my great grandad has a organ, although ive never played before he showed me the basics (he is good!!) and i play the piano so I had a go and I was quite good...im thinkning it must be in my genes because my granddad plays the piano and he is really good! So i think ive got something musical in my genes! My mum says ive got great fingering for playing and I do! Ive played the recorder and i was quite good at that then I found out my dad used to play the recorder very well!!

Who eles thinks it is family genes?

Abbie

xxx

well, i can't possibly tell....
my grandmother was a singer, my grandfather was an excellent Er-hu (a chinese string instrument) and i have a cousin who plays sax and piano.... however, none of my parents know how to play the organ or the piano, or sing even...

Possibly when you look at the Bach family for instance..however...

I am the only person in the whole of my extended family ("probably ever" according to my mum, though we don't know for sure) who has ever learnt/played/taught an instrument. Most of my family like music, but my twin sister "CANNOT STAND!!!" classical music in any way, shape or form! Philistine!!

Could be - none of my family is particularly musical except for singing but both of my grandad's are very good singers, so I've heard...
Bit like me, I'm not exactly a musical prodigy but I adore singing, and I don't sound too horrible!

It comes from my Dad's side. My great grandad was a singing tutor and a choir master(I think) he also played piano. My dad sings and plays piano and my brother plays trumpet, cornet, guitar and a little piano. My cousins are also musical.

So yes I do think its in my genes!

Nope, just me from my family.

My Dad sang when he was younger. Mum played the piano. Both were a casualty of their times, the second world war, and no money.
My brother didn't play anything, but loved music generally. My daughters are both musical.
Bev.

My dad couldn't carry a tune in a bucket!

Make of that what you will

I don't think it's genetic, certainly not entirely so.

For me I think it is - my Dad played violin and piano (and now plays guitar) as did my uncle, who is now teaching piano. My other uncle played viola. My mum playes clarinet, saxs and recorders and sings and there have been quite a few other musicians on my mum's side. If not genetic, having a family with an interest and appreciation of music, though neither of my parents played in my lifetime until farily recently, has definately encouraged me to play and enjoy music.

I was the only one in may family to show play an instrument and have a passion for music. I have quite a large family with over 30 aunts and uncles and over 20 cousins. Having a musical family may help you to develop a love of music but is not essential I know of quite a few families where the parents have said they've no idea where their child's love of music has coem from.

My Dad plays piano and a bit of sax. He's only ever doen grade 3 piano, but is way better than that in sight-reading etc. (G5/6?) guess that comes from 'x' years of playing!
but some of my cousins play and i think some uncles do, too.

I 'think' in a way it could be genetic but I don't think you have a gene 'for music' alone, I think some genes make you more prone towards the arts and some towards manual things...(you know, which bits of your brain you use etc....)
So, looking at my family..
nobody knows how to play an instrument but I do have some photographers in my family (this is an 'artistic side' you see), a sociologist and my dad loves to listen to a lot of folk music, my mum used to like classical music in fact I have seen a few operas (on telly not in real life) with her when I was little.
So maybe I received some 'artistic' genes from them?

But those of you who come from musical families are surely more likely to explore your own musicality - because you have grandparents or parents who are interested in music. My daughter hears more music - played on the radio, me playing, my dad singing or playing his clarinet - than most of the other kids in her class. She's seen sheet music around in much the same way as she sees books. She's had access to musical instruments, she knows what they sound like (how many other five years olds would know what an oboe sounds like, for example). So I'd be really quite surprised if she didn't develop at least some interest.

Also, from all that hearing, she's learning about pitch, chord structures, melodic structures, etc etc etc.


While genes may play a role, I'm really not convinced that they're that significant in determining musicality. It seems more likely that life experiences are what really counts.

Yeah, maybe, but I think they can be resscessant as well.

My brother and I are musical. My parents are both musical. My grandparents are not at all. And I think my great-grandparents were slightly. So music skipped a generation.

recessive?

I'm not sure how that addresses some of the objections to a (mostly) genetic argument, though?

One of the third years is doing a pyschology experiment on this, she made all of us do a questionnaire. The results aren't back yet though, but it's looking like it's not much genetics but a lot of the way your interests were nurtured as a child, what sort of things you were exposed to while you were ery little and the support you get.

hi i was interested in the twin not liking music as my twin sister has only bought 2 cds in her life and one of them was michel bolton she hasnt doesnt see my passion for the flute my dad played bass for a band in his youth but no other member of the family is musical i would like more support from them but luckily my husbands family are musicical singers, guitar and tabla players

the good thing is they are impressed by fairly easy stuff!!!

I was chatting with a genealogist (i think that's how you spell it) who has come to discover the most likely branch of your family that carries the "musical" gene (if you are musical but neither of your parents are particularly musical) would be your fathers mothers side.

Which, as it happens, is true for me. My mother has always loved music and likes every form of music, and my father was tone deaf (bless him) and since doing my family tree i've found a whole line of musicians from my fathers mothers side ......... (and before you ask, no, no other line in my family has any musical or artistic bent, they're just bent )

My maternal grandmother was an exceptionally good pianist, but my mother is about as musical as a brick. My father played the drums in a jazz trio and he also had a cousin and an uncle who were both professional violinists (or though I never knew about this until ten or so years ago). I'm fairly certain they were from his father's side of the family.

Well since I was growing up ive always loved the piano
Evan my sister is into music, she plays the guitar (learnt herself)

Abbie
xxx

Things like this make me wonder where my interest sprang from: we had some classical music around in the house in terms of records etc, and there was music playing on record and nothing against it, but that was it - but at age 7 I was determined to learn the fiddle and brought music into the house, more than was brought up on music...


*thinks about my father's mother*

*bwahahahahaha*

My mum had piano lessons for a while as a child, but didn't stick at it; my dad's never mentioned having had music lessons but enjoys the more mainstreal classical repertoire.

I was only 4 when my paternal grandmother died, so I never really knew her that well, but both my parents say I'm alot like her. The handful of classical LPs I had as a child originally belonged to her before I, um, "liberated" them from my parents' record collection

The paternal grandmother of a friend of mine was a professional violinist. Friend himself had piano lessons as a child, and Granny was very disappointed when he gave up. I did try to persuade him to have clarinet lessons but he declined, saying "my grandparents met when my grandfather went to my grandmother for violin lessons" then mumbled something about history repeating itself

I wonder if musical ability is one of those things where more people have the ability than they realise, but they never discover it because they just don't think it's for them, rather than a genetic ability.

My Mum is very musical - got to G8 piano, and was an excellent singer (which, unfortunately I'm not!). I vaguely recall her mother (my maternal grandmother) playing the piano.

My father is a) practically tone deaf and b) disinterested in music - although he occasionally listens to 1950's American country!

My Mum encouraged me a lot when I was little - she used to sit with me whilst I practiced, and ferried me around to lessons (and didn't begrudge paying for them). I don't know what is more important - that she was musical, or that she supported me so thoroughly.

I'd like to think it was the support she gave me. I love the threads on the Parents forum where non-musical parents expend so much time and energy on their children - and worry about their own lack of musical ability. The fact that they are giving so much support I believe is the most important thing for nurturing a love of music in their own children.

I'd tend to agree that support rather than innate talent is almost more important, in some ways.

[quote name='angie' post='506782' date='May 3 2007, 02:31 PM']I was chatting with a genealogist (i think that's how you spell it) who has come to discover the most likely branch of your family that carries the "musical" gene (if you are musical but neither of your parents are particularly musical) would be your fathers mothers side.[/quote]
*thinks about my father's mother*

*bwahahahahaha*
[/quote]

No, i think i might have mislead what my friend was suggesting ..........

My fathers mother didn't play anything either, but HER family as i came to find out, were all playing some instrument or another and that line continues to do so to this present day !!!

Sarah, i also quiver at the thought of taking after my Nan !!!!!

Definitley not family genes. Definitley not.

Neither of my parents are musical in the classical sense of the word, but my mum always sang to us when we were little, so we were always subjected to music in that way - my mum's singing isn't too bad I guess!! My Dad has always tried to teach us to appreciate different types of music... hence I had been a fan of both Westlife and Paul Weller at the same time when I was about 11! Neither of them played instruments, well, my mum tried guitar, and my dad cello but then they realised they had to practise!! Apparently there was music in my Mum's side, her Gran could play piano well by ear and her auntie can play electric organ.

My brother, sister and I are all musical though, it's a talking point when the family gets together!

As far as I know any musical talent in my family is from my mum's side... it'd be interesting to find out but I don't think there's much if any musical talent from my nan's family.

[quote name='sarah-flute' date='May 4 2007, 03:25 PM' post='507340
I'd tend to agree that support rather than innate talent is almost more important, in some ways.
[/quote]


Think I agree with this. My gran was a good pianist but no-one in the next generation took it up and only me in the one after that!!

Yes my family are very musical, in fact my great great gandfather used to make violins! Which I thinks pretty cool!

I'd like to think my violin skills are from him as no one else in my family plays violin, and I've always love the intrument!

No-one in my family apart from my brother is that musical - can't think how he ended up with perfect pitch!

My (Viennese Jewish) mother is very musical - sings, played piano and violin. My maternal grandfather played the piano and was a composer in his day. One of my maternal great-aunts was a cellist and most of my cousins on that side played/play piano, clarinet, whatever.

My father had always wanted to play an instrument but wasn't allowed to because my paternal grandmother 'didn't think she couild stand the noise'. Enough said: she didn't play anything at all. My paternal grandfather played violin and mandolin but had given them up by the time I was born. Perhaps he was shy to play in front of my mother.

But having said all that, I still think the idea of a 'musical gene' is ridiculous. I think we are pretty much all born with the potential for musicality and some of us will realise it for whatever reason - nurture, or just our own independently-discovered private passion. In my case I'm sure it was nurture - a highly musical family on my mother's side hence much early exposure followed by lessons and lots of support. People have suggested that my family have 'musical genes' and I used to believe it myself but have since thought it through and changed my mind.

Good example - new 7-year-old pupil, no music in her family. I give her two lessons a week, sing to her, teach her intervals and am doing everything possible to awaken her musicality, including giving her dad exact instructions on how to help her with her practice. Result? She now sings and plays just like my son did when he was her age and I was giving him twice weekly lessons - and there was me thinking it was in our family genes!

With the right kind of nurture, pretty much all children could reach a high level of musicality - what a tragedy that so few of them in this country get this opportunity to learn a skill that can go on to enrich their whole life...

Violinia

Agreed

Except that quite often, even when they are given the opportunity, they waste it.................

My sister and I were given EXACTLY the same encouragement. My sister resented practicing; would rather have hung out on the street corner with schoolfriends than had lessons etc. Now she has children of her own, sadly (the way I see it) she is bringing them up the way she WANTED her childhood. They do not do any music at all - or dance, or extracurricular activities/sport/art whatsoever. They come home and play/watch TV etc. She believes this is the best for them.

I thrived on all the activities, and try to encourage my step-daughter to participate in as much as she can - she dances, runs cross country etc.

Sometimes all the nurturing you are able to give, isn't enough. That must be where nature comes in.

I was always fanatical about music. I don't know where it came from - my family isn't really musical, although my great grandmother played the piano very well & was offered a scholarship at RAM, which she sadly wasn't able to take up. I do remember her playing when I was very small & I always wanted to play myself. My mum seemed to understand that I had to play & supported me, although it took a long time.

My sister learnt & still plays a bit & my 2 brothers didn't learn an instrument (but certainly could have done if they'd wanted to). My youngest brother has an enormous record collection & does work as a D.J. sometimes.

I'm the only one in the family old enough to remember my great grandmother, so it could be that my early exposure to piano music influenced me.

But the nurturing has to be exactly right for that particular child. Some children practise off their own bat, no problem. Some need to be gently chivvied, others need to be nagged and hovered over. Some children find the slightest chivvying off-putting in the extreme, and some benefit from a knowledgeable musical parent whereas others hate it! I think this is where the innate qualities make the most difference.

I have some friends whose daughter is learning the piano and the saxophone. Her mother used to play piano and has always taken the active role with practice, reminding the daughter to practise, and then staying around during practice to help. It started out OK but now she's 9 she's beginning to resent the well-intentioned help to such a degree that she now refuses to practise when the mother's in the house!!!

She's now largely abandoned piano and practises saxophone with her non-musician father who praises her after every piece whether it's full of mistakes or not!

It'll be interesting to see how much she progresses now the rather more exacting mum has been banished from the practice room!

However, other children may benefit from a knowledgeable parent hovering close by making comments about the practice - like having four or five extra lessons a week.

Another factor is the actual need for self-expression - some need it more than others. You only have to look at musical cultures to see that far more children have innate musicality than ever get the chance to express it. Sweden and Norway are now bursting with music since their governmentts decided to invest heavily in music. Hungary is awash with stunning choirs since Mr Kodaly helped to put school singing at the top of the agenda. Britain is rife with untapped musical talent - it's heartbreaking.

Violinia

[quote]


And it will be even more heartbreaking for all the arts when our funds are all diverted into the Olympic Games. Oh sorry - it's a 'loan' from us isn't it! Not that we have a say in whether we want to loan our arts funding. Oh and before you athelete's start up - yes I know - the greatest irony is that it will also kill off many local sports projects. But money is money and no amount of money could have helped my dad whistle in tune!!! Tone deaf is an understatement

Part of the problem is that a person's character has a pretty important role to play in practising - there's a very interesting book by Anthony Kemp "The Musical Temperament" or something like that which goes into great depth about the different kinds of personality traits and how these can affect our choice of instrument and how stimulating (or otherwise) we find practising........

Hmm - I think musicality certainly CAN run in families, but it doesn't necessarily do so.

My mum and dad both sang and my mum plays the clarinet. All 3 of us kids learned to play the violin but I was the only one who wanted to join the church choir my dad sang in, and I was the only one to continue with my musical studies. My sister gave up violin after Grade 5 (which she took at 14 compared to my 11) and didn't even do O-level although she easily could have.

Now my daughter (aged 5) started playing the piano last November. She whizzed through the first book in three weeks flat and grasps concepts at 5 that some of my 11 year old piano students can't remember from one week to the next. In 6 months she has surpassed pupils that have been with me for two years. However, she gets three piano lessons a week from me (well, guided practices anyway) as well as a theory lesson, all of which last 30-45 minutes, compared to the 20 minutes a week which is all I can give my school students.

So how much of it is genetic and how much of it is the fact that I can invest so much more time with her. I don't doubt that some of it IS genetic - she picks things up so easily and naturally - I never have to tell her anything more than once and her sightreading is perfect. But the fact that I spend more time with her must make a big difference also.

I think all of us who are teachers would agree that all children have different levels of innate musicality - it's fairly easy to tell early on which ones will do well and which ones will struggle, although there are always those who surprise you by either not living up to their early promise, or struggling on regardless and ending up with distinctions.

Surely it's entirely possible that picking things up easily and naturally could stem from the amount of time you're able to spend with her, and that music making has been a natural part of her childhood as long as she can remember... she has no inhibitions on her innate musical ability. Whereas a child who starts later/has less support will naturally be more inhibited?

I'm not at all sure that there can be a definite answer to nature/nurture.

I'm in a mad silly mood having just got in from work and I just have to say : Gene Pitney, Gene Hackman, Gene Wilder......

Sorry!

My uncle made his living as pianist. My father was a church orgainist. My cousin is a TV and film composer in Hollywood.

I think you've got a point about the life experience and being exposed to music. My dad's family are all very musical, but mostly self-taught so I do think it's also 'in the blood.'

I have a twenty-month-old and it's really interesting to watch her relating to music. I love traditional Irish/Scottish and that's her ancestry and her favourite programme is Balamory! She's obsessed with it!

Seriously though, she loves listening to me play the piano (although she also loves to 'join in'). She also brings my tin whistle over and hands it to me so I will play it for her and then smiles and smiles (at least someone appreciates my playing!)

The other day I got out my flute which I haven't played for years and started playing it. She immediately came over for a look. I let her hold it and she lifted it up to her mouth (with her hands the right way round, in pretty much the right position) and tried to blow into it. Well I thought that was pretty clever of her!

I really hope she 'catches' my love of music. I know I'll need to be careful though. My parents didn't know much about music lesson etc, so I didn't really start to play 'properly' until I hit my teens and then lots pf other kids had 3-4 years on my at least. I always felt like I was playing 'catch up'. I'll have to try very hard to bite my lip and wait for her to ask me about learning an instrument etc as I don't want to be the kind of mum who's trying to fulfil her ambitions through her kids.

I don't think it's family genes although maybe it is, I don't know ... My two brothers, sister and I all play instruments and the only other ones in my family who play or played instruments are my grandad (french horn), gread grandad (voice), great-grandma (voice) and mum (played euphonium for five years then wuit when she was a teenager (but that doesn't mean that the mucial talent comes from them ... I don't know...

That sounds like an interesting book, and I'm going to add to my list to buy for summer reading! I was thinking this very thing on reading through this thread - that all the musical genes in the world are not enough if the other important things are not in place - the ability to focus on constructive practice - and to maintain that over years - being the big one.

I don't think you have to have a musical family to become talented. A person is more likely to like music if they come from a musical family(a lot of people from non-musical families do though), but that's all I think...