hello all.....

can anyone give me feedback on how they feel about pianos being destroyed in the name of art, for example by the composers Karl-Erik Welin and Francois-Rene Duchable or by performance / installation artists such as Raphael Ortiz.....would you be willing to destroy your own piano for any reason ? do you find the idea of destroying a piano wholly unacceptable ?...i'd be very curious to hear opinions from pianists on this forum

Hendrix did it with his guitars. But I think it was a daft stage act. thesedays they can call anything ''art''.

Its Sacrilege to destroy any usuable musical instrument

As did Townshend with his amps...but I since learned that they are the same amps with no cones/circuitry and they were built for the purpose.

I guess it would depend on the piano, if it's very old and untunable then I don't see a problem with it, if it was a concert Steinway on the other hand......

fsharpminor's point about it being sacriligous is an understandable point....as with any instrument, the more we play it, the more we have a sort of prosthetic relationship with it - 'the instrument is an extension of our bodies' point of view....and i suppose destroying any instrument feels like self-mutilation if you have a deep enough relationship with it.....

i'd like to put forward some questions to get a clearer idea.....no need to answer all of them, although it would be good to get a complete perspective from an individual....a pre-emptive thanks to any replies





- Can it be stated that most classical musicians are repulsed at the idea of destroying pianos ? if so, are there any interesting reasons aside from the obvious ie, it could be used by somebody who is in need of one, etc

- Do you think piano modifications (as made famous by john cage) and destruction are related via evolution ? ie is destruction the logical conclusion to prepared pianos

- is there guilt involved on a personal level when pianos are destroyed ? if so, guilty for what, and towards who ?..

- can we ever get away from the grandiose symbolism of the piano and see it as any other instrument ? why is it held in such stature ?

- does low-brow or ‘comic’ piano destruction make it more demeaning ? ie Laurel and Hardy, Raphael Ortiz (who went on many live tv shows and must have been considered a crackpot by the majority of the audiences)

- is destruction of an instrument different from destruction of any other type of inanimate object ?

- is destruction creative ? ie are there any justifications for it, for example on a cathartic level ?

- is there a difference in destroying a piano if the person destroying it is classically trained to play it as opposed to somebody who cant ?

- are there instruments that contemporary electronic musicans (laptops for example) would feel uncomfortable destroying to the same degree as destroying pianos is pianists ?

- anthropomorphic sentimentality - do you start to see the piano as having human characteristics ?

Can't speak for others but I wouldn't be happy to see any instrument being destroyed for the sake of it. Even instruments that I don't especially care for.

Just read this article http://www.contactmusic.com/new/xmlfeed.ns...ts%20in%20style

...my honest reaction is what a complete drama queen, and how stupid to wreck pianos in a fit of pique.

Actually the bit in A Fish Called Wanda where the little dog gets squished by the grand piano had me in stitches, I didn't find it offensive or demeaning and I like dogs and pianos!!!

Yep, same here...it seems like he's just throwing a mard and it seems a bit immature for someone who I'm presuming is adult, intelligent etc...it takes a lot of dedication to get to that level of playing. I don't know much about the music system in France, but as far as I was concerned those who thought music was 'elitist' generally went out and did something a bit more mainstream to try and bring classical music to the wider population...it seems to have been the case with several musicians (although those I can think of are young, maybe a more modern education is a factor?) such as Maxim (can't remember surname, but he plays classical piano to dance backing tracks), Bond (string group), Katherine Jenkins? (vaguely remember her saying something about changing people's opinions of classical music), Il Divo, G4 etc...although all have had different amounts of success and varying opinions within both the classical and mainstream audiences.

Not even sure what I'm trying to say there, just that he is surely the one who chose to limit himself to 1% of the population? Throwing a hissy fit over it seems really over the top.

Personally, I hate to see pianos being destroyed...I remember the car advert when they dropped the piano on the car *shivers* or a Delta Goodrem video (don't ask me which song, haven't a clue!) where she set fire to a baby grand? or something along those lines. I think it probably is because I really wanted to have a piano to practise on at home, but due to many various reasons I couldn't get one until the point where I could no longer fit my pieces on a keyboard...to see something that so many people could make use of being destroyed seemed really stupid. Also it annoys me when people pay a fortune to get a black baby grand or whatever just so that it can sit in their room as 'furniture', but is never played. It just seems like a bit of a waste

Maybe destroying pianos rather than playing them is for the elite...many people my age have the chance to play a piano (even if they're just playing rugrats or whatever!) at school, but I doubt there would be many who could afford to buy one just to destroy it. Unless it was like a fake one or whatever, then that would be ok!

Even worse is the article I once read about so many beautiful large concert grand pianos being bought by the ignorant 'nouveau riche' as pieces of expensive furniture, and never once being touched or played..... that makes me weep.........a piano deserves to be played........

My piano sat in a London office as a 'trophy piano' for 25 years before it was rescued and I bought it. It has changed so much in 2 years through being regularly played and loved!

Back on topic - it does feel very uncomfortable to think of destroying a piano, but it all depends on the context. There are plenty of horrible old church hall thumpers I'd gladly put an axe to.

I should imagine busting up a piano could be a little dangerous - all those strings suddenly pinging!

Didn't people used to have competitions to see how fast they could break up a piano and post it through a small hole?

And if it isn't usable, then I would practice repair techniques on it in an effort to make it useable!



ANY musical instrument is important to the person who owns/plays it. Not just the exspensive ones or the good ones - I would be just as upset if someone ruined my B12 clarinet as I would my Rosewood Hanson, because they both mean a lot to me. I almost live my life through my clarinet - It is the one thing that is constant, its there and reliable, and playing it is just as natural as speaking to me.

Every instrument is unique - even if I got 2 of the same mske/model there would be noticeable differences, which may seem trivial to a non instrumentalist but can throw those who (Unlike pianists!) are not used to chopping and changing. if you take a book, for example, any variances in that are not going to cause any annoyance or most likely even be noticed!

I think that all instruments can 'speak' in the right hands, and can move almost every person who comes into contact with one. What other inaminate object can do that?

No. "Preparing" a piano in the John Cage sense has nothing to do with destruction.



No.

In the URL posted by Sarah-Flute, someone(I don't even care to remember his name) said that the piano is an arrogant instrument, which I feel is the reflection of the person's arrogance.

BUT

that's not to say I don't sometimes FEEL like destroying my piano when the stupid thing refuses to play the right notes and sound that way I want

I feel the way about expensive kitchens and state of the art cookers

He's forgetting that the 1% he so despises are probably the people who paid to hear him play - just so he could afford to wreck pianos...

Now there's someone who neeps a slap

Yeah, pretty much what I was thinking.....

I don't see what the hoo-hah is about smashing up pianos. Pianos are just boxes of wood, are they not? With strings. Sure, you can use them to channel your feelings and emotions to an audience, but the piano itself does not have any soul. It can't - how can it?

So it doesn't bother me at all.

I don't think that the 'hoo-hah' is particularly solely based on the emotional attachment to the instrument... at least, in my opinion, the main reason the destruction of pianos should be frowned upon among with the destruction of any other instrument, is that it is a complete waste of money, effort and the resources put into making it, not to mention you have 'wasted the lives' of those poor trees cut down to make it in the first place.

I.e. that piano could have been played - value in terms of enjoyment; it could have brought in revenue - so there would be an economical value in keeping it; by destroying it, you have negated the money input into the manufacture of such a piano - not just the initial value of the goods itself, but the cost to pay the wages of those working on its manufacture as well; and finally, you have probably just wasted a good deal of wood and metal, which is unlikely to be redeemed from the wreckage: hardly an ideal pastime when we are trying to conserve our trees and recycle all that we can...

Oh yes, actually, another reason why we should be against it is that a nod in the destruction of pianos is a nod in the direction of modern art(!) And we wouldn't want that either...!

In response to the initial post(s), I would not be prepared to destroy my own piano, I think it is unacceptable, it is regardless of who destroys it being the issue, it would be pretty much like buying a laptop or a house and completely trashing it - it is in a way no different from destroying any other valuable inanimate object, and it is probably not any more acceptable for its destruction to be done in the name of art or creativity, for the aforementioned reasons!

~Wobby~

So?

I don't think a piano has a soul. But why should that make it OK to smash it up for no good reason? Why wreck a perfectly good (in some cases a truly exceptional) instrument just for the heck of it? Wasteful and silly, surely! Just as it'd be silly and wasteful for me to smash a computer I had no more use for, a pair of glasses that no longer fit, or any number of other things that someone else could use (in both these two cases, I know of charitable organisations that pass on those items to those who could not otherwise afford them).


^ yupyupyup

If some rich pianist has enough money they can buy 3 pianos just for the sake of smashing them up to "prove a point", then they have enough money to do something useful like, say, sponsor a whole village full of kids, or hey, give those 3 pianos to music schools, colleges, or upcoming pianists who need them (or don't buy them and buy dozens of less expensive but still decent pianos for same). Smashing a piano on a whim because of a hissy fit about being unappreciated is the adult (and I use the word in its broadest sense) concert pianist version of throwing one's toys out of the pram; said pianist needs to grow up.

Would the pro-piano-smashers be any more upset if a Strad fiddle were to suffer the same fate?

witnessed a piano being destroyed recently and even though i thought i'd be somehow emotionally impervious, it was heart-breaking and gut-wrenching...no matter how much i justify it intellectually, i still find the destruction of pianos to be highly unpalatable....

thankyou all for interesting and passionate responses to my original questions....has been insightful

I could not watch it either.

Just don't ever do it to a steinway.