ps:


Is it Corporal Jones or HHGTTG I'm channeling here??!

I need sleep....

I'm getting a nasty ache in my left hand when I play for more than 15 minutes. It's the muscle in the padded bit at the bottom of my hand (at the base of the thumb) that aches - and today it's really quite sore.

Is that just normal as I build muscle strenght, or am I doing something wrong?

Are you gripping the fingerboard with your thumb?

My hand cramps up after 10 or 15 min as well, my teacher looks at it and ask me to play all 4 finger positions without my thumb touching the fingerboard and I couldn't do that without almost dropping my viola when pressing down on the string. So I had to readjust my shoulder rest and to rework my wrist positions to avoid gripping (or hardly) the instrument with my thumb.

I haven't experienced anything like that, Jane, and I don't play anything else at all, so I assume there must be either a postural prob there, or that you['ve had an injury that you didn't notce at the time (slept funny on it perhaps) and that just shows up when playing viola. Has it always been like that since you started on va, or popped up later.

BTW guys, got my Conservatoire and she's GORGEOUS! She actually sounds like a viola and is about 3 foot deeper sounding than my old cheapie (which was about equivalent to Stentor Standard, so lower than Student 1!). The notes I found muffled when I played my old one are now much clearer, (so it was the instrument, not me - at least not entirely me anyway!! ) and she looks lovely. Will update the blog with a photo of her soon.

I'm not gripping, no. I do get slightly arthritic aches in my hands - at some point, I guess I'll have arthritis. I'll get my teacher to have a look, and make sure I'm not doing anything too weird.

Yeah, I was gonna suggest asking Teach too.

Arthritis? Oh joy! Poor you. I did read more than once that minisming/elminating dairy foods can dramatically reduce arthritic complaints. They're highly inflammation inducing foods for humans, so they are indicated in this kind of thing. Might be of use to you. Hope so!

Looking forward to meeting you in Leeds in a few weeks!

Mind if I join you? I've just received my Gliga Genial 1 from Liz (what a nice violin to start with!) and so here I go into the unknown, learning violin at 28. (Well, it's not totally the unknown, as I used to play cello way back when, so I'm at least familiar with a stringed instrument. )

Still have to find a teacher, though. The thing about living in London is that, although there are a lot of teachers here, that can also be the problem: who to get in touch with? I've bought a tutor book ("A New Tune A Day" for violin) but a teacher can spot things you'd never notice, and you can't talk to a book.

Hello and welcome to the 'upper strings beginners' thread
we are very happy to have you join us!
I'm not sure if I can reccomend a teacher on the forums or not so better PM me if you live in the south of London.
Anyway, I also have a new tune a day but ended up not using it much as my teacher makes me use different books (so...better you don't buy anymore books until you get a teacher, that way if you decide together with him/her to use some specific books you won't have to buy even more!).
Keep us posted on your progress and do share your joys and frustrations with us as you go along

Thanks for the welcome.

To my surprise, I'm able to produce a nice, non-scratchy tone on the open strings. But as soon as I attempt to play an E on the D string, the neighbourhood cats want to sue me for cramping their style.

It's kind-of nice to be a beginner again, though; gives you a fresh perspective on things.

Hi Choci!

Glad to have a newbie on this thread! I'm a beginning violist who had her first session playing with a piano playing friend yesterday. We were pretty awful (my fault) but it was lots of fun and I'm keen to do it again as soon as poss!

Love your sig line. It'll certainly be true of me....

Hi to you all,
I've been reading about your progress, on and off, since I got my violin in March. I feel I know you already and I've found lots of the stuff you've talked about, really helpful.
So far I've been teaching myself but would really like to find myself a teacher now. And that's where I'm having problems. I've left messages on answer machines and voicemails but am not getting any nearer to finding someone to teach me because noone returns my calls.
Does anyone know/can recommend a teacher in the Huddersfield area, who I could at least try to contact?

Hello and welcome to the upper strings beginner thread
I am based 'down south' so unfortunately don't know anyone around your area, I take it you have tried www.musicteachers.co.uk already?
I must say it is not nice that they don't call you back have you tried to contact them via e-mail (if they have one advertised)? that is how I contacted my violin teacher. Different sort of communication may get different responses you never know, even though there is no excuse that they don't call you back, it does no good to their 'reputation', what will they do the day they need students?
Anyway, keep visiting the thread and tell us how you are getting on.
Which book are you using and how far have you got to so far?
Welcome again
Jo

Welcome tweeksy!

What jojo said!

Just thought I'd add my two shilling's worth and say how absolutely fantastic it is to read about people who have just started playing. I remember having all the same problems as you, but when I started off I had a pretty uninterested teacher who didn't push me on at all, so for two years I was lumbered with bad techniques and almost non-existant confidence. (Oddly, i didn't give up though!) When I finally got passed on to another teacher, I went from Grade 1 to grade 7 in four years, and so I think it's really important to find a teacher with whom you can work and communicate well with, and not feel intimidated by!

...I remember reading something on one of the earlier pages about keeping the bow straight. My advice for this (as I couldn't do it either when I started!) is to lift your wrist, move your whole arm and tilt the bow slightly towards the bridge. Not sure if that'll help you, but hope it does!

Thanks for the welcome, I'll try your suggestions.

Yes I do have trouble keeping my bow at 90degrees to the strings. I'll try what you've said Miss Ross about lifting my wrist and moving my whole arm. I had heard about tilting the bow and try to remember to do it. It's amazing how much better it sounds without the screech! There seems to be so much to think about all at the same time; it'll be great when it becomes second nature.

My book is "Mel Bay's First Lessons, Violin" by Craig Duncan. Has anyone else got this one? I feel quite pleased with my progress (hope that doesn't sound bigheaded!! but being able to produce something that has an element of tune to it feels really good). I've been going backwards and forwards over the first 9 or 10 lessons but don't feel I want to try going any further before I get a teacher to make sure I'm learning the correct techniques etc. Another thing I have to remember is to cut the nails on my left hand; long nails aren't very helpful to hold the strings down!

Try musicteachers.co.uk

My teacher is a violinist and, although she's about to move to M'cr, she might be interested in someone in Hudds. I can ask her if you like??

Never heard of it.
I am using (as my teacher got me to use them) Fast Forward and Shooting Stars (started originally with stepping stones and waggon wheels). I did buy a copy of 'A new tune a day', Abracadabra and Eta Cohen, but never used them at the end.
I am also using the scales/arpeggios book from abrsm and the graded pieces from abrsm to get ready for my exam in June/July (taking grade 1), but I am not letting that stress me out, I don't even practice my pieces every day but every other day.

Jo, I'm wondering if you've got every basic violin tuition book in the shop!!! You must have spent a fortune on your sheet music so far, to say nothing of the piano stuff too...??

How's it going anyway? Still getting in lots of practise? Can't say that I am. Haven't touched violette since my lesson last Thurs, but then being flat out all Fri, then away until Sunday night didn't help. I just didn't feel like it today. I think I'm a lot more keen on prac when Sir is at home.

Anyone else have that problem? They wnat to prac less when there's someone else in the hosue? He's light on work for the next few weeks, so I might either get v little done, or have to get over the problem!!!

I do love my music books! If I could I'd have more....I have a few for piano too! At the moment I am holding back from buying more
I also love going to good music shops and spend hours looking at them
I am still (most times) practice every day, minimum half an hour up to an hour when I can 'afford it', but with my shift job at the hospital I do find that in at least half of the weeks I miss a day practice (so lets say I practice 6 days out of 7).
Nope, I can't say I only want to practice when there are 'others around', maybe you should 'kidnap' your other half, tie him to a chair??? that way you'd get more practice in??

Whoops! I made a typo in the firts mention of this and not in the 2nd, so I contradicted myself! I find it easier and freer to prac when he isn't here!! No wonder it sounded odd - obsessed with an audience!!!!!

I've got used to it now, but when I first started learning I hated playing in front of people. I still do find it easier to express myself when I'm on my own. There are also only certain people I can play in front of lol. Normally, these are the family members/friends who are most interested in what I'm doing and don't have a lot of musical knowledge themselves... what can I say, I like to show off!

Thanks elisabeth_rb . I thought I'd found a teacher but am still waiting for a reply after I left a message on her voicemail . Your offer of asking your teacher if she might be interested sounds great. M'cr is only just "over the hill" from where I live (depending on which bit of M'cr it is she's moving to). Please ask for me. Look forward to hearing from you.

Will try to remember to do that for you during my lesson tomorrow.

I s'pose I should update myself here.

I found a teacher! Actually, she was recommended to me by another forum member and is a forum member herself. I'll let you guess who it is. Lessons start on June 5th.

The weird thing is, I'm not practicing that much because, being new to the violin, I'm worried about picking up bad habits that'll take time to undo later. I'd rather be shown how to properly hold the violin first, and get good posture and stuff ingrained from the start. Hey, I want to do this properly.

Also, I'm revising for a G5 theory exam on Saturday (the teacher advised us to brush up on everything from G1 to G5 ) and that along with the warm weather is making me soooo tired lately. If I never see another pink or blue book again after Sat, I'll be quite happy.

Why pink and blue??

Well done on finding a teacher!

Pink and blue are the colours of the book covers: The AB guide to music theory (part I is pink, part II is blue )
but part II is for grades 6 to 8 so if you are taking grade 5 why bother? just out of interest? that's ok

There's actually some overlap between the two books, and some of the G5 stuff is (or at least used to be... was a long time ago!) covered in the second book.

Yep, some of the stuff we've been doing in class is in the blue book.

oh I see......

by the way, while I'm here.....both myself and my son have been learning violin since January...lately we were getting really really eager to practice together and play some easy duets BUT we had only one violin (he uses mine you see), so got fed up of situation and went out to buy one of those 'rainbow' violins (the makers are based 15 mins drive from my house)...I got the blue one! Why not a stentor or something on that line? well, my son fancied a blue violin and I have done a search through older threads and it seems that some people manage up to grade 4 on a rainbow violin so...as my son is only just starting to learn his first piece from the grade 1 pieces it will be a little while before he gets to grade 4, by then he can upgrade to something more serious....in the meantime he can use my violin (which is good up to and past grade 8) for his exams and 'serious practice'
Today I had a chat with him and he tells me he seems himself more of a 'fiddler' than a classical violinist in the future! As for me: I want to learn as many things as possible, both classical and fiddle

My niece (a nearly-twelve year old beanstalk who needs to move up sizes from the county music service's three-quarter size instrument) told me that she wants a purple violin as a birthday present, because "everyone else" has coloured violins and she doesn't want to be "uncool".

I'm trying to persuade her that the Gliga ones with butterflies on are far cooler.....

This shop in the US sells Gliga violins with loads of wacky designs. Perhaps Liz can get them too to special order.

http://www.violinslover.com/violinsartisticdesign.php

Thanks Earplugs, that's a great link

Oooh the butterfly ones are so pretty!

If I had money to throw around....

Don't you agree they're far nicer than the boring single colour jobbies?

Oh definitely! They're so pretty - cool but also somewhat distinguished! D'ya think she'd go for purple butterflies?

I've just been looking at earplugs' link... probably not a good move

I am going to be really unhelpful in that I wouldn't know where to start looking, but I'm sure I've seen fiddles that have been varnished to an unusual colour, as opposed to being painted (which I understand affects the sound?) - not such a solid colour, of course, but it's a coloured violin that still sounds reasonable. Wonder if Gliga do them?

Friend of mine who's a luthier makes very pale violins, only not very often these days as apparently conductors don't like them but I can just imagine one glazed in purple with butterflies on it so maybe Gliga could do such a thing...

Actually...I know I'm the 'boring one' here but I like the plain coloured ones a lot more (well, a 'traditional violin' to me is the best, but if I had to choose a coloured one then I'd go for plain). sorry to be a 'party pooper' (am I allowed that word on here? )

Gliga "Peacock" pattern for me, or perhaps "Giraffe"

Most conductors would be ok with that I think!

I like butterflies, but I wouldn't want more than just one small one on the front. I guess I'm with Jojo and like the traditional look.

Anyone know of any teachers in the Ballyclare and Belfast area of Northern Ireland?

I'd definitely prefer a traditional violin (as indeed I have!) as my main fiddle, but if I had money to throw around I've love a half-decent novelty one just for fun

violin_18: noodle is a string teacher in NI (I think...) - don't know which area exactly though

I'll keep a look out for noodle on this forum then. Thanks Sarah_flute

Is it usual for the right hand to hurt while holding the bow, until the hand gets used to that position? Today I did nothing but practice my bow hold and play open strings. The top arch of my wrist became quite painful at times, at which point I stopped of course.

Incidentally, I found a nice webpage on the Suzuki method of holding the bow, illustrated with pressure points. I've seen lots of diagrams on how to hold the bow (which are often quite varied in their approaches), but never one with pressure points. It seems kind of obvious given that you're holding the bow, not levitating it Jedi-style.

pass!
don't know the answer to that one...
I didn't have any pain/discomfort in my right hand when learnt to hold the bow, but I might just be 'lucky'??
I do remember getting a stiff/sore neck after 10 minutes but that got better day by day and by the time I was in my second weeks of learning I could practice half an hour without stiffness, now that I am 5 months into learning (almost) I can practice an hour before I need to rest...

In a word, no! Your hand and wrist should be relaxed at all times. It could be that you've got the hold right in terms of what finger goes where, but are holding your wrist too firmly. Try to relax it instead. You can tell the difference as the tone is scratchy when your wrist is tense and mush purer when it's properly relaxed.

What does your teacher think, btw?

Hello everyone

just posting on my progress as I *think* I have not done it in a little while (checks posts to make sure didn't do this just a day or so ago ).

I felt a 'little stuck' for about a month with my violin playing, feeling I was in a 'plateau' (and I probably was, after all plateaus are a normal part of life in all things we do, they are 'inevitable').
But now I feel like I am coming out of it!

I still play in first position only but I have learnt all my scales for grade 2 as well, on top on what I already knew for grade 1 (as doing exam for grade 1 in july), and I wish I did this a lot sooner as I really find scales help me with learning pieces faster/better, I just LOVE scales!

So, in first position still but I use all imaginable finger patterns out there so I have 'exhausted' first position I should say and I feel well ready to learn the next position (will it be second or third??? I will ask my teacher next week at my lesson to teach me the next one in line).

My pitch (is it right to call it pitch?) is overall very good (little mistakes corrected straight away only happening occasionally, my teacher 'offered me' those stickers to go on my fingerboard at my first lesson but I said NO, I wanted my ear to learn not my eyes, so I have not used them) and I now find that when I learn a piece I no longer read my music and think of notes as : A1 - A2 and so on, but I think of C# and I hit the right space with my finger!

Is there anything I find still difficult? well, of course there is, but it is mainly the 'fine tuning' of my playing, like giving full expression to all of my pieces (some I am good, some where I jump with my fingers all over the place and require more of an effort, I concentrate more on my left hand and expression goes out of the window a bit ), also getting fluent in some of the harder pieces and so on but I know I will get there soon.

I think I am ready for the new challenge of a new hand position and perhaps learn a new 'bowing technique'?
I am just now finishing my book 'Fast Forward' (on last page) and will start on my last one 'Shooting Stars' by the end of the week. I don't know what I will do when I come to the end of that one but it will take me at least 2 months to finish it off maybe? so plenty of time to find out.

thanks for reading and...looking forward to read on how you are getting on too (challenges and achievements)

Jo (going through a 'I enjoy this' violin phase, getting ready for the 'I hate this' phase which will inevitably come up at some point )

Update from me is:

Motivation, enthusiasm and progress all pretty much zero.

Too much work on in all areas of life at the mo and wishing I hadn't entered for this forum concert on Saturday as it's far too soon for me and has been distracting me from actually learning to play.

Hope that things will improve once the concert is over, my workload begins to decrease, I'm sleeping better and feeling more interested in life. Have been tempted to give it up, but I know it's just a lull and a general bad patch (good old depression and anxiety, which treatment starts for soon, so there is hope!! ), so there's no need to overwhelm me with 'DON'T give up messages/replies!!!' I shan't give up, I shouldn't think. Just need to find joy in my music and in general again before I can feel more ooomph.

Reading your enthusiastic and progressive post made me feel quite bad, Jojo!!!!! You keep it up though and get a distinction, girl!

could it be that the prospect of the concert (is it really this saturday already?) is making you feeling too nervous? so much so that it's helping you feeling even more de-motivated and and even less enthusiastic?
I know it is also overall a 'sticky' patch you are going through (like you said, lots of work and anxiety/depression) and not just the concert thing...
I am looking forward to that time (soon) when you will feel more 'energised' again...
'apparently' hobbies in general and learning music are things that are supposed to help us in life by giving us less depression, more brain activity etc so not giving up the viola not only will mean that you will enjoy it again soon enough but it is probably going to bring an extra spark in life in the long run
things WILL improve if you won't give up (like you said you won't, you go girl!!!)

No idea, haven't had the first lesson yet. It could be that my wrist is too tense, because when I play drums my wrists are a lot looser (and don't hurt). I guess it's just a case of getting used to the "bowing position".

By the way, you'll be playing your concert on the same day as Elgar's 150th birthday. Give it your best shot and make him proud.

Jojo: Yup, the concert is too much too soon. You can tell how uninterested I am as I've practiced stuff all for the ensemble piece (still, I have also been ill). I suppose I will enjoy it, but I wish I was doing something else with my friends today instead. I wouldn't have this headache from the pure frustration of not being able to get out of something I no longer want to do!

Choci: I would wait until you start lessons before doing any more violin playing. You're at risk of developing bad habits or worse if you're getting pain. You may not even be holding your bow and instrument correctly without help! When do you start formal tuition?

I woke up very late today as I went to bed at 3am!!! So now my reply is too late...you might be at the concert by now?
I was going to say: would it be a big mess if you decided to cancel? how much are they relying on your presence? on the other hand...maybe having to do it will turn out at the end to be a good thing? maybe you'll come out of there feeling it was the most dreaded thing but after all it was the best thing you've done in a while?
My thoughts are with you today