I'm thinking of entering some pupils for a local festival, playing two contrasting pieces each from this collection. My query is with regard to the pedalling, and I'd love to hear a few other opinions; it's very specific on the score where to put the pedal down, and where to bring it up, but this often means that staccato notes are blurred. For instance, in "Queen Mab", the first piece, the instruction is to play "daintily", but I feel that this effect is lost if the pedalling instructions are followed to the letter. Take bar 4 - my instinct would be to come off the pedal on the third beat of the bar, but the * sign implies that it should be sustained till the first beat of the following bar.

Has anyone else taught these pieces? What did you do? And has anyone got experience of pupils playing in festivals without sticking precisely to the pedalling as it is on the page - especially when what's on the page seems so prescriptive?

Hi there,

It is a long time since I taught these pieces and I will have to find my copy. My memory seems to be telling me to recommend that the instructions in these pieces should be followed and don't worry about pedalling over the staccato.

This isn't always the case with other composers but I think it is with these pieces. I'll come back to you on this one when I've found the music.

Hi there,

I have found a biography of Walter Carroll by Anthony Walker and published by Forsyth, ISBN O 9514795 0 4

I would recommend buying it as it gives a good picture of the man as a very good teacher. Detailed pedalling indications are provided, and you won't go wrong if you follow them.

Thank you for bringing up the question as it has reminded me of a set of valuable books that I haven't used with pupils for a long time.

Thank you to both of the above for the replies. On closer scrutiny, the mood of these pieces IS enhanced by pedalling over the staccato notes; Queen Mab is actually the only one I'm still doubtful about. "Nightfall" is a particularly lovely piece of music. Thanks again - and any further thoughts from anyone will still be much appreciated!

Aaaaggghhhhh - I remember playing these Walter Carroll pieces when I was seven, which was just a while ago...

I remember I really liked them - I had no idea they were still published!

I played 2 of the 'Sea Idylls' at the Leicester forum concert.

Oh I remember those, sbhoa - nice pieces!

I especially like the Storm one.

Are Sea Idylls much more difficult than Forest Fantasies?

No, not much.
I think they sort of follow on.

What kind of standard are the Forest Fantasies? Sounds like something that might be fun to dabble in... I'm at about G4 I think...

I did them after grade 3 to help with expressive playing.

Oooh right, so they'd be about right for being fun probably. I'll look out for them or see if my teacher has a copy thanks!

All his stuff is excellent - perfect for concerts and festivals, and despite the fact that they look old fashioned students do enjoy playing them. Forsyths in Manchester publish and you can order direct from their website on http://www.forsyths.co.uk/ or badger your local music shop to stock them.

Forsyths also publish Cyril Dalmain - another good composer for intermediate repertoire that never "talks down" to young players.

Enjoy!

I like Walter Carroll, but I do think you have to use your discretion with the pedalling in his pieces - if I remember rightly it's the old-fashioned sort which goes 'Ped' and then a * where you're supposed to take it off, and it quite often seems to be in the wrong place musically?
I have sat in on Festival classes before now where one or two candidates have pedalled exactly as printed, but have been taken to task (in the nicest of ways) by the adjudicator for not using their common sense. The best direction, always, is to pedal with one's ears!!

Nice to see the Walter Carroll stuff being mentioned. I just brought 4 or so of his books, including the F Fantasies and Sea Idylls back from my parents house, they been there since I was a kid and was fun playing through them again. I have used one of them for teaching and will certainly use more. They provide a great bridge for pupils before they can get into the great composers. I bet he was a great teacher too. I agree with Jo by the way, certainly pedal with your ears, could be painful lol

Good to hear that. My instinct is not to go exactly with with what's on the page, but I've never been in that situation before at a festival - where the pedalling on the page was so specific, but yet not what I'd have taught if it hadn't been so specific on the page! But it's hard to know what adjudicators will go for, and it is only one person's opinion...we'll hopefully have some fun playing these pieces anyway - which I've really taken to - and if anyone does particularly well at aforementioned festival, then that's a bonus!

Thanks for all of the above repies.

I think he must have been. From Ebay I got his Musical Exercises dating from when God was a boy. The language is very antiquated and the cultural refernces quite funny. "Hold out your arm with the wrist hanging loosely, as if being measured for a sleeve" - just like we all do down at our bespoke tailors before trooping off to Eton. But all his instruction about using arm weight, loosening up the whole arm, it's just spot on. Now my pupils would laugh their heads off at the book so I tend to get them to play the exercises the way Carroll intended, from memory, without showing them the music. Great for developing touch and tone, and getting them to listen to the noise they are making.