I've been practising on hofnote and getting more and more confused about what is meant by "dance movement" as the style of a piece.

For example, a piece in 3/4 can be a minuet or a waltz or a "dance movement". When is a waltz not a waltz? Ditto the minuet?

I just don't "get" it...

ABRSM Publishing do a blue paperback called "The Form of Music", by William Cole, which you might find useful. There is chapter on the "suite".

Neither do I Sarah. I just guess.


Thanks for the tip, Patricia. Sarah, if you haven't got the book, I'll read that chapter and let you know.

The only one I know is a walz / mazurka. Both have three beats to the bar, but a walz has the emphasis on the first beat of the bar whilst a mazurka has the emphasis on the second.

Similar clues about sarabandes, minuets etc, just have to learn them all I suppose.

I usually use the key: s-low, s-arabande; m-oderate, m-inuet; qu-ick, c-orrente for Baroque dances. The Waltz didn't come in until the beginning of the nineteenth century, so you can more often than not tell by period. It will usually have a fast, one-in-the-bar feel.

I can't help thinking that for the purpose of exam aural tests you are making it far too difficult.
I've never gone into this section so deeply.
If you can pick up on period with a short list of composers for each you are probably most of the way there.
You are told in the exam what questions will be asked before you hear the extract which makes it easier I think.
You aren't likely to be asked anything obscure and don't really need an in depth answer for high marks.
You've played (I think) a lot of different styles of music..... go with your instinct, I bet it's way more reliable than mine.

That's exactly the same way I use for the Baroque dances.

As to waltzes and mazurkas my teacher also told me that in a waltz the first beat of the bar is clearly accented.

When I'm stuck , and don't know wether it's a waltz or not , I just use my extinct!

That would be great, Emma


I don't know: I'm really going by the tests on hofnote, as I have never done G5 with the new style aurals...

It's not a case of "which dance movement is this", it's that sometimes it asks "what style is this" (I think that's the wording) and gives you options of minuet/waltz/march/scherzo/dance movement (there are a couple of other options too, I forget them though) and I just do not understand what they mean by "dance movement"... sometimes I've thought it was a scherzo, other times a minuet or waltz; I can't hear any unifying feature of what they are describing as a dance movement, and I wondered if I missed something...

Thanks everyone for the help.

waltz - a quick umm-cha-cha,though you can get slow waltzes too. Romantic.
minuet - also three in a bar, but Classical or Baroque in style. Having seen a Baroque one being danced, I can say that it is the most flirtatious thing I've ever seen
I think you'd be unlucky to get asked courante/sarabande/allemande
gigue - compound time and makes you want to cut a caper...no, not the cookery kind
mazurka - uses a dotted rhythm, three in a bar, and romantic or later in style
polka - fast and skipping two to a bar, romantic or later
Correct me on the last two, anyone, if I'm talking tosh - I can't find my music dictionary and they were off the top of my head...

Hi Sarah,

I've just sent you a PM.

The thing I find most confusing is not so much "is it a minuet/waltz" etc; on hofnote, I have had some which I was convinced were minuets or waltzes, but were lumped into the "dance movement" category, and often I really don't see what the pieces which are "dance movements" have in common. I find it very confusing. I generally get waltz vs minuet etc right (and have got the majority of the "what period is this from" pieces correct...) - but every so often a piece is thrown up which goes into this generic "dance movement" bin... maybe I am worrying too much, but I don't think in an exam situation I'd be likely to say "it's a dance movement"... I don't know... I guess it annoys me partly because aural is one thing I have always been good at and I do not know why this is stumping me.

You might be better to listen to real music rather than hofnote - forgive me, because I only dabbled in hofnote briefly, and didn't listen to this sort of thing. The difference between a waltz and a minuet is, as others have said, that a waltz has more of a one-in-a-bar feel. In piano music, for example, there'll be a bass note followed by two lighter, higher chords, with a bit of rubato. A minuet is more stately, and the tempo will be moderato, without rubato. Listen to Mozart's minuets and Chopin/Schubert Waltzes to get a feel for the difference in style.

I think 'it's a dance movement' is not really much of an answer.

If it IS a 'dance movement' I think that it is most likely going to be part of a Baroque suite so waltz doesn't come into it. I think they will also be in the style of a dance rather than something you would dance to.
I don't really see that you would ever use that answer except to show that you know that Allemande, Sarabande etc. could be part of a Baroque suite after having identified the extract as such.

I'm with you on this one sarah-flute, it's totally annoying and confusing. There's something similar on the Grade 4 Hofnotes aural.

I'm glad it's not just me.

I might email them and ask if those questions could be clarified - I can't help thinking it would be useful to sometimes have fewer options, ie to choose between 3 things that were all in a similar style or a similar time signature, which would also help a student to learn the difference between a minuet, a waltz, and a dance movement in 3/4, actually learn the characteristics and compare the similar ones, if that makes sense.

From experience, they are very open to ideas and keen to make their site the best possible. I just need to work out the best way of saying what I mean

At one point I thought that I might too, Sarah, but I'll let you do it!!

you're too kind

Maybe if they get more than one email they will be more likely to do something about it *hint hint*

Ok.... PM me what you write, and I'll do something similar a few days later.

Will do - remind me in a couple of days if I haven't

When I saw dance movements, I thought you meant ones like the mashed potato and the twist!