We all enthuse about the 'Great' composers yet we all go through phases of getting bored/going off some of them, especially if you've heard too much. Then we come back to them. I guess that's why they're 'Great'.

But are there composers that no matter what, you'll never get excited about?

In my case it has to be Henryk Gorecki and Phillip Glass. I've tried! I've been to one of Philip Glass's operas - the one about the egyptian king that I can't remember, let alone spell, and listened to his music. I once saw a tv programme and I knew immediately that the background music was his because it was full of endless mind-numbing arpeggios. As for Gorecki, someone once gave me a cassette of his violin quartets and so I tried to like it. Really tried hard! Had it in the car going to work. Finally had to say: either you go or I go! Yes, his 3rd symphony is supposed to be his best, but I still can't listen to more than 5 minutes without yawning.

So, be honest. Who can't you stand?

Steve

PS True story! Long ago I went to hear the London Symphonia play some contemporary pieces and missed one because I thought it was the orchestra 'warming up'.

I shy away from any flute study written by "Paul Harris". (sorry, Paul Harris, should you happen to read this).

basically everything that makes me want to scream "where's the &*^%$£ tune" ..... does that make me a bad person because i really do need a tune to listen to !!!!

I have tried though and can't really cope with schoenberg or berg et al, and it cancels out some (dare i say it) stravinsky .......... sorry

No, it's pretty normal. Same with art. There's a certain fashion and snob appeal of looking at a white dot on a white canvas and nodding slowly while explaining "He's expressing the futility of the modern ideas of existentialism as opposed to the Socratic syllogistic tradition"

Another true story...promise! Before I was married, my wife dragged me round the galleries in London. In the Tate gallery, there was one room with a lot of chairs stacked against the wall. Everybody passing was clearly confused. We never did find out if it was an exhibit, or... just some stacked chairs.

Steve

Bach

Stravinsky

Phillip Glass!!! You are right, he just seems to repeat arpeggios all over the place and it makes no sense at all!!!

I like arpeggios. But that's probably because I can't compose...so I stick with what's safe....!

I don't like the chaps from the 2nd Viennese School: Berg and Schoenberg etc. Can't get on with it, nor Stravinsky.

Ah....Glass's Egyptian Prince....didn't BBC2 do a prog on that many MANY moons ago where the announcer had to say in VERY straight tones "as this footage is from the dress rehearsal, the lead male will NOT be wearing his hermaphrodite breasts"..........????? Cyrilla will correct me on this as I'm sure we watched this together....

Bag x

Make that two.

Well, I can't remember anything like that when I saw it. It was called something like 'Akanahten'. I may have been too bored to notice any hemaphrodite breasts or indeed recognise them if I saw them.

However, I'm sure you'll explain it all to me.

Steve

Yes...it was 'Akhenaten' and yes, the voiceover really DID apologise that the lead would NOT be wearing his hermaphrodite breasts in the dress rehearsal...

Bag and I still often laugh about it - one of the all-time classics...

Personally I think alot of poncy concerts would be ENHANCED by the inclusion of hermaphrodite breasts....oh don't get me started on this, I'll be insufferable.....

Oh and BTW I can't STAND Beethoven. You can tell he was deaf.

Baggle x

Oh dear Bag! I love Beethoven ... except that perfectly appalling 9th Symphony.

Generally I have the same opinion as Angie; if it doesn't have a discernable tune then I'm unlikely to enjoy it. I've always assumed that is because I still have fairly naive views, and that I might grow into the more modern composers as time goes on. Part of me hopes that I will remain unsophisticated.

(In case I have offended anyone with my views of Beethoven's 9th, perhaps I should point out that it is my mother's desert island disc - all I can say is that I hope that we don't get stuck on that island together.)

Poor Ludwig...

I liked a certain Italian composer until he too got stuck on arpeggios...

I think that everyone's entitled to say "I don't enjoy xxxx's music". I get really annoyed when people say "xxxx's music is a load of rubbish" (especially when it happens to be one of my favourites!).

To people who are saying I don't like so-and-so's music, the one thing I would add (and especially to the younger posters) is to keep an open mind. You may not enjoy it now, but in 5 or 10 year's time it could be at the top of your favourites list. I didn't used to enjoy a lot of the more avant-garde jazz (still don't enjoy some of it), but years later I've come to appreciate and be blown away by stuff I used to perceive as "just random noise". As I've grown to enjoy this I've also started to enjoy some of the more contemporary classical stuff - I think that modern jazz and contemporary classical music seem to be getting ever closer.

(currently listening to Metheny-Mehldau, piano and guitar - beautiful combination of colours and textures)

Well said TSax!

As musicians (and a lot of us, teachers) I think we must always be open minded. My rule is that if I hear something I don't like, I listen to it as many times as I have to to find something in it that I appreciate - something that might be useful to my own interpretation of other works, or to composing. Obviously there will be composers that I like more than others, but it means that every musical experience is worthwhile. If nothing else, aren't the delicate textures of the second Viennese school amazingly beautiful?

I know nothing about the second Viennese school....was listening to some really beautiful, rhythmically so complex it hurts to try and work it out stuff, by the trumpeter Tom Arthurs earlier. Isn't the range and variety of great music available to us to listen to fantastic?

Einaudi

Elgar's choral music

Walton

some Handel & Haydn

Bach Bach????

That would be even worse.

Chopin : it cannot be denied that he was a great composer for the piano.

But I generally wouldn't choose to listen to his music, I'm afraid.

Hmm, let's see...

Minimalism just doesn't do it for me, and amongst this, I include the holy modal yodellers such as Tavener, Part and Gorecki. Music which takes twenty minutes to write and seventy to perform.

Going back further in time, Schumann and Mendelssohn. I find Debussy's whole-tone music a bit wishy-washy as well.

Wouldn't it be a dull old world if we all liked the same thing though?

On the other side, my spear and sword are freshly sharpened for the first person to mention Wagner

Wagner.

does this not make it rather tricky being a music teacher?

<points spear and sword at Scaramouche>

Honestly Nat, I thought you knew better than that...

I don't like his music, you just reminded me of him, hence my reply .

Okay, can we put our differences aside and banish Clementi? Pianists have got to be on my side with this one....

I'm with you! It's just....grr.

Absoltuely Tsax!

The second Viennese school are Schoenberg, Webern & Berg (a few have been mentioned them on this thread already).



Twenty minutes to write? I wish my composition teacher had shown me that method!

Tippett.

In the bin .

eclectic...

A bit of perspective? Perhaps??

All these composers have had a lot of their works published and played professional, often many times... Unless ye who be a-making of the comments are in a similar position then surely the surely these composers who you "just can't stand" are better and more successful than you yourself? Is the reason why you "just can't stand them" really jealousy?

Ofc I'm not accusing anyone (hideously bad form, old squire) but I am advocating Satan and throwing a few controversial questions into the proverbial ring...




In answer to the actual question, I honestly can't think of a composer upon hearing whose music I feel the desire to shoot myself with a musket...

Really I can't!




And stevensfo (I always read that as "Steven's Foe") did you REALLY have a wife BEFORE you were married??

There's always one...

From my point of view, no I'm not jealous of Bach, or Wagner, I just genuinely don't like their music! I'm sure that is the case for everyone else on this thread too. Why should we like every single composer? There's lots of music I don't like, and composers I'm not keen on. I don't ignore what innovations etc they brought to music, I just don't like it!

Does that mean we should only be critical of composers or musicians if we can compose or play as well as they can or better? Surely this would end in a blanket praise of everything on the grounds that "I couldn't do better", and no one would develop a critical ear to hear which of many great musicians or composers they liked the best, and may thus fail to develop as good a critical ear to improve their own playing.

I may consider that some people have weird (or just plain bad) taste for disliking some of the composers mentioned, but hey, that's what floats their boat (or not).

Plus, an argument that boils down to "I'd like to see you do better" is a pretty shaky argument against disliking a composer - I may not ever be able to play or compose like some of the great musicians, does that mean I should never express a negative view of their work?

I'm sure some of it is jealousy - I'm equally sure most of it isn't... many people have no desire to compose, so why would they be jealous enough to randomly criticise people's compositions? It's far more likely they just don't like 'em.

none too sure about having works played or published professionally being any guarantee of something being good or meritorious in some way, but that's a whole 'nother story....

Yeh I'd go along with that. Some stuff just really stresses me out. Serialism in particular, I just can't get along with it.

Offhand I can't think of a composer I dislike in total.

There are any number of works by a variety of composers that I don't like, but generally each of the composers in that variety will have composed works I do like.

That's pretty much my position too. There's lots of music by Vivaldi, Purcell and Monteverdi that I don't like, but every so often I come across something by them that really appeals to me.

You can't argue with the way a person feels. They feel that way. You may wish you could (or they would) change the way they feel, but that's a different matter. People may be able to explain or rationalise why they like or dislike a particular piece of music, or they may not. Liking and disliking are feelings.

Baggle, you ARE funny *still chortling at the thought of poncy concert performers all wearing hermaphrodite breasts* (especially as the ones they showed that Akhenaten would be wearing were just like the ones Kenny Everett used to wear as Cupid Stunt ).

Apologies for veering off-topic again - bit spaced out with tiredness so will take my weary self to bed now...

Me.

My stuff's rubbish.

I can't understand why people go on and on about the brilliance of Mozart. I just don't get it.

Make that three.

Hi,
Actually the email address I use for this forum is the oldest I have and originates from when I was in the Secular Franciscan Order (SFO) many years ago.



I don't understand the problem. It's like you saying "Before I was born, my mother lived in Kent."

You could qualify this by saying "my future mother/wife" but I don't think it's necessary.




Oh no! My favourite composer of all time! I find his music so full of emotion.
Poor old Chopin. Shame he didn't write for the clarinet as well.

Steve

Schoenberg.. I don't need to add more dissonance to my life.

If I wrote for the clarinet, I'm sure barry-clari would be my number one fan!



Yeah - Schoenberg is my choice too.



You'll be out of a job soon if you keep this up!