I am 16 and have been playing Bassoon since I was 14, and have in this time managed to get up to Grade 4 and am taking Grade 5 this year.
I have frequently been told that I am progressing very quickly and I'm wondering if this will continue as I am looking towards the posibility of studying music at a University/Conservitoire.
I have just over 2 years left at school and I know I will have to take a Gap Year (possibly two or three) to even hope to get to the standard of auditioning to Uni, but is this still possible or have I started too late to have Uni as a realistic goal? Also, as I didn't take GCSE music, my school won't let me take A-Level, will this count against me? Please help.
Full Version: University
I dont reccommend taking 2 or 3 gap years just in order to get up to the standard of playing. You have 2 years left In which time I am sure you could get to grade 7 if not 8 if you work hard. This should be enough to get you into a university. Its probably too late to apply for conservatoire, as you have to be above grade 8 in standard at the audition which is in autumn term of your last year at college.
Just read that you havent done and cant do Music........you wont be able to apply to university without music. Conservatoires give you really low grade requirements....something like DDD, but then you have to reach the required standard to get in.
Just read that you havent done and cant do Music........you wont be able to apply to university without music. Conservatoires give you really low grade requirements....something like DDD, but then you have to reach the required standard to get in.
I took A Level without having done GCSE. As soon as I said I'd done Grade 5 Theory, they said it would be fine, and I'm assuming you have that or will have it soon if you want to progess with your practical exams. It was 4 years since I'd done the theory so you'd have an advantage over me! I was warned that it would be a big jump from GCSE but it seems (not that I did the course, so I can't really comment) that a lot of GCSE is box-ticking and A Level is where the real music starts. If you're already thinking about your playing in a musical way and not just playing the notes, some of it you will already know! Another important thing is being able to express yourself, have good essay writing skills, which since I'm doing History and Eng Lit I can just about manage! And, if I'm really honest, memorising things!
However, if the school really definitely won't let you do it then this is going to be a big obstacle to doing Music later.
However, if the school really definitely won't let you do it then this is going to be a big obstacle to doing Music later.
Realistically you'll have to consider getting A-level music for Uni.
Do you think you could take (and pass !) your Grade 5 theory this year? With Grade 5 theory under your belt, you'd be in a stronger position to argue that your school allows you to do A -level music. Speak to your teachers about it.
Otherwise maybe you need to consider taking your A levels somewhere else. Lots of people go on to a local College for A-levels or transfer to a different school.
If that isn't feasible, then if you are considering taking some time out after school, perhaps you could sit your A-level at that time.
Having said all that, there are so many ways to study music. Lots of students sit all their music exams externally, and go on to Uni to study an entirely different subject while participating in the music life of the College.
Never say never. Look for a way through. (But speak to your bassoon teacher, your teachers at school and your PARENTS. Give them an idea of your goals and I bet you'll get the help you need).
Good Luck
Iona
Do you think you could take (and pass !) your Grade 5 theory this year? With Grade 5 theory under your belt, you'd be in a stronger position to argue that your school allows you to do A -level music. Speak to your teachers about it.
Otherwise maybe you need to consider taking your A levels somewhere else. Lots of people go on to a local College for A-levels or transfer to a different school.
If that isn't feasible, then if you are considering taking some time out after school, perhaps you could sit your A-level at that time.
Having said all that, there are so many ways to study music. Lots of students sit all their music exams externally, and go on to Uni to study an entirely different subject while participating in the music life of the College.
Never say never. Look for a way through. (But speak to your bassoon teacher, your teachers at school and your PARENTS. Give them an idea of your goals and I bet you'll get the help you need).
Good Luck
Iona
I apologise to everyone else who has read me saying this several times before, but reading Music at university is about the study of music as an academic subject, and if you're a good enough instrumentalist you'll probably play with various ensembles as extra-curricular activity. Whilst it's true that different universities have larger or smaller performance components in their courses, music at university is not so much about playing the bassoon as it is about counterpoint. On the other hand you go to a conservatoire to study your instrument, necessarily do lots of performance, and the degree is of secondary importance.
That's why entry requirements for universities tend to be AAB (including Music) and grade 5 piano skills (even if you're a bassoonist), whilst conservatoires want CD and a grade 8 in your first instrument.
Now here's what I think you should do. It's not the only option; just my opinion based on the information available.
Forget about reading Music at university - you don't have and are unlikely to be able to acquire the academic background or the keyboard skills.
Ask your bassoon teacher if they think you can get grade 5 theory and grade 7 bassoon by December 2008. If they say yes then studying bassoon at a conservatoire is a real possibility.
Otherwise, concentrate on getting three good A-levels and apply to read one of them at a university with lots of extra-curricular music. Bassoonists are few and far between, and always in demand. Say, for example, you go to Bristol to read History. (The fact that you have bassoon skills to offer might tip the selection balance in your favour over someone who just likes history.) Once there you might join a symphony orchestra, chamber orchestra, any number of woodwind quartets and quintets. You'd spend a lot of time practising and playing with other musicians most of whom probably wouldn't be reading music either.
Best wishes
barry
That's why entry requirements for universities tend to be AAB (including Music) and grade 5 piano skills (even if you're a bassoonist), whilst conservatoires want CD and a grade 8 in your first instrument.
Now here's what I think you should do. It's not the only option; just my opinion based on the information available.
Forget about reading Music at university - you don't have and are unlikely to be able to acquire the academic background or the keyboard skills.
Ask your bassoon teacher if they think you can get grade 5 theory and grade 7 bassoon by December 2008. If they say yes then studying bassoon at a conservatoire is a real possibility.
Otherwise, concentrate on getting three good A-levels and apply to read one of them at a university with lots of extra-curricular music. Bassoonists are few and far between, and always in demand. Say, for example, you go to Bristol to read History. (The fact that you have bassoon skills to offer might tip the selection balance in your favour over someone who just likes history.) Once there you might join a symphony orchestra, chamber orchestra, any number of woodwind quartets and quintets. You'd spend a lot of time practising and playing with other musicians most of whom probably wouldn't be reading music either.
Best wishes
barry
Sorry Barry, I have to disagree in part. Courses at both Unis and Conservatories are changing/have changed somewhat over the years.
Uni still has a high academic content that's quite true. They also tend to require (apart from the A levels) grade 7/8 in a first instrument and also ask for the grade 5 in keyboard. (Although the latter seems a variable as counterpoint and harmony are losing their importance in the scheme of things).
So, from what ClarinetandBassoon has said, I think he/she is in a position to make the grade so to speak - at least academically.
All that appears to be the stumbling point for the moment is the lack of an option to study A -level music. That is hurdle one, and it seems wrong to me that while some schools allow direct access to A -level music without GCSE, others do not. (Also, CB , have you been told that you can't take music A-level or are you just assuming that you can't because that's what the regulation book says? You must approach someone to discuss it)
If CB can find a way to access an A level course, and considering she/he has over 2 years left at school, it's quite feasible that by the end of school CB will also have grade 7 on a first instrument.
The other option to consider is a Uni that has a music programme which includes a foundation year. Most Colleges now run extension courses. Start looking at prospectuses and check their individual entrance requirements. They do vary and some take substitute qualifications.
I think the mistake is to think that there is only one way through. There are many paths, and I think with the right advice and guidance by those who know your strengths and weaknesses, you can work towards your goal. However competiiton can be fierce, so keep your expectations real . That's not to say abandon your goals altogether. You're still only 16 !
Then again, as Barry says, whatever degree subject you eventually follow, you will still be able to participate in the music life of a college anyway - orchestra, ensembles and so on.
Take heart. Take ADVICE from those who know you and Good Luck.
Iona
Uni still has a high academic content that's quite true. They also tend to require (apart from the A levels) grade 7/8 in a first instrument and also ask for the grade 5 in keyboard. (Although the latter seems a variable as counterpoint and harmony are losing their importance in the scheme of things).
So, from what ClarinetandBassoon has said, I think he/she is in a position to make the grade so to speak - at least academically.
All that appears to be the stumbling point for the moment is the lack of an option to study A -level music. That is hurdle one, and it seems wrong to me that while some schools allow direct access to A -level music without GCSE, others do not. (Also, CB , have you been told that you can't take music A-level or are you just assuming that you can't because that's what the regulation book says? You must approach someone to discuss it)
If CB can find a way to access an A level course, and considering she/he has over 2 years left at school, it's quite feasible that by the end of school CB will also have grade 7 on a first instrument.
The other option to consider is a Uni that has a music programme which includes a foundation year. Most Colleges now run extension courses. Start looking at prospectuses and check their individual entrance requirements. They do vary and some take substitute qualifications.
I think the mistake is to think that there is only one way through. There are many paths, and I think with the right advice and guidance by those who know your strengths and weaknesses, you can work towards your goal. However competiiton can be fierce, so keep your expectations real . That's not to say abandon your goals altogether. You're still only 16 !
Then again, as Barry says, whatever degree subject you eventually follow, you will still be able to participate in the music life of a college anyway - orchestra, ensembles and so on.
Take heart. Take ADVICE from those who know you and Good Luck.
Iona
I think it's possible for you to get into university to do music. It would really help if you did A-level though; it tends to be a course requirement. Maybe if you explain that you need to do it to your school, they would make an exception. I think some universities ask for Grade 8 theory if you haven't done A-level.
Just as an example, Edinburgh University (in the top 20 for music, and top 15 overall) asks for: a standard equivalent to Grade 7 in your first instrument, a standard equivalent to Grade 5 in piano/keyboard instrument, BBB at A-level and Music A-level at B. Most other good universities are higher than this though, but it does show that getting in is within the realms of possibility. No offence to above posters, but you don't need to "forget about reading Music at university" - you could do it. They don't all "tend to be AAB" either, by the way; according to UCAS and various prospectuses, Bristol is ABB, Durham is ABB (but offers are often lower), Cardiff is BBB, Leeds and Sheffield are ABC, Newcastle is ABB...and they're good universities!
Obviously there are various requirements as to what grade you have to be too, but you getting Grade 8 is eminently attainable, especially with a gap year.
Do kick up a fuss about doing A-level; if you're serious about studying Music, get that A-level any way you can. I mean, I know I could pay a bit over £1000 and do it privately in the local music school if I wanted, and I'm not even in an A-level country.
Good luck! (And remember that music is something that can be a huge part of your life without having to study it.)
Just as an example, Edinburgh University (in the top 20 for music, and top 15 overall) asks for: a standard equivalent to Grade 7 in your first instrument, a standard equivalent to Grade 5 in piano/keyboard instrument, BBB at A-level and Music A-level at B. Most other good universities are higher than this though, but it does show that getting in is within the realms of possibility. No offence to above posters, but you don't need to "forget about reading Music at university" - you could do it. They don't all "tend to be AAB" either, by the way; according to UCAS and various prospectuses, Bristol is ABB, Durham is ABB (but offers are often lower), Cardiff is BBB, Leeds and Sheffield are ABC, Newcastle is ABB...and they're good universities!
Obviously there are various requirements as to what grade you have to be too, but you getting Grade 8 is eminently attainable, especially with a gap year.
Do kick up a fuss about doing A-level; if you're serious about studying Music, get that A-level any way you can. I mean, I know I could pay a bit over £1000 and do it privately in the local music school if I wanted, and I'm not even in an A-level country.
Good luck! (And remember that music is something that can be a huge part of your life without having to study it.)
You must check and double-check with your school - and if necessary really push the matter.
I've just had a look at my children's school's on-line sixth-form prospectus - they say that to do music A level a candidate should preferably have a B at GCSE, but students with good practical musicianship skills will be considered. Really put your case if that's what you want. Good luck.
I've just had a look at my children's school's on-line sixth-form prospectus - they say that to do music A level a candidate should preferably have a B at GCSE, but students with good practical musicianship skills will be considered. Really put your case if that's what you want. Good luck.
This is the point where you ask your parents to be VERY pushy! You really must pursue your love for music and your desperation to do a-level. You're taking grade 5 this year which is the approximate standard of GCSE anyway. I was allowed to do Alevel without taking GCSE and don't see why you shouldn't have that option. I think it is very possible for you to get where you want to go - if you work hard. Learning theory as well as bassoon will help you progress a lot and it'll maybe help composition too.
I don't think taking 2/3 gap yearsa re an option - because that's a long gap between education and going back to it, you might find it hard?
Well that's my advice done...Hope it helps!
I don't think taking 2/3 gap yearsa re an option - because that's a long gap between education and going back to it, you might find it hard?
Well that's my advice done...Hope it helps!
Dear Iona
You are of course correct. Some universities want grade 7/8 on first instrument and grade 5 on a second instrument too. Then again, Bristol (for example) will accept a merit or distinction at grade 8 theory instead of A-level music so CandB could try that route. And as they're currently doing their GCSEs they could decide to quit school and go to a sixth-form college that will let them do A-level music.
The truth is that CandB can only hope to get general guidelines here and should seek proper, detailed advice from their parents and their school's further education advisers.
Best wishes
barry
You are of course correct. Some universities want grade 7/8 on first instrument and grade 5 on a second instrument too. Then again, Bristol (for example) will accept a merit or distinction at grade 8 theory instead of A-level music so CandB could try that route. And as they're currently doing their GCSEs they could decide to quit school and go to a sixth-form college that will let them do A-level music.
The truth is that CandB can only hope to get general guidelines here and should seek proper, detailed advice from their parents and their school's further education advisers.
Best wishes
barry
Dear Barry,
I agree.
All the best
Iona
I agree.
All the best
Iona
Thankyou for your replies, they have all been very helpful.
In response, yes I have now started argueing my right to take Music next year, and have been speaking about it with my music and bassoon teacher.
Once again, thanks to all, especially for the fast response.
In response, yes I have now started argueing my right to take Music next year, and have been speaking about it with my music and bassoon teacher.
Once again, thanks to all, especially for the fast response.
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