Unfortunately I can't buy myself a real piano for a number of reasons, so i've had to resort to the next best solution; a digital piano. I bought myself a Yamaha P70 which should be coming in the next few days...It would be cool if people that do own digital pianos share their views about how good their respective digital pianos play/feel... Anyone else have the P70??

I have a really old Clavinova, from 12 (?) years ago. Back then, it seemed like an okay substitue, but after having played on many pianos, I can quite safely say that having a real piano is much much better. That said I haven't tried many digital pianos, but the one thing that bothers me quite a bit is that they don't replicate the touch very well at all, it is quite different on a real piano, especially on a grand piano. I wouldn't know much about the dynamics anymore (the ones on mine aren't great) but I'd guess that they've improved a lot in 12 years.

They have indeed improved a lot, and if you were given a choice between a decent digital or a rubbish acoustic piano, you may change your mind.

I have a friend who got a Clavinova (forget which model) a few years ago and loves it. Yes, sure, he'd love a really great acoustic piano, but it's so much better than what he had before, it's small and relatively portable, and sharing a house with next door neighbours only one thin wall away, it's been a godsend for him, and far more affordable than a great acoustic (which he wouldn't have room for) would have cost.

Unfortunately the one i bought, the P70, is Yamaha's bottom of the range (at £400!!!!) but i can't afford anything else...and having tried it out in the store it leaves a bit to be desired...i played some as expensive £1800 and the difference was MASSIVE, and, as rightly said above, digital pianos of that quality are possibly better than cheap acoustic ones. What really bugs me is that, with all the technology we have today, they still cant get a key weight that feels like the real thing, how difficult must it be? Anyways at least i can play with my headphones and annoy just myself!

I personally have a great dislike for digital pianos and keyboards, although I prefer them when recording. I would like to have a proper expensive, say for example Roland Digital, but that would set me back a few thousand which I don't have! However, in terms of being able to turn the volume down- invest in a new piano with a third pedal Sorted!

To be honest i don't like digitals either but for me it was that or nothing! Being at Uni at the moment every year of my degree i've lived in different accommodation - having to move all my stuff back and forth to london at the end of every term too! So I really don't think an acoustic is feasible...but when i graduate...!!!!

oOo and when you'll graduate you'll buy the lovelist, sexiest, sweetest piano going!!!

I have the P90 which I bought to plug into my computer. I know what you mean about the touch but I like the fact that its (fairly) portable and its got some useful features like transposing and a (very loud) metronome.

What do you mean plugging into your computer? Does that have anything to do with this MIDI thing, cos i don't know what that is either....

The top end Clavinova (CLP280) was wooden keys and Graded Hammer 3 keyboard, and it feels great!

Although not as great as a Steinway, or even a good upright, it's way better than some acoustic pianos I've tried.

I must say, though, that spending £400 on a digital instrument then comparing it to a £2000 acoustic one is never going to be a fair comparison. (Not that I'm saying that's what you have done, Lukino, but I come across this quite often and I'm just making a general point!)

Compare the digital pianos to acoustic ones you can pick up for the same price, then consider the size, space, sound, advantages and disadvantages of digital v acoustic (stuff like metronomes, recording / playback facilities, different sounds [not only different instruments, but piano settings like reverb, decay, brightness etc], silent practice etc) and only then can you make a fair comparison.

After all that, you may eventually realise that digital pianos and acoustic pianos may be different but, as with any instrument, it's personal preference that decides which is better.

But back on topic, I quite like the P70 for what it is - an entry level piano substitute. Good for learning / practicing but you might grow out of it quickly.

Quite so!

I don't know the P70, so I can't make any comments about that. However, I have a Kawai L1. I bought it a couple of years ago for £760. I absolutely love it, it has weighted keys and feels much better than an acoustic of a similar price.

My living circumstances at the time meant that I had no choice other than a digital. Luckily for me circumstances have changed and I've been able to buy a lovely acoustic. I still use the digital from time to time, particularly when I am learning a piece with hands separately.

My teacher told me that my playing came on my leaps and bounds when I got my Kawai. I hope that you get similar results from your P70.

[quote name='Knew Bee' date='Apr 16 2007, 05:43 PM' post='495724']
The top end Clavinova (CLP280) was wooden keys and Graded Hammer 3 keyboard, and it feels great!

Although not as great as a Steinway, or even a good upright, it's way better than some acoustic pianos I've tried.

I must say, though, that spending £400 on a digital instrument then comparing it to a £2000 acoustic one is never going to be a fair comparison. (Not that I'm saying that's what you have done, Lukino, but I come across this quite often and I'm just making a general point!)

Compare the digital pianos to acoustic ones you can pick up for the same price, then consider the size, space, sound, advantages and disadvantages of digital v acoustic (stuff like metronomes, recording / playback facilities, different sounds [not only different instruments, but piano settings like reverb, decay, brightness etc], silent practice etc) and only then can you make a fair comparison.

After all that, you may eventually realise that digital pianos and acoustic pianos may be different but, as with any instrument, it's personal preference that decides which is better.

But back on topic, I quite like the P70 for what it is - an entry level piano substitute. Good for learning / practicing but you might grow out of it quickly.

I have the CLP280PM with wooden keys, It was very expensive £2,400 and i had to borrow some money to be able to buy it. digital pianos have come a long way in the last ten years, and this model is excellent. i have an upright too but it seems that 95% of the time I have to use the practise pedal, because i live in an apartment with paper thin walls. I do think that digitals are a bit harder to play though.

I stopped playing when i was about 14 and am buying the p70 now (at 19) to begin again, so i really hope it does the trick for me too!

I plugged it into my computer so I can use it with my music software - I play the music on the P90 and it comes up on the screen (you need some software and another device to do this). It works ok but it was a real headache setting it up - I tend to use my PC keyboard these days and use the P90 as a normal piano.

Digital pianos are great for lots of things but if I had to choose I much prefer my acoustic piano.

I have a Roland HP3.

It cost me about £900 three years ago.

It isn't a piano, but it is adequate for my piano practice (I'm never going to be an expert pianist...)

And it is useful being able to scan music into the laptop, plug a MIDI connector from that into the piano and have it play accompaniments to works I'm learning- far cheaper than hiring an accompanist.

Hope you have lots of fun with your new toy! I'm lucky enough to have both digital and acoustic pianos at home. I don't think it's fair to make comparisons between the two as they are so different. I enjoy having the digital because I can record things (handy for accompanying myself). I also use the digital for quite a few gigs where the resident piano is horrible - much better to play 'the devil you know'. It's fun having some other voices to play with too. And it will always stay in tune! I can adjust the tuning on my Yamaha if I'm playing with others and need to go up/down a bit. Make sure you read the instruction manual cover to cover - you'll discover all sorts of things your keyboard can do that you perhaps wouldn't even have thought about eg splitting to play 2 voices etc.

ME ME ME
I have a P70, bought it last november and am REALLY happy with it!
I am now preparing to take my grade 2 in november (started as an absolute beginner) and I can say that it is the closest you can get to playing a real piano, it has fully weighted keys, touch sensitivity etc, it has a good feel (has a pedal of course) to it and I don't seem to 'suffer' from learning on it, my teacher is VERY pleased with the way I am getting on. I am sure it should serve me well at least up to grade 5 or ?more?
One day I will buy a piano, but not sure I can do this for at least another 2 to 3 years (no space where to put it but we are planning a house extension in next 3 years then I should have the room for it).
Jo



Oh, I have never tried anything 'expensive' so I don't know really, all I can say that 'the bottom of the range' P70 is to me very good so just as well I am happy with it

We got our son a Yamaha Clavinova CVP-96 when he was 9 and grade 0. He got his grade 8 (dist) at 14 and is about to take his LTCM (16).

In the seven years we've owned the instrument we've never had to do anything with or for it. No tuning, no servicing, no parts-replacement, and it gets played EVERY day. It is the ultimate low-maintenance instrument.

If I had to name the one purchase I've made in the last 30 years that most exceeded my expectations it would be L's Clavinova.

Best wishes

barry

Apologies if I come across as argumentitive here (I really don't mean to!) but the P70, although a nice instrument for beginners, is toward the lower end of the digital piano range and, in my opinion, the touch is a long way away from even the most basic of acoustics. I don't mean to put a downer on things (and you obviously love your piano, which is the only thing that counts) but I honestly believe that the closest one can get to an acoustic piano would be the CLP280 (I myself have the second best, again IMO, in the CVP305 (which uses Yamaha's GH3 keyboard))

I'd still recommend one as it's one of the better ones in that price range, but I'd hate people to buy one thinking it's something it's not.

Whats the difference between the "graded hammer" keys that the p70 has and the ones you are talking about, GH3?....is there a GH2?

It's getting too complicated for me ! LOL
By the way Lukino, good luck with your lessons and hope you enjoy your P70 for now (until the day you can upgrade to something else if you want to).
For me it will be a nice acoustic piano hopefully in 3 years time (fingers crossed)

A good friend is practising for his LRCM on a p70 but I have tried it and I find the action is "Clicky" and it doesn't feel right to me. I'm going to get the Korg sp 200 sometime soon: Much nicer action and about the same price, excellent sound but requires an external amplifier (unless you are planning to play using headphones, as I am). Also doesn't include a stand or a decent pedal.

I have one and the more I've played it the more I've come to hate it, it's completely lifeless they all are. Luckily I think I'm getting a real one soon.

I have a Yamaha CLP-270; acoustically it is the same as the 280 model. I am delighted with it and musician friends have commented favourably on its sound.

When I have a big premium bond win , I will buy an acoustic grand, but until then ..................

Err....really that bad eh?

I have a Clavinova -CLP230 which I am really pleased with. Yes, I would prefer an acoustic but it's just not feasible at the moment.......maybe one day.

No, absolutely not! You can only offer that opinion if you have tried some of the best digital pianos. The Yamaha 270 or 280 has a graded hammer action, 50 acoustic sampling banks, large loudspeakers and iAFC (Instrumental Active Field Control) technology which combines sound picked up by internal cabinet microphones with the CLP’s built-in voices to harmonise automatically with the acoustics of the room you’re playing in. This is completely different sound from some of the cheaper digital models. These days, just because a piano is acoustic does not necessarily mean that it sounds better than a digital one.

I recently got a Yamaha ( ydp131 ) digital piano.

It really exceeded my expectations and I've got very fond of it! I still teach and practise on the acoustic, but the digital is great for night playing (headphones!), and also for practising duets alone by recording in the other person's part

It's not bad it sounds perfectly passable. But compared to a real piano, it's lifeless.

I have a clavinova which is about 10 yrs old, havent played it for a while, it had a beautiful demo song for mellow piano...does anyone know the name of the tune?

I think there is a GH2, but it's not openly advertised as much since GH3 came out. The difference (I think) between GH and GH3 is that GH uses two different weight settings (heavy in the low end, light in the top) whereas the GH3 uses 6 different grades of weight (from heavy to light, and four others in between) to replicate the feel of an acoustic grand. (As a side note, I think that's another reason why some people claim the touch isn't right on digitals; because they look like uprights but feel like grands)

Don't be put off by some of this though - after all you know it's not the "best" (i.e. expensive) digital on the market but it does what it says on the tin.

The pedal is quite realistic (the pedal is now used as a MIDI controller [therefore giving you 127 levels of dynamics] as opposed to the on/off switch it used to be).

It looks quite nice in the matching stand, and it's infinitely better than learning on a keyboard. You will outgrow it (possibly before Grade 5, maybe even around Grade 8 although I hope it's before then!) so keep saving and playing as many pianos as you can in the meantime (both digital and acoustic) so that when the times comes to buy your next instrument, you'll be able to play it really well and have a much better idea of what it is that you want from a piano.

Thanks, that was really informative! I think what i bought is right for me, given the circumstances...basically i used to play piano as a kid and stopped at around aged 14 (at level 5)...now i'm approaching 20 and decided to start again, so i didn't really want my parents to dish out lots of money given the circumstances....if i really DO go through with it and start playing seriously again then i guess i could upgrade! till then i hope my p70 will serve me well...

This afternoon bought a Roland FP2: It has the cover missing on the balance rotation switch and they couldn't find the box, so they gave me a discount that made it cheaper than the Yamaha P70 or the Korg sp 200 I was looking at, and it's a MUCH better keyboard!

So you're implying i order a yamaha p140 or something and trip the salesperson as he's passing the thing over to me?

Re-reading my original post I realize that I strongly implied something that isn't true: They didn't give me a discount because I asked: The thing was discounted before I entered the shop, though the reasons for it being discounted are as stated. Apologies for the misunderstanding - entirely my fault.

Mind you, if you think that tripping the salesman up will get you a discount (as opposed to being kicked out of the shop and barred) then go for it!!

I have a horrible, really cheap casio keyboard (£50 ). It doesn't have weighted keys, so I can't do dynamics at all. However I have no room in my house. I know nothing at all about digital pianos - is there anything that's small enough to play on the kitchen table, and relatively cheap because I have to feed my son's saxophone habit? What sort of size is the P 70 Lukino?

I don't really follow the logic here. Surely a well regulated acoustic grand will have a consistent weight throughout the keyboard? After all, the mechanism for each key is identical irrespective of the hammer's destination.

I'm not too sure about this. I thought (and I've only every played one grand, and which seemed to confirm this) that the lower keys had a slightly heavier action than in the higher end?

I think the logic behind it is that you may occasionally want a booming bass so the hammers are made slightly heavier and, conversely, you may sometimes want a really, really quiet phrase at the top end so the hammers are lighter.

I'm kinda speculating here, though. Maybe someone more knowledage (or with the time to Google!) can help us out here?

Well the P70 has 88 keys like a piano, so in length its identical to a real piano. As far as i know, all digital pianos have 88 keys, but i might be wrong...also it depends on how long your kitchen table is! In terms of price, the only digital pianos i know that have weighted keys and are cheaper than yamaha are the casio ones. not sure anything drops below £300 though.

I've just gone out and bought a Korg SP-250. Have I done the right thing??? I thought it was a bargain, but when I got home and looked on the internet I found they were all retailing for aroung that price (£500). The lady in the shop thought they were worth £725. It took the shine out of the transaction a bit. Don't tell me I've wasted my money!

From my modest experience, i have found that in store prices absolutely cannot beat internet prices. For example, for my p70, internet is usually £50-150 cheaper than various stores i looked into...opsy daisy?

im sure its fine lol though nothing beats the real thing

I have a clavinova CVP-109, and i really want to find out the name of the demo tune for the 1st mellow piano!!! ahhhhhhhhh

As a general rule, internet prices are always cheaper.

You do get extra value when buying in shops though; you can try it out, talk to the sales people and get them to demonstrate it, you can take it home the same day, you can get it fixed more easliy etc.

Also, some sites are not what they're cracked up to be, so I suppose you're safer buying from shops.

Some people do all this and then buy from the net once they've decided but that's just bad manners!

Also, please remember the difference between keyboards and digital pianos!

So i have bad manners?

I checked out the various digital pianos at a store before placing my order online

I'm sorry that you find your digital lifeless. I bought mine because it was so easy to emote on it. I love it.

On an acoustic the strings for the lower notes are thicker than those for the higher notes. This means that you have to press the key slightly harder for a low note than for a high note in order to obtain the same volume. A good digital will replicate this difference. Personally, I'm not a good enough pianist to notice the difference.

My Roland fp2 has preloaded "songs" including several by Chopin & Debussy. Not sure why.

On a grand piano, at least, it's more than just that. You actually have to use more force just to get the piano key to move for the lower notes. My piano teacher showed me a graph his tuner had made for his Steinway grand which showed how the force required changed across the keyboard. (The tuner had actually measured this for his piano.) So, any digital keyboard which wants to replicate that properly needs to actually have a physical difference in the keys, not just a change in the velocity response in the software.

I have got a Yamaha CLP 970 digital piano and a U1 acoustic piano. Both are good!

My new Korg SP 250 has just arrived, so I'm going to have a play on it.

My children love the Roland HP101e, 88 weighted keys, 65 preset songs and near enough piano sound for beginners/intermediate without breaking our budget for around £700 about 2 years ago.

First choice for practice though is the trusty acoustic but after that they totally enjoy making up their own tunes in different instruments. Bach Inventions can be reinvented in several different tones!