That sounds good, Liz. I´m 100% you´ll get in on oboe

Does Kerioboe have any suggestions for the tempo in the Ferling F minor. It´s marked 80 dotted minim speed which is quite ludicrously fast. The teacher said it didn´t need to be that fast, but it is for Grade 8, so how fast does it have to be realistically?

Sara

Hi Sara, I'm afraid I haven't played the F minor one (in fact I have played more slow ones than fast ones but the fast ones I did play were as close as possible to the metronome speed given). I think Itchy has played quite a lot of them so she might know or perhaps your best bet, since it is for an exam, would be one of the oboe teachers such as Claire, or Oboist.

Hi there Sara
I haven't actually got as far as the Ferling studies in the Grade 8 C list as I'm only half way through the book. (And currently I'm in a Ferling free zone as my teacher has substituted Bach difficult passages for the Ferling )
I can't play the fast studies at the metronome mark printed, but simply try to go as fast as I can without stumbling. Apparently the metronome marks are only for guidance, and my teacher's copy doesn't have any metronome marks printed in it. He told me that as long as fast is fast and slow is slow you can do what you want, but then I'm not playing them for an exam!
Can your son's teacher offer any advice on how fast they should be played for the G8?

Thanks Itchy
His teacher seemed to agree with you that it goes no faster than you can manage and that´s alright. But I´m not sure it would be as Ferling intended and therefore not good enough for a distinction mark.

Any other hints from teachers?

Sara

Oh Gloom, my playing is not going at all well...I have I suppose been away for over a week but I didn't think I would fall this far behind...my reeds seem to have become like concrete, my lower notes are being very tricky to articulate and I feel most discouraged...added to all of this I have a lesson tomorrow...I am underprepared...my teacher does know I have been away, she got a postcard but I do loathe being ill prepared and not at my three hours a day best...curses curses curses...

Oh yes on top of all that my 1st octave key is sticking now and then and my A with 2nd octave has started to gurgle so I have a water issue as well...deep joy...

Well there you go rant over...fingers crossed I will pick things up tomorrow and play like a demon but tonight I fear I shall play like a lemon...

Bah humbug...

regards

Andrew

I know the feeling. The first year I started learning the oboe I went away for a week at Christmas and when I came back found I had gone right back to the very beginning of not being able to play more than five minutes at a time. Fortunately it only took me a couple of days to get back to where I had been before I went away. My teacher says that he doesn't play at all for three weeks every summer and it takes him a week to get back to his normal form. His advice is to play the cor only for the first day and nothing but long notes; on the second day long notes on oboe and cor and from the third day long notes and scales with varied articulations. He says you shouldn't even attempt a piece until you are satisfied that you are back in "working order" again (although I have to confess that I don't have the patience to spend a whole week only doing long notes and scales).


Do let me know if, and how, you solve this one. I also have a problem with the 2nd octave key for the A (but not Bb, B or C).

Hope you have a good lesson anyway.

Sorry to hear you're not on top form Andrew, I'm sure you'll back to your normal playing standard quite quickly, but it's hard since you have a lesson tomorrow. I don't know what your teacher is like after time away has stopped practice but mine is very understanding and encouraging when I haven't had the time I would like for practice and I'm not as prepared as I would like to be. In fact he's more encouraging of me than I am of me in that situation!

I've also been told that scales and long notes are the way to start after time away from the oboe, but like Keri, I don't have the patience for that!

Thanks Keri and Itchy, I will be just fine...it just ticks me off when I can't do things the way I usually do but thats Oboing for you...it has to be said that I am my own harshest critic...but I come from the theatre so I always expect the best from myself...maybe "expect" regarding the Oboe is a bit strong but I always hope So come the morning I shall dedicate myself to long notes and scales for an hour and hope it all comes right in the afternoon...

Thankfully my teacher is great she's very patient and understands that I have been away, she always finds something to do...tomorrow will probably be a ton of sight reading and scales, also working on playing quietly..at the moment I seem to have one dynamic ....mezzo forte...I used to be able to play quietly quite easily but after 20 years off it's going to take a little time to get it back. Of course, and wouldn't you know it, I am playing the Schumann Romance No 3 which is P-PP with the occaisional Forte or SFz so I have a lot of technique to concern myself with along with the phrasing etc. I also think a good baroque study will be bought into play so I am taking the Teleman Flute Fantasies with me...always good for discipline..

Hey Ho...

Kindest regards and Thanks again..

Andrew

I had *huge* water problems at a rehearsal day recently (both octave keys, plus the key between G and A, AND the one between A and B). I posted an enquiry about how to solve it on the American Oboe Board thingy, and got some extremely good tips - I had another rehearsal day last weekend, and followed their advice, and it sorted the problem by 99%.

So: it's a cold weather thing. If you warm up your oboe properly it shouldn't happen. How to warm up: the best tips seems to be a) put your top joint (carefully!) under your armpit for a couple of minutes while you're setting up (I found you have to take your jumper off, otherwise the heat doesn't get through), b) when you're ready to play, spend 5 mins playing *only* long bottom notes, from bottom Bb up an octave. Don't open your octave keys at all until you've done this. c) When you've finished playing (and having of course cleaned your instrument!) wedge your octave keys open with a folded up bit of paper (I'm using a Rizla, followed up until it's about half a centimetre square). Then any water can evaporate out.

It's a bit of a faff and you have to allow yourself extra getting-ready time, but it really works! I'm amazed at the difference.

Well I survived...it wasn't too ghastly though I absolutely slaughtered the Schumann, I couldn't get the articulation quite right in the lower registers (guess I wasn't blowing through the instrument enough)...then as I suspected a heap of sight reading and technique and a good hot cup of tea and a plate of bickies (there goes my waistline ) and the lesson passed...oh a box of clotted cream fudge from Devon did ease the way seeing as my practice was a bit behind...it never hurts to creep a little...

So a fortnight to go before the next and a ton of work to do...

regards

Andrew

Glad it went better than expected! Good luck with all the work!!

I had my oboe lesson this morning and after playing for half an hour on the cor anglais got the oboe out and discovered that things have changed and that stamina has improved immensly I played through the second movement of the Saint Saens sonata and got to the end without feeling as though I was going to collapse. Playing a whole sonata suddenly seems like a possibility and not a superhuman feat.

My teacher has told me when practising this week to alternate the two instruments, playing a few lines on each, so as not to fall back into old ways but he seems confident that the improvement is here to stay. In fact, he said that now I'd sorted out embouchure, breathing and stamina we can start seriously tackling dynamics and in particular playing loudly (I decided I'd wait until next week to say that I have always had problems playing loudly on every instrument I have ever tried and that it is likely to be just as much an uphill battle as sorting out the stamina was).

well done Keri, glad it went well for you...I love the Saint Saens such a pretty Sonata...very pastorale I always think...

I like the idea of playing both the Oboe and the Cor Anglais in turn that makes excellent sense...

Good luck with it all...

Regards

Andrew

Glad it went well

I'd love to be able to play the Saint Saens soon

I had *huge* water problems at a rehearsal day recently (both octave keys, plus the key between G and A, AND the one between A and B). I posted an enquiry about how to solve it on the American Oboe Board thingy, and got some extremely good tips - I had another rehearsal day last weekend, and followed their advice, and it sorted the problem by 99%.

So: it's a cold weather thing. If you warm up your oboe properly it shouldn't happen. How to warm up: the best tips seems to be a) put your top joint (carefully!) under your armpit for a couple of minutes while you're setting up (I found you have to take your jumper off, otherwise the heat doesn't get through), b) when you're ready to play, spend 5 mins playing *only* long bottom notes, from bottom Bb up an octave. Don't open your octave keys at all until you've done this. c) When you've finished playing (and having of course cleaned your instrument!) wedge your octave keys open with a folded up bit of paper (I'm using a Rizla, followed up until it's about half a centimetre square). Then any water can evaporate out.

It's a bit of a faff and you have to allow yourself extra getting-ready time, but it really works! I'm amazed at the difference.
[/quote]

Thank you for this advice.

My son has been warming his oboe up by the "under the armpit" and "long bottom note" method and it seems to be working.

Bump.



How's the Oboe people's progress?



I've had a few buisy lessons lately because of my teacher having to re-mark nealy all of the phrase marks in the Handel concerto (both movements) one lesson and put dinamics in the next etc... so couldn't get much else done

Hopfuly next lesson will be less buisy, so I can do more than a study and 1 piece in the lesson.
I have to do: (in order of importance)
A piece for 'parents evening' concert, which is quite soon...
a piece for end of term GCSE performance (duet, so probably a Albinoni double)
Shumann Romance for grade 7, which I don't want to delay for too long
A piece for CYO audition (in June, so can wait for another month)

and my teacher hasn't looked at ANY of them yet.
30 MINS ISN'T ENOUGH!!!

Also, got Medium Hard reeds now, so hopefuly tone will be better when I get used to them.

I think I do even less in my lessons than you! I spent my last lesson (45 minutes) on just the first page of the second movement of the Saint Saens sonata and I have been working on the first two movements since November (although admittedly I spent about a month playing the cor anglais instead and have only just gone back to it).

I had one of those Eureka moments when practising today (which I hope will still be there tomorrow). I was trying to play the opening note of each phrase with a very gradual crescendo from nothing to p. The crescendo wasn't brilliant (it was too brutal) but I discovered that by very gently increasing the amount of air until the note came out I could then carry on playing for ages - for the first time ever I could play the whole of the second phrase without taking a breath in the middle and still have breath left at the end. I'm still a bit puzzled by this - it just felt so effortless that I'm sure it's something I ought to be developping but I can't see how to make it part of my normal playing as it's not predictable when the note will actually sound. (Not sure if I'm being at all clear here). On the other hand, it was such a wonderful feeling that maybe I'll just play long notes until my lesson on Wednesday.

I hope it will keep My breath controll isn't too good...



More youtube vids - I'm playing with a medium hard reed
Cimarosa
mov1
mov2
mov3
mov4

How are you finding the Handel? My daughter is looking at it but she's a long way from the exam and it's just one of several pieces being played around with at the moment. She generally finds the first movement easier than the second. She really likes the Cimarosa but it's not on the CD, thinking of getting the Piano part recorded for her.

Which study are you thinking of doing? She quite likes the first Bach one just now.

You are doing very well to be near to the exam in such a short space of time. At the moment these are just pieces to be explored and used to build stamina and technique, having heard some of them played in a Masterclass we both know how far she has to go.

The handel isn't too bad. The first movement is very easy compared to the 2nd one IMO. Or maybe that's my bad finger technique...

I havn't had a chance to practice it properly, so I need do it...now.


I'm doing the Bach no.70 at the moment. Because it's both in the AB and trinity syllabus.

The Cimarosa is very good for technique, but I havn't done practice like I would if it's going to be performed, so I've gone straight from sight reading to full speed, which isn't good.

So basically, I have 5/6 months to perfect 3/4 pieces, (3 can be used for ab or trinity), which I can play without too many mistakes, by which time I will want to go on and explore more music... Mozart, Haydn ect...


Playing pieces without the teacher hearing it sometimes isn't constructive for me... Which I guess isn't good.

She always plays a mixture of ones that her teacher is working on with her and others that are just being explored for herself. She's looking at the Schumann and Handel with her Teacher but needs to have a certain amount of independence for Concert Band or Orchestra. In some ways she likes ot learn for herself.

The first movement is easier to get under the fingering than the second but probably harder to play expressively. I found the fourth movement easier than the second.


You could have a look at the Ferling one - I quite like that too.


I find I can work out the notes and the rhythm without a teacher but need help turning it into music and making it sound the way I want it to sound.

There's no rush with any of them so no doubt she'll have a look and switch round the ones she wants to play. She's had a brief go at the ferling but doesn't like it too much. This might change.

Usually when daughter is learning a new piece she will sight read it and then play it through a couple of times. After that she'll listen to the CD. Sometimes she can play about 50% straight off. In slower pieces she'll probably get all the notes on a skeleton of a frame.

Everyone learns differently and there's no quick route. When she was learning the G5 it made us both realise how much further you can go once you have the basics. Even when you can play the piece well there's still things you can improve on and changes in colour to be watched out for. These are sometimes things that the Teacher doesn't always get time for even if they point them out in the lesson.

There's no way she'll do another exam until whichever pieces she and her teacher decide upon are being played as well if not better than the last ones.



Thinks it's similar to this for her but hearing it helps.

The Ferling is one of those pieces that grows on you. When I first played it at home I didn't like it that much either but then I heard my teacher play it and it was so beautifully expressive. He plays it really slowly and so expressively that some of the notes are almost painful. He said it is regularly used in France as a compulsory piece for auditions for professional orchestras as it is a real test of how well you can play. He also said it's the sort of piece that you can revisit periodically to track your own progress.

Thanks Kerry that's really interesting! She may eventually get round to it. She does have a leaning towards playing faster pieces though. At the moment working on her stamina is going ot the biggie more than tone and expression.

I forget to tell you that she has the Cor from the Music Service. It's not in a good way although it is a Marigaux, I've had it to the local reparier and it needs tlc. The top joint is leaking. I'm hoping we can come to osme agreement on even a basic repair. The Bell? is also cracked but at least it will give her the experience of playing a cor. She's already in love wiht it os daresay I'll have to get saving but the prices totally scare me!

Here in Italy , Ferling is used a lot in the Conservatoires and is also popular for saxophone and clarinet. In some way they remind me of the old Klose exercises for clarinet because they're quite short, but so beautiful!

Steve

The Oboe one seemed quite long but maybe I'm confused!

Well, they may seem long if you play them slowly (and they certainly are a test of stamina) but they are only half a page long in the book - there are two per page in the edition I have.

Which one of the Ferling studies are we talking about? My son is trying to learn the one in F minor No. 36 but is finding it frankly too difficult

He´s playing the Handel Sonata in C minor tomorrow for his AS recital. I hope it will be alright, I´m really anxious as usual Sitting through these things is like torture Better not let it show

Sara

We were talking about the first one in C major. The F minor one is a fast one. Has he looked at the other one which is also on the syllabus and which is a slow one (can't remember the number off hand). These pose different challenges (in particular of having enough breath) but it might suit him better.


I hope his recital goes well. Is he playing the whole sonata? The first and fourth movements of this sonata were the first things I ever played in public on the oboe when I had only been learning for about three months. My teacher had organised a Master class with a professional from Paris and I agreed to play in it not knowing what I was letting myself in for. I thought it was just going to be pupils from our little music school (all of whom I knew) but it turned out to be open to pupils from the closest cities as well and some of them were scarily good. In the morning they had beginners and in the afternoon "advanced" pupils. Because of what I was playing I was in the "advanced" group. By the time it was my turn I was so nervous and felt such a fraud that I told my teacher I would only go through with it if he started by announcing to everyone in the room that I had only been learning for three months.

The Ferling studies have a reputation for this. Pieces like No.1 are nice and slow but with a horribly complicated rhythmn, whereas No. 36 has an easier rythmn but should be played much, much faster.

The advice I heard for many years is to take a deep breath and realise that you won't play pieces like this overnight. Set the metronome to a really slow speed. ( Personally I can't use a metronome with No.1 - I find it too offputting, whereas No 36 is more suited to it).

Play the piece 10 times at a speed where you can play it perfectly.

Repeat at a slightly higher metronome setting.

If you make a mistake, go back and practise again.

Don't rush. Increase metronome speed a little at a time.

Easier said than done I know, but for pieces like these, it does work.

Steve

The C minor sonata was the first thing I played for my current teacher this time last year. Really scary for someone who hadn't had a lesson in 10+ years. Having said that, I really enjoyed playing it, but now I dread to think what a dog's dinner I made of that sonata.
I hope that your son's recital goes really well


Can I just let off steam I was practising the Sammartini sonata tonight and my breathing has gone totally awry...I could understand it if I was asthma-ry but I'm not at the moment. Tired and a bit ratty 'cos it's Ash Wednesday and we spend the day eating bread, except for fish pie for supper...so why can't I breathe properly??? I don't expect an answer, it's just good to rant... ***now goes to bed with a mug of hot choc***

Gosh, Kerioboe, that must have been mega-scarey playing the Handel afer only 3 months learning. I bet noone believed you! He´s doing movements I and IV.

He´ll do more work to increase speed gradually on the Ferling Fminor one and probably start the Db soon. I really like the Britten from the syllabus and think he´d make a good job of something like that which is more interpretative. Does anyone else like Britten?

Sara

I wouldn't worry about it if I were you. I have days when I can't breathe right either, for no apparent reason. I just write it off as one of those things.

My son´s performance came together really well last night It really helped to know Keri could play it after 3 months, so I thought well he´s an old-hand compared to that and managed to genuinely relax about it. So that´s the last of his AS recordings done now

Sara

Glad it went well.

Well done to him! He must have worked very hard to get where he is, time to have faith now Sara.

Good luck with any future plans.

I pleased that everything went well for your son He must be relieved that his AS recordings are all done, or is he quite cool about this sort of thing?

As for me, my breathing is now back to normal thankfully. Which is just as well as I have to be able to play Gabriel's oboe in my lesson on Tuesday...also scales have fallen from my eyes.

I have been playing some quite hard reeds, but I've had problems with them closing up, so yesterday I came to conclusion that I haven't been putting enough air through the instrument and relying on my lips to do the work. So I've been pinching too much. Basic stuff I know, I must be some sort of thick saddo for it to have taken so long for it to sink in So yesterday and today, it's been a million times better and the reeds haven't closed up. Which is great.


Claire Thanks for your message. When I woke up on Thursday, I felt much better and decided it was one of those days.
Now for hot chocolate.

Yes he is relieved the recordings are done (for now at least). He is very sensitive and has to have everything just so, so he gets quite edgy and frustrated sometimes. He´s working towards the G8 oboe now possibly in the Summer because he wants to have the exam before applying to unis and/or conservatoires. Loads of work ahead with that and the AS exams, he must be careful not to burn out, he expects a lot of himself. Still good recitals are great for building confidence

Sara

Sara, I do hope your son has a good run up to the summer, and doesn't get burned out by it all. I known the pressure is huge, but not at the cost of health and wellbeing...but then I'm not hoping to go to Uni/Conservatoire. Keep smiling

Well done with the performence!


Grade 8 in the summer!
Good luck
What's he doing for the B piece?

I'm playing the Cimarosa 1 and 2 on the 27th - woodwind parents evening/concert, Handel 1 and 2 in March for the music festival.

I think I might be doing trinity grade 7 in the summer, or just not bother about it and do grade 8 when I'm ready (idealy in November or March)
I could always play the handel if I'm doing grade 8 with trinity, but I don't know if i'm doing it with trinity or ab

My oboe teacher has formed a trio with a violinist and a pianist. They gave a mini-recital yesterday and my daughters decided they'd come and listen with me. When it was over my younger one said "Your teacher plays better than you Mummy... but he looks even more ridiculous"

Love it !!!

You're bringing them up to be honest then!

Well he´s trying out the Poulenc. I hope your concerts go well Liz. At least you´ll have half term to prepare. Also I wouldn´t be in any hurry to skip Grade 7, because it acts as a preparation for Grade 8. Although as you´re learning 3 instruments then it´s quite a lot of money to shell out for each grade.

Sara

Disaster struck and my son has dropped his oboe!!!!! One of the keys has got bent and one of the pads doesn´t make a proper seal any more So we´re going up to Howarth´s on Saturday to try to get it fixed while we wait...

Sara

Dont worry. Woodwind keys are designed to be bent easily and an oboe is easier to fine tune than a clarinet due to the adjusting screws.

There are some great people at Howarths. One is a regular contributor to an oboe forum.

Steve

Oh dear...

I hope they can repair it easily







The person in charge of the Woodwind section of CYO said that the 2 oboists they have are VERY good, so you have to be VERY good to get in practice practice...

Oh no
I hope it's not going to be too expensive. One of my teacher's younger pupils has twice forgotten to do the zip on her case up before picking it up and so the oboe fell out on to the floo. Both times the repairs were a couple of hundred pounds (although she had damaged more than one key).

That´s exactly how it dropped

Sara