I'm hard of hearing but I want to learn to play the piano. I don't know if I'll be any good so I've decided to buy a digital piano rather than a real one because to be honest, I don't think I'd notice if a real one went out of tune lol.

I'm also a student on a budget so the two digital pianos I've been considering are the Yamaha YDP 131 and the Roland HP 101. The music shops in my area have quite small ranges and I've only heard the Roland so I can't really make an informed decision (I'll be buying online).

Can anyone help me make a decision or suggest a better digital piano in the £500ish range? I'd really, really appreciate any information because I've been wavering back and forth for weeks now.

Thanks,
Claire

Lots of folk will tell you that a digital is not the same as a "real" piano, but they are jolly useful when you are on a smallish budget. You will have the advantage of being able to play using headphones, a record facility, (great for checking your own performance and for playing duets too) and they never need tuning. Yamaha is a good and reliable make and I would go for that, but do check out the on line music shops too as you may well get a better price than from your local store.

Hi Claire

I've got a Roland which cost £675.00 a few years ago. It's great other than the keys are a bit noisy. Try and get the best you can. I bought the piano and the amp over the internet from Bonners in Eastbourne and the service was great. If you contact hem early enough one day you will get it the following day. I can still remember the excitement when it arrived. Good luck

I got a Roland for my elderly mother a couple of years ago when she moved into a small sheltered flat, and it is really good. It is the F50, very plain and small, though with full keyboard, but had an excellent sound. As far as I remember it cost £700. Yamaha may be a good and reliable make generally but Roland are regarded as having the best piano sound - or at least were two years ago.

I think that it is very much a matter of personal likes and dislikes. I much prefer the piano sound of a Yamaha. Try as many as you can, even if it involves a trip to a city somewhere and try lots.

I have a Roland FP2 and yes, it's not a real piano, but it's close enough for most purposes and has all the extras already mentioned (plus a full set of MIDI samples).

Two things I would say, though:

First, shop around. I got mine new but heavily discounted (more than 1/3) because 1 knob was missing and they couldn't find the box!! On ebay they tend to go for about 2/3 the new price (i.e. 1/3 off), depending on condition.

Second, try before you buy.

Apologies in advance for getting on my high horse, but a digital piano is every bit as real as an acoustic!

Most pianists prefer the sound and expressive capabilities of acoustic pianos, but that may be because most pianists prefer classical music for which the acoustics, in my opinion, better than digital. (I wonder why classical guitarists don't refer to Fenders and Gibsons as "not real guitars"?).
Give the digitals a few more years, 10 max, and I fully expect the balance of opinion to be more in favor of digitals than acoustics. (£ for £ at least. I doubt you'll ever be able to fully replicate a Steinway)

Back on topic, I prefer the Yamaha over the Roland. The GH keyboard is, IMO, more realistic than the Progressive Hammer Action found on the Roland (although not as good as the GH3 keyboard you'll find further up the Yamaha range).

There are more voices on the Roland though, so if you like to muck about with that you'd need to consider if the Yamaha has everything you need.
Not sure if the Roland has effects like Reverb (which can improve the sound a lot on the lower end models) but I'm fairly certain the Yamaha does.

If I remember rightly the Yamaha looks better too, probably the least worthy of points to note but if you're gonna spend over £500 you want a nice looking instrument!

Finally, I would caution against buying online. The extra you pay in the shops is worth it as you get to try it out for as long as you like beforehand, have someone talk you through the functions, after sales care etc.
Do online retailers assemble the piano for you when it's delivered? Flat packed furniture can be bad enough never mind a piano!


Good luck with you search, and let us know how you get on.

KB

(Rob takes off pianist hat and puts on guitarist hat, for a moment)

Guitarists don't refer to Fenders and Gibsons as "not real guitars" because they are real guitars - the sound is made by vibrating strings. The fact that the sound is amplified electronically rather than mechanically doesn't affect that (though it does affect a lot!). A digital piano doesn't make a sound by vibrating strings and thus isn't a "real" piano in that sense: You get no harmonics from other strings, no pick up of the environment and no feedback through the fingers (play the bass notes on a concert grand and you can feel the vibration in the key). That doesn't mean they aren't excellent instruments: I'm sorry if I touched a nerve there! I take your point about the future as well.

Incidentallly, Fender and Gibson do make acoustics as well as solid bodied electrics, but not classical guitars, and there is a difference: The bridge and the nut (the bit the strings go over at the top of the neck just before the head piece) of a steel strung guitar (icluding electrics) is considerably narrower than on a classical guitar i.e. the strings on a classical guitar are further apart.

That is very well 'put' Robodoc, I 'knew' there was a difference just couldn't put my finger on it even though it's such an OBVIOUS difference

I would strongly advise looking around for a piano first. I have had a digital piano for 4 years and while adequate I've never been fully happy with it. Luckily tommorow I am getting a real piano for £750 [This is roughly the same price someone paid for a digital piano]. Make sure you look around you may be able to find some cheaply, contact any music teachers in your area to see if anyone is looking to sell one.

I got mine because someone happened to mention to my piano teacher they had a piano to sell and I had told him I was thinking of buying the previous week. Just consider it, the benefits of playing with headphones aren't really that profound [and the record feature is only available on more expensive models].

I can practice between 1 and 2 hours more each day with headphones than I would be able to do without. I think that's fairly profound and that's why I bought the digital. It isn't the same as a real an acoustic piano, which is why I also have an old and ageing acoustic piano and why I'm replacing it (next year?) with a grand.

I agree, don't assume they are the same, but know what you want it for before you buy and if what you want would be better served with a digital then fine.


Hmm - the sceptic in me is jumping up and down and demanding to be heard:

Sometimes a low price really is just a bargain, but prices are usually low for a reason, and £750 is low. Are you sure you're going to be "fully happy" with your £750 piano?

I was hoping I wouldn't get that old chestnut on this forum! (I also play electric drum kits and that's every guitarist's defence when you try to make that comparison....)
The point is well made though and, as a I'm a better guitarist than a pianist, I do agree with you.

Let me try another example; are keyboards/synths "real" instruments?

To me, an instrument is "real" if it's a physical instrument (as opposed to virtual instrument packages you can buy for the computer).

Back on topic, once more, I believe a £500 digital will better serve a beginner than a £500 acoustic for a variety of reasons that've been discussed many times before.

Chakara,
I've tried most (current) digital pianos so feel free to PM me if you've got any specific questions about the Yamaha/Roland models you're looking at.

Why are you unable to play without headphones? Are you playing late at night?

Also I'm probably not going to be fully happy with it, I think I'll have to wait for my eventual steinway first.

Yes, after the family have gone to bed. The rest of the time the sound of a "real" piano, with wonky action and slightly out of tune, is fine!

Talking about when 'the family'/flatmates/cats/dogs/etc go to bed.....
I am amazed by the third pedal on my upright, it dampens the sounds SO MUCH that I can play any time of the night!
(ps this is just me sharing my delight at this, not intending to tell anyone to buy same piano as mine or anything else )

My piano also shares a mute pedal, and is in remarkable condition. Robodoc you seem quite angry, are you ok.

Can you play those pieces which use harmonics?
Even when it's not essential to the piece the sound of an acuostic piano is different bacause of this effect.
There are some fun pieces in beginner books like this but I can't use them with my students who have keyboards and I don't think they would work on a digital piano, even a vety good one.
Do correct me if I'm wrong.

I'm fine, not angry, didn't mean to give that impression, hope I didn't upset anyone.

I think we may be using different definitions of Real. I think of three groups, "real", " digital" and "virtual". It seems clear that some people think of "digital" as equally real and only exclude the "virtual" from being real. I have no issue with that definition - I just wasn't using it. I also think that this is getting seriously bogged down in semantics - the question here is whether a digital piano is as good as an acoustic piano (regardless of how you define real!). The answer, as I have said, is that it depends what you want.



No, you can't (so far as I'm aware). It's one of the drawbacks. Also, sustained notes get less and less like their acoustic cousins as they get longer (on mine anyway!). Not all good, not all bad, just different.

Not sure about anyone else but you didn't upset me!




I tend to use the "real" "digital" and "virtual" definitions as a lot of my friends (who can't play piano) use virtual pianos in their home recording studios. I guess what I'm getting at is that I think of "real" and "physical" as synonymous, with "digital" and "acoustic" simply different types of "real" instruments.

As I've said before, for the beginner, in my opinion, a digital can be better than acoustic as your money goes that little bit further and the headphones, recording functions et al can be the difference between loads of practice and not much. Once you get to pianos around the £4k mark, then I do think they completey wipe the floor with even the most advanced digital.

The original post was for advice on entry level digitals, so I hope we've answered that for you, chakara.
Please let us know how you're getting on with your search or if there's anything specific you'd like to know.
I hope this debate isn't putting you off buying one - they're great to learn and perfectly suitable if an acoustic is not on the cards.

Just to add my tuppence worth....

Acoustic pianos tend to last longer than digital ones (my piano is 100 years old this year ) but you do have to pay out regularly for maintenance.

It is possible to retro fit the mute device if the piano doesn't have one already. It works in the same way by interposing a strip of felt between the hammers and the strings, but switched on by a small lever (like a bicycle gear lever) underneath the keyboard rather than a pedal.

A lot of old upright pianos have something similar operated by the soft pedal - it is called a celeste and doesn't mute nearly so much (felt is much thinner) but has a very beautiful sound.

I would thorouhly reccomend a Yamaha. I have a Yahama Clavinova CLP 270, and its great, and the sound quality, intonation and features is immaculate, better than Roland in my opinion