According to the syllabus you need to provide copies of the score to the examiner. They also state that it is our responsibility to get permission from the publisher. How long would this take, as the diploma is only a month away.
I have other editions of the same work, but the editors markings are different so I dont want the examiners to follow a different copy and mark me down for not playing what is on the score I have supplied them with.

Just email the publishers. They are used to this kind of thing and will normally respond within a few days at the outside. Make sure you declare the exact edition (including catalogue number) you want to copy, and say where and when and what the occasion is you need the copy for. Be sure to mention that you will destroy the copies afterwards.

Thanks Will email them right now....the problem is finding the right email....Baerenreiter have load of different contacts in different departments - think I will just email the general one and see if they reply.

My experience of contacting publishers was very varied - the two German firms responded very swiftly, the English one sent me junk mail with a virus in but no reply, and the Dutch one tried to sell me some more music . Lucky I was doing a Trinity diploma, where the formal permission is not needed, as Trinity undertakes to destroy copies after the exam as they do in music festivals...

I've never seeked the permission from a publisher. I was told that if I bring into the room the original copy along with the photocopies to prove that I did buy it and the photocopy has not been used other than to provide to the examiners then there has so far been no problems with anything. Performing from a photocopy is a big no no unless of course its an aukward page turn or something!

Er...the ABRSM diploma rules are pretty clear on this one, though. No permission, exam risks being null and void.

Well thats pretty pants...

if you can, try and borrow the same edition from a teacher/friend, that's what I did anyway. If you need to photocopy it then contact the publishers immediately. Some publishers sent me a form that I had to complete and return stating the purpose of the photocopy, where it will be used and when etc. I left it too late and since one of them had to be posted to New York and I had to then wait for their say so to photocopy I just left it as I knew it would take way too long!

I wish AB would just let you photocopy and then destroy the copy infront of them at the end of the exam

Edit: If you're stuck for the Hindemith and Fauré you can borrow my editions for your exam since it's after mine. I can post them over to you. Just let me know if you need them

Well hardly, given the ABRSM syllabus is very clear on this point. Other exam boards have different regulations on this point of course, but it's up to you to know the rules of the exam you might be thinking of undertaking! Diplomas are hard enough without risking a failure because one couldn't be bothered to follow the rules.

I do not understand why it should be necessary to get permission from the publisher to make photocopies for the examiner as the music publishers association already state in their Code of Fair Practice that it is acceptable to make photocopies for this purpose and the AB know this. Here is a quote from a Libretto magazine (January 2007):
" Although not an exam requirement, examiners appreciate having copies of the Grade 8 music. Under the Music Publishers’ Association Code of Fair Practice it is possible to use photocopies for this purpose, as long as the copy is destroyed after the exam."

Very true, pv, and in fact the Trinity dip syllabus cites that very document. For some reason the ABRSM do not, and are explicit about the need to obtain permissions. Perhaps a question for the "Ask the Chief Examiner" thread?

Lifesaver! That would be great, I might take you up on that offer, I think you used the Trevor Wye edition of Faure Fantasie too?

Has your teacher got a copy?

Not the same edition of the Faure, thats the problem. I dont think she has the Telemann, so will have to wait for the permission to photocopy that. Hindemith is fine.

I've just got my date through (July 18th) and have orded 2nd copies of everything I'm not printing off Schubertline last week.

Along with my date, it was suggested that I borrow library copies, but they are very specific about there rules re photocopies. Personally I would not risk it. You've paid out the fee for a diploma surely the cost of music is not prohibitive. I'm paying out for lessons too and second copies cost less than one lesson. As a singer they're useful as you can lend them out to accompanists, and it can't do too much harm having multiple copies of music sitting on your shelf.

Good luck the rest of us diploma candidates.

Jo

The total would cost the same as one lesson for me, and its bad enough with my bank balance in negative figures as a student, I still need to pay the piano accompanist around £90 which will put me into even more debt. Think I will just hunt down people with the same editions to borrow, Matthews kindly offered 2 of the books

Yes i'm doing the Trevor Wye edition of the Fauré and the Hindemith is published by Schott from what I can remember. As already said you're more than welcome to borrow them, i'll get them off to you straight after my exam

Yes, but not all of us have money growing from trees in our back garden and can afford second copies of music. Just because one can scrape together the entry fee does not suddenly mean that they can afford anything.

I'm only taking a dip., as the college I go to pays for it, otherwise I probably wouldn't be going in for it.
This thread on photocopying scores is an interesting topic; I wondered how I was going to provide the examiner with the music - still unsure

Thats good of them! I went straight into my overdraft after paying for my diploma - money I havent got, and wont have for a long time!

eek!
more debt....

Tell me about it! End of year 1 at university and I am around £9000 in debt!

That's shocking. You should really give up the booze, fags, long-haul foreign holidays, private jets, your penchant for designer clothes and the Porsche.

Not everyone lives their uni life like you lived yours .

hehe!
The joys of being a student in London

The point is it's not up to the AB whether or not one can photocopy a piece of music, it's up to the publisher so they can't say it's fine to copy: permission is not theirs to give. It is, however, their choice to put potential disqualification, rather than simply to report the infringement to the publisher: presumably because they feel strongly about the issue.



I'm not sure the Code of Fair Practice does give permission to copy whole works for this purpose, can anyone spot this permission in the document? (I confess I didn't look very carefully on this occasion). The only rules that appear to be there exclude works that can be bought seperately, or are prescribed set works...

If it does, then simply printing out and taking along the relevant section of this would constitute written permission from the publisher; assuming that the publisher is one who has signed up to this, of course.

It doesn't. It's a conspicuous omission from the code. And there's some wording that says copying a piece in the context of a performance exam is expressly excluded from the code.

No, I worked, which is why I got a FIRST and left uni owing £300.

Strange that I worked and got an upper-second and owed about £500. People wondered why I was playing pool at 2pm most days, however they weren't up when I was in the Library, and I started work again when they started going home (department was much quieter!)

Hubby was funded by the bank of mum and dad, left debtless and with a First.

This is looking promising... I intend to work through Uni, looks like I might not end up with mountains of debt! (Not something I would ever like to be in really, though I think I may be unable to avoid it if I want a house)

Katyjay is right - is says



So,unless your program is entirely own choice, best get hold of the publishers sharpish!

Not a good thing to say today Nat, I don't have a money tree in my garden either. There is also the small question of being married to someone who likes to take the plastic out of my handbag when I'm meant to be shopping for basic groceries. I currently have two very upset children because I can't buy everything either.

Actually Rosemary7391, it's worse news than that.

That concession applies only to music festivals. It does not apply to examinations, whether it's set works or otherwise.

I could have sworn it included exams the first time I read that... Perhaps I should wear my glasses!

What isn't a good thing to say today?

It's not just because of being an angel that you had so much less debt: it's a fact of the changing system. There are no longer grants, they are loans that one has to pay back. I spent a grand total of £0 on alcohol as an undergraduate, I don't drink the stuff, but still graduated with a first and thousands of pounds of debt. Students now. althoguh I don't defend the costs of alcohol consumption, are in a lot more debt simply due to political reasons. Now things are even harder with the introduction of top-up fees, £3000 a year before having spent anything on food and accomodation.


And of course then there's the definition of own choice, is it own choice from a prescribed list or something entirely unprescribed, i.e. not mentioned on a syllabus. As KJ says if exams are excluded anyway, this is a null point. Although interestingly if the piece can be bought seperately (e.g. Beethoven Sonata) rather than in a collection, there are no exceptions.

Thats true - My fees are £3000 a year, and my accomodation in halls this year was £4600. Travel is also annoying- The london underground is so expensive!

Its a good thing I got an award of £500 from the MBF for flute lessons!

Actually the code says:

"Nothing done for the purpose of an examination (including continuous assessment) infringes copyright, except that candidates performing a musical work in an examination may not use reprographic copies"

Trinity Guildhall have interpreted this to mean that the performer and accompanist must have a legal copy of the work but that photocopies are acceptable for the examiner as long as they are destroyed after the exam. This seems to me to be the correct interpretation. The appendix to the code of practice also seems to agree with this interpretation.

My understanding is that only the copying of complete movements or works is expressly prohibited, and would therefore apply to copying pieces for the examiner. In saying that, it happens at festivals for the adjudicators, other boards see it as fair. Highly unlikely one would take proceedings for this use, and you honestly wonder how it would stand up in court.

But the AB rules are clear, and that is that.

To their credit they do suggest borrowing a spare copy from a library. Now the musc department Library where I studied could have supplied most of the stuff I need two copies of.

As a singer, I'm lucky a lot of my copies are from Schubertline. I buy a subscription and its only the ink and paper costs I need to worry about. Its not going to cost me too much to buy second copies of things (less than one singing lesson)

For those of you who have access to a decent music library: use it - it saved me a fortune at college.

As neil said, the AB is crystal clear over this one, and I personally would not want to fail a £380 diploma because I was too tight to buy the required second copies.