I played cello as a child & very recently have been trying to get back to playing again. By that I mean I have dug out Piatti & some ancient music that at 1 point I obviously was able to play (?!).And I'm trying to work on studies/pieces more methodically
Exercises as in Piatti clearly indicate what position to play in & where to shift. Some pieces, like Tartini, Lento e mesto, are also similarly helpful. Other pieces, like the Vaughan Williams, Fantasia on Greensleeves, don't give any/many clues. And I have a feeling that I tend to head for notes without a clear idea of what position is sensible to play in for that phrase. So is this something that I should have learned when I was younger?? Or are there some basic guidelines - eg like shifting/ not shifting at ends of phrases. Or do I need a teacher?

I'd definitely go for a teacher, even if it's not regular lessons. I've only got on to using the different positions in the last couple of months, and have been trying to work out fingerings for various pieces (ones I have not been given to do for next time - my teacher doesn't teach in the school holidays, so I get two months with no lessons) and I find it well nigh impossible on some of them. None of my music is marked with positions and sometimes you can tell from the fingering given, sometimes not. It takes me ages to try and work it out! Quite apart from that, you need to make sure that any potential bad habits are nipped in the bud. Good luck!

I second the advice on getting a teacher, it will be of enormous benefit.

Essentially, though, there aren't any rules set in stone as to when to shift (unless it goes higher than an Eb on the a strings in which case, short of being an octopus, you haven't got much choice), really what you want to do is try to play as much as possible in one position, cutting changes to a minimum (unless you are at a really advanced level and want a certain tonal quality or certain effects that can only be found in different positions or by an audible position change). Position shifts are really down to the individual musician (with the exception of orchestral work where the section leader generally sets them).

So at the outset, try to look at your music and figure out which position(s) will enable you to play the music with the minimum of shifts and if you can at all avoid it, try not to shift position during a phrase, limiting your shifts to between phrases (although I appreciate this isn't always practical).

You might like to get hold of the cello technique doctor too, from Dr Downing music. You can find it here, it only costs a few pounds and is very useful.

I'm not much of an expert, but I hope this helps a bit! Perhaps some of our dip level cellists could help out more?

Good luck!

Allan

andy, in terms of shifting - well, a lot of it depends on what fingering is comfortable for you, and also on the musical effect you're trying to create. If you play open string D, and compare it to the same tone D played on the G string, you'll feel that the tones are different - one might be warmer, rounder sounding, etc.

That was the musical answer.

The pragmatic answer: get yourself some books that are well fingered, and give a clear idea about how and when to shift. The suzuki book three might be a good starting point for you (given the pieces I know you're playing) - they mark the shifts very clearly, and in places have two alternate fingerings for you to try out.

I agree with rosfrog. Get yourself a teacher, at least at first, so you don't develop any bad habits.
As for advice for the moment - you want to minimise audible changes, so playing as many notes as possible in one position is often advised. See if you can work out a convenient fingering that still sounds good, especially for long, legato phrases, where you don't want the line broken.

Occasionally, you want an expressive, audible shift, in which case, you would arrange the fingering so that you shift up to the most important note, so that you make it stand out more.

Try practicing shifts two ways - the first to get them as inaudible as possible and the second to get a nice glissando. Start with a first finger B on the A string, and shift to E and back, taking as much time as you want but slurring the shift each time - first trying to make the transition smooth and then trying to gliss.

Just some tips - I'm no teacher (although a cellist, unsurprisingly). I'd definitely reccommend getting a teacher - much easier explaining things in person!