paid for the wasted slot.

Having said that, there are some brilliant parents or adult students who even pay me on the last week of the month for the following one, as soon as I hand the invoice over, never mess with their slot, tell me if there is a problem or emergency and take my role seriously. These people may not be musical themselves but they still have manners, something I take very seriously with my own lessons.

I know how you feel! I have one pupil whose parents constantly "forget" to pay I charge 4 weeks in advance and last week I finally got the fees that were due 4 weeks ago!!! So of course that meant that fees were due AGAIN today and yes, you guessed it, they didnt pay.............

Also, they had 2 weeks holiday recently so it was actually 6 weeks I had to wait!

I experienced this for the first time ever this afternoon - one of mine set off without having picked up the cheque her mum had written. Aforementioned cheque is apparently now in the post. It's the first time it's happened, and I think it's genuine - I've got no reason not to believe them.

Sympathy to those who are having problems with non-payers.

I too had this problem a few years ago and was even getting people ringing up as little as 10 mins before their lesson - sorry not coming hairdresser or some other excuse. I now charge termly in advance. it works well. I am accommodating if students parents are on benefits etc but that is a private arrangement and definately not the norm.

I charge, and get cancellation fees. Very few pupils forget their money, and cheques arrive in the post with very little chasing. I sympathise with all those who have non payers. It's not right. But my contracts are very clear about fees, and although I show a little flexibility, I think my pupils know I mean business.

Me too. I get my fees weekly, and do charge for cancellation unless a real emergency or sudden illness. No-one queries this.

Yes I also think you should ask at the start of the lesson.
The first time if they've forgotten I would say "Well i'm afraid if you don't pay me I can't teach"
and then if they then forget another time then don't teach the kid.
It's quite rude of them to do that. Good luck.

Quite some years ago I decided it was standing order time. It has the advantage to both me and the students of budgeting and most were quite happy to go onto it.

One or two of my existing students didn't but if they had a good track record that was fine.

All new ones are given a month's trial for a set fee and then need to go onto standing order after that. Over the years, nearly everyone is now paying this way. I still prepare a statement once a year showing how many lessons they have had and adding any extras such as exam fees but it is not a lot of work or worry cmpared with before.

It has also had the advantage of detering those who only ever intended to come until their next big idea!

Is there any chance you can send me a copy of your contract that you give to your parents please?

I have one but am trying to update it to avoid all the problems I have been having.

Charging in advance is definitely the way to go. I have recently started charging per half term in advance. If the half term is longer than 5 weeks then I accept the payment in 2 halves. I have had no problem since I started taking payments this way (thanks to all the help I got from the forum). I have also notice a difference in their attitude to me. They are treating more like a 'proper business' now and seem to respect me even more. Go for it, you won't regret it!

I gather that the topic of payment is not a new one, but as I'm a fairly new member, I thought I'd join in the latest discussion. My information letter to new pupils states that fees are to be paid monthly and in advance. I give my pupils an envelope every 4th lesson, with the amount owing written on the front, adding on any new books they may have had, and they bring the envelope back to their next lesson with either cash or a cheque inside for the next 4 lessons. This seems to work really well. I got the idea years ago from my daughter's ballet teacher and thought how simple but effective it was. Of course, I get the occasional pupil who forgets to bring the envelope, but it doesn't happen very often and they bring it the next week. It also means that if a student misses a lesson because of illness, or if I'm away, it's very easy to change the payment schedule - the enevlope just gets given out a week later.
Hope this helps.
Jenny

Hi there
Dealing with the financial side of things is always hard, but I work around this by charging my pupils one week in advance and making sure everyone receives a letter from me as soon as I start to teach them which outlines my terms of business. It is quite clear to them from the outset that if they decide they can't attend at 10 minutes notice then they forefit the fee for that lesson. I do, of course use my discretion, and it's not hard to to recognise those who are genuinely (and very infrequently) ill and treat them accordingly. For those who insist on cancelling at short notice, it eventually hits them where it hurts...i.e. in the pocket when they realise they still have to pay for their lessons if they don't turn up. I also issue a newsletter approximately every quarter, and use this also as a reminder about cancellations and terms of business.

Hi all!

I have tried various approaches. I started off charging by the lesson, but found as people have said, that I didn't get paid if people didn't appear and sometimes people would forget or come looking for change...and it was all a tad awkward.

Then I tried billing people by the half term, asking them to pay for six weeks at a time. But to be honest I felt a bit like I was constantly asking for money, and as someone who is not very assertive with that end of things it wasn't great.

I now bill all my students three times a year, September, January and after Easter. It means they know where they stand, get fewer bills and I don't have to chase so much cash. They also know that if they miss a lesson (due to holidays or whatever) its their loss, but if I get sick or something they will be reimbursed. Happy campers all round!

I put the money into a savings account and divide it up over the year for myself, so I am covered in the summer. It works really well and I would recommend it to anyone!

I'm interested in this standing order thing though! Maybe next year...

A piano teacher friend swears by the standing order system, and to encourage it he gives a small discount on his fees.
Personally I charge weekly and never have any problems with either regular fees or cancellation fees either. (I have a LOT of students.)
Maybe I'm lucky, but I prefer it that way. I once had someone who paid me monthly in advance (because Granny paid for the lessons and it was better for her), but inevitably the cheque arrived late, sometimes towards the middle of the month. It was harder work explaining that a block of fees must be paid UP FRONT. They are now into the regular habit of paying weekly without problems. Many parents have also told me that they find it easier to budget.
It's whatever works for you.

I must be the luckiest teacher ever... I have very few payment problems. But I do insist on all my pupils(or their parents) agreeing to payment terms in advance in the form of a contract. I keep signed copies of all of them, and thus far have not had to take anyone to court. (But I would if there was a problem)

Lay down the rules at the outset. Payment half term in advance and then start the lessons.
Good luck!

I wish I had visited this forum before I started teaching

Because I started off with a pupil here and there, it was all very informal (this was before I was relying on it as a sole income). Some paid 4 weeks in advance, and some paid weekly. Now I'm trying to put a better sort of "structure" in place, but it would have been much less awkward to do this at the outset!

The poster who said "lay down the rules at the outset" was right! It's easy to soften a bit on the rules you have in place if neccessary, but much harder to toughen up when you've been a big softie

xxx

Yes, you're right Amanda - although to be honest, I think that's probably how most of us start / started.
A friend asks if you'll take their child on, and you're caught a bit on one foot, or perhaps unsure if you want to do this in a big or small way - and you start off informally. It works fine with the first one, and perhaps the first two. Then suddenly you have 5 or 6 who all love the informal set-up - everything in the garden's lovely, till you get one who takes informality too far.

Perhaps in some ways it takes a year or two's experience before we know what we need to put in those terms and conditions!

I can definitely relate to both these posts. Luckily I haven't had any missed payments, just cancelled lessons. I must be more business like in the new year now that I'm desperately trying to get more pupils and get out of my office job.