Hi - new to the posting thing although I have been reading since the beginning of this year.
Keen to know of any organists online and indeed, your thoughts on the Organ even if you dont play. Cheerio

Hi Grand Choeur
I think there are one or two of us around ............. I play but am not doing a regular job at the moment. I guess a slightly rusty arco would about sum me up ................... I have access to two instruments, a small modern tracker and a much larger older instrument in a fabulous accoustic, I played evensong there yesterday in fact
cheers

Maggie

i love playing the organ... the rich sound being produced by it is so nice... sometimes i play the voluntary.....but i dunn play very well (my thoughts)..

but my music director (my organ teacher) says i play very well and i can achieve high marks... i dunn have any grades at the moment...i am planning to do grade 6 next year and grade 8 the year after... is that possible?

QUOTE (liebe_klavier @ Jul 26 2004, 10:46 AM)

i love playing the organ... the rich sound being produced by it is so nice... sometimes i play the voluntary.....but i dunn play very well (my thoughts).. but my music director (my organ teacher) says i play very well and i can achieve high marks... i dunn have any grades at the moment...i am planning to do grade 6 next year and grade 8 the year after... is that possible?

yes it's possible to do instrument grades as long as you have passed gV theory
your teacher seems to have high confidence in you...... good luck

QUOTE (maggiemay @ Jul 26 2004, 07:55 AM)

Hi Grand Choeur I think there are one or two of us around ............. I play but am not doing a regular job at the moment. I guess a slightly rusty arco would about sum me up ................... I have access to two instruments, a small modern tracker and a much larger older instrument in a fabulous accoustic, I played evensong there yesterday in fact cheers Maggie

hmm seems us organists are a uniquely uncharacteristically silent bunch then..
anyhow.......... exactly how rusty is your arco?

I play organ in church, but I don't think you you count me as an organist
I am what the RSCM calls a 'reluctant organist'.
This doesn't mean I don't enjoy playing, more that I was sort of called into service because it was better than having no accompaniment at all.
I reckon I've improved with time and experience but am still a manuals only person.
Used to be on a rota (varyiable ability levels). Now I am the main organist with very little cover for holidays.

I'm a pianist (dipABRSM standard) and was just wondering out of curiosity more than anything how difficult it would be to learn the organ given that I have piano skills, and how long would it take me to be come remotely competent?

There is a recent thread on transferring from piano to organ - I think it's on the Viva piano board.
You might find some of your questions answered there.
Look for "Organ - how hard is it ?" (don't blame me for the title )

Maggie

QUOTE (sbhoa @ Jul 26 2004, 04:28 PM)

I play organ in church, but I don't think you you count me as an organist

Hi Sbhoa

I was just wondering do you practice the hymns before hand or do you sight read on the day?

When I started I asked for the hymn lists on a Monday

I now ask for them by Thursday (no harm in asking!).
I always go through them before the srevice. Sometimes it is just that I need to check whether there are any 'changed' tunes.
Sometimes there may be one or two which I find more difficult and need to actually put in a bit of real practice.

Occasionally for reasons beyond my control I have had to sight read on the day
As time goes on I think I am becoming able to play many more hymns on demand.

It sounds really good experience Sbhoa, especially as you have people singing along who won't hang around for you. Do you feel that all the experience you are getting has helped your sight reading and your confidence in performing? Do you also play music when people are arriving and leaving the service and if so do you get to choose which pieces?

QUOTE

especially as you have people singing along who won't hang around for you.

Hey! I take no prisoners!
Yes, you have to keep it going but it can be hard to keep the speed constant with congregational singing.
Sometimes they want to set the pace or just lag!

I play before and after the services and choose my own voluntaries.
Mostly keep it fairly simple but this is actually appreciated. Play something simple but musically and you send them home singing..........that is a great feeling
A bit scary when you suddenly 'hear' people listening

QUOTE

anyhow.......... exactly how rusty is your arco?

sufficiently rusty that I can't remember what pieces I played lol

I can generally brush up reasonably well with some decent practice, just haven't kept up serious repertoire in the last few years. I've done plenty of playing, but it's been alongside teaching, so haven't invested time in learning many new pieces

Maggie

Hi organists. I play the organ in a church on Sundays and also for funerals and occasions etc. Just so you know..

Hello all!

I am an organist, singer and pianist because I've found that in order to make a living in music you need about three instruments. Or at least living in Oxford you do. I raced up to Grade 7 on the organ but took my DipAbrsm Singing last week. It was nerve-wracking. The best advice I can give for learning the organ is to find a local church. Success is assured, as organists are often in short supply

Best wishes

Hugh Mackay

hey HughMackay1975...is grade 6 organ hard then...how about singing dipABRSM... i'm now 17 and passed my grade 8 singing at 16...when's the best time to do a dipABRSM?

Could anyone tell me what they think about Jehan Alain's P+F (Organ) I'm interested to know what you think about it.
Cheerio

Hi grand choeur,

I learnt the Alain Prelude et Fugue a few years back. The prelude has to be played with joy and without haste. It certainly has a great improvisatory feel to it, which I enjoy, especially those cadenza-like passages in free rhythm - I found these rather difficult initially but with practice they became more and more manageable. The short and very quirky fugue is also tricky to learn but really fun to play once I've mastered it. Again, there is much freedom about the fugue and it represents a fine blend of the traditional and the modern. Btw, after this particular Alain work, I became quite fond of Alain's organ music and went on to learn his Variations on a theme of Clement Jannequin (a very fine work which pays homage to the French classical period) and his three-movement Suite. I'm currently exploring his Trois Danses.

What are your thoughts about this P+F, grand choeur?

hi ericpark

i am now finishing up the p+f but oddly enough, its the four-stave layout that throws me i learnt his Jardin Suspendu few years back as well as his Litanies

i think i read that the last two mentioned works were composed when he was a student of Hindu mysticism

what say you

cheerio

Hi grand choeur,

I'm not sure if Jehan Alain was a student of Hindu mysticism or not, but he was certainly captivated by it after attending the Paris Colonial Exhibition in 1931 where he was introduced to the music, dance and philosophies of the Far-East. It was these influences which led to works such as the Deux Danses a Agni Yavishta (two whimsical "fire dances" - Agni Yavishta being the Hindu god of fire), Le Jardin Suspendu (a dreamy work modelled on a chaconne - which you should know well) and the second of the Trois Danses.

Alain was clearly influenced by Gregorian modes which he often utilised as a basis for his tonalities and he would sometimes write in a style evocative of plainsong, e.g. Deux Chorals (Dorien et Phrygien), Ballade (en Mode Phrygien), Monodie, and the extremely popular Litanies. Jazz was also an influence. For instance, the first and third of the Trois Danses contain rather delectable jazz-like rhythms.

I'm also very interested in the discography of Alain's organ works. I currently have the complete recordings by Kevin Bowyer, Marie-Claire Alain (two different cycles), Eric Lebrun and James Higdon. Bowyer's and Alain's later version are my favourites. Do you have a personal favourite?

Hi, I'm an organist as well.

I have access to a very good (although electronic!) three manual Copeman Hart organ which has recently had a nice 32' contrabombarde installed!
At present (and I haven't been doing much organ playing recently, more piano) I'm learning Dupre's three preludes and fugues op 7 (my favourite is the absolutely wonderful fugue in . I would like to have a lot more time playing the organ and gaining a more solid foundation in it, my knowledge of Bach is particularly impoverished with regards to playing him. I have an LLCM in organ peformance (Trio sonata no 6, Scherzo from Whitock's sonata in C minor, and Tocatta in Bb minor by Vierne) but would like to work towards the ARCO soon. Unfortunately for the organ I like playing the piano too much!

Dangermouse

Hi Dangermouse,

You’re being very modest. If you could successfully perform the (complete) Bach Trio Sonata No. 6 for an exam, I should think that your organ-playing foundation must be absolutely rock solid! Besides, Dupre’s 3 Preludes and Fugues are formidable works to learn and require a great technique :-) Which fugue is your favourite again? I wasn’t able to tell from your post. I like the B major fugue with its carillon effects towards the end as well as the more plaintive F minor one. However, I am quite partial to Dupre’s other set of 3 Preludes and Fugues (Op. 36), especially the second in A flat major and the third in C major. They deserve to be played more often. Are you by chance preparing for any piano diploma exam since you’re currently giving the instrument more attention? Then again, I suppose you must have already obtained at least a Licentiate in it.

What do you guys think about having a forum for Organists or a Keyboards forum that covers harpsichord, organ, piano?

QUOTE (grand choeur @ Aug 17 2004, 01:45 PM)

What do you guys think about having a forum for Organists or a Keyboards forum that covers harpsichord, organ, piano?

i think a keyboard forum as a big section...it can the split into piano, organ and harpsichord

QUOTE (liebe_klavier @ Aug 17 2004, 02:11 PM)

QUOTE (grand choeur @ Aug 17 2004, 01:45 PM) What do you guys think about having a forum for Organists or a Keyboards forum that covers harpsichord, organ, piano? i think a keyboard forum as a big section...it can the split into piano, organ and harpsichord

we can always call it Klavier - in homage to someone we know hmmmm

hey
im a student organist, and i've been playing for about three years. I wasnt the world's greatest pianist, and in fact I havent even taken grade 8 yet, but I've kept on with organ alongside everything else, and I'm really enjoying it. I've got grade 5 and 6 with distinction, and I'm planning to start work on grade 8 soon.

I think organ is a completely different beast to piano, and the only advantage organ to piano gives is my ornamentation is a ###### of a lot better. I think being an organist gives you much more opportunites to accompany and also to get paid as a soloist/ resident organist.

hornplayer (and organist too!)

the ********** bit was not a swear word by the way. i said the opposite of heaven, I'm not crude !!!!!!

just be careful with the [COLOR=blue]descriptive[COLOR=blue] terms
Cheerio

-Liebe Klavier, it shouldn't be too hard to get from your grade 6 to 8. I did the jump in a year and got my distinction at the end .
Are you planning on taking grade 7 in between?

I also am an organist (strangely enough), recently done grade 8 and working towards ARCO and DipABRSM.

I just find the pieces I really like are on the LRSM or FRSM list, like Alain's Litanies (incidentally does anyone play that here?) so I'll have to bite my tongue and do the Dip pieces first I guess.

I still don't know whether to do Piece d'Orgue which I find rather dull, or whether I should learn the rest of the Trio sonata in E flat and do that instead....

blimey Dave, talk about resurrecting a long-dead thread lol

good luck with ARCO. Do you find the pieces straightforward compared to the Dip? Of course the fun comes in the other tricks they want you to perform. Do you think you will do everything in the same session or do the written work separately?

Litanies is cool. I love playing it. The hard part I find is the fast left hand chord work on the last two pages. Need a nice big organ to bring it off though. Where/what do you play?

Hey bud - I don't create dead threads - are ya kiddin me?
LOL

Has anyone played any of Hindemith's Organ Sonatas? I'm currently doing the first movement of No. 3, but my teacher thinks that I have to continue through the JS Bach books. I know its really good for my technique, but the constant Bach (or if I'm good I get to play Buxtehude!) isn't giving me a balanced view of the organ repertoire thats out there.

Anyone else had a similar "Bach, Bach and more Bach" approach to learning the organ?

hornplayer x

Actually I'm not much of a Baroque person - nevermind I might get some flak from the forum about it. If I must, then I choose Buxtehude.
Hindemith No.3 is the only one I have played but I have recordings of Nos.1 and 2.
Currently I am close to finishing Leguay's Madrigal V for organ... delectable, delicious dissonance... yum yumm

I play the second and third Hindemith sonatas. Will probably do the first for LLCM/FRSM..

I don't think personally it gives a great deal of relief from a constant diet of Bach - being all neo-Classical and that.

Can I recommend some Guilmant, perhaps parts of the first and eighth sonatas to give some Gallic relief?

I do most of Hindemith Sonata 2 but the fugue looks a little daunting on paper!
In reply to Mr Bouffant, I probably will try doing ARCO practical in January before waiting till Summer to do the written papers when I have some free time. I play a two manual (sadly) electric action mainly and also have access to a decent 2 manual Willis.

Good luck with the ARCO! If you're taking the practical in London, I guess it will probably be at St Barnabas in Dulwich. What a great instrument they have there. A real pleasure to take the exam actually (except for the three cathedral organists sat not so far away scrutinising .... I think for mine I had Southwark, St Albans and Exeter )

I can't remember who the actual examiners were -

But the signatures on my certificate are:

Harold Dexter
Arthur Wills
Douglas Hopkins
Alwyn Surplice
Herbert Sumsion
and one other I can't quite read ...
? could it be William Harris??

yes - good luck with yours too!

Blimey Maggie.. I hate to say it but was it a little while ago, in the days when you had to do the whole exam (prac, aural, written) in the same session and pass everything in one go?

How anyone ever managed that, especially FRCO (did you do that?) gets a big dose of awe from me!

yes it was some time ago! but I didn't get it all in one go - I passed the paperwork first time but not the playing.

To my shame I didn't go on to do the FR. - too busy earning a (meagre) living I think at the point where I might have considered it.

What are the requirements for ARCO/FRCO?

details at: http://www.rco.org.uk
but to summarise:
ARCO:
practical: play three pieces from the set lists. technical exercises: sight reading, two stave transposition at sight (using pedals), open score sightreading, improvisation on given themes OR harmonisation of a given theme OR figured bass realisation
aural tests: given by recording on day of practical (fill in a chorale harmony from the tape given the written out theme, notate rythmic differences from a printed melody/taped performance, answer questions on a performed extract)
written papers: Two papers of 3 hours including : bach harmonisation of a chorale melody, answer questions on printed extracts of organ music.. mark up a given fugue with the technical/structural elements, questions on set topic (e.g. organ music of france 1880-1930)

FRCO:
no aural.. practical pieces are harder of course.. technical exercises include transposing a piece of organ music (3 staves) at sight: EEK!! performing an open score piece where the soprano, alto, tenor clefs are used... 2 x 3hr written papers including "write a fugue" AAGH!

Pass mark is 66% in all sections and you have to have a certain number of minimum marks.

It's not easy. It's also a UK only exam (i.e. it's examined only in the UK).. The certificate however is huge.. about 4x the size of an ABRSM one

hope this helps!

Erm... I have a friend here who got his FRCO 2 yrs ago. Good for him.
At the moment my sights are set on FRSM/FTCL - after the intervening annoyances of course

i play the electronic organ and have played it for 22 yrs and teaching it for 12. i have yamaha

I know this thread is long dead, but I'm new here and felt this would be the best place to post my question.

I'm thinking of going for the organ diplomas, having last done an organ exam, ooh, ages ago, but I note that FRCO is not listed as one of the qualifications one can use to go in at a level above DipRSM. I emailed the AB a while back and have had no answer, so does anybody here know what level I should ask to do if I apply to have it accepted as a substitution?

Also, way back in the thread somebody mentioned the left hand chords in Alain's Litanies - a person who should know told me that Alain's original intention here was for note clusters, but his publishers told him to put 'proper' notes in instead. I go down the cluster route!

If I understand you correctly, are you an FRCO?

As for Alain: Clusters indeed!!! Well DUH!!! Wonder who bothers with 'proper' notes anyway?

Hmm-ly,
GC