Hello lovely people ,

I've been thinking about this for a couple of days now and thought I would ask what your opinions were.

As some of you know, I'm in sixth year in Scotland and so I have free violin lessons to complement my Advanced Higher Music studies. The teacher I've had for 5 years is due to retire next week, and at long last the council have found a replacement. She's got a fabulous reputation and is really nice to speak to, but I have one problem. With my current teacher I've only ever studied 'classical' music, however the new teacher actually teaches traditional fiddle. She came along to one of my lessons last week and looked rather uneasy when I took out a Bach violin concerto.

Current teacher says that he doesn't doubt her ability, although his words were 'It's just a bit like me teaching the 'cello after such a short time' (I'm not entirely sure what he meant by this as he doesn't play the 'cello ). I'm in no position to judge her either, I'm just really concerned that progress is going to be limited in the next year. My current teacher has said that I should feel free to contact him at any time, purely because he knows more about the music I'm working on than she does, but would this be completely undermining her? I don't want her to think badly of me or that I'm not taking whatever advice she might give me. Also, I don't want to offend her by not showing an interest in playing traditionally but at the moment I think it's more important to concentrate my efforts on the repertoire for AH.

Basically, I don't know what to do . Any ideas?

Thanks

I believe classical violin and fiddle are quire different. If you want to play classical violin music then you need a teacher who understands that music and specialises in it. Being taught a Bach concerto or solo sonata for example by a traditional fiddle player would do more harm than good. The look on her face when you took the music out spoke volumes I expect. I also don't think you should be expected to change to fiddle if that is not what you want to play.

This is not snobbery or saying that classical is superior or harder it would apply equally if you wanted to play fiddle then a classical expert would be no use at your level.

I don't know about the set up in Scotland or in your school and whether there are other teachers available but I think you need to raise this with the head of music or whoever else is appropriate as soon as possible and get it sorted out.

Best of Luck

They're 2 completely different things as far as I'm aware. I would look for a new teacher - or a classical teacher as well if you are interested in continuing the fiddling.

Well, going by my recent experience, I would tend to stay well clear of having two teachers involved!! And if you really prefer the classical work you have been doing up to now, I would feel inclined to speak with your senior tutor or head of music about it.

I wouldn't risk trying to please the new teacher by learning the fiddle if it's really not what you want.

My piano/singing tutor has retired, but kept half a dozen or so of his pupils on. Would your original tutor be able to do the same or is he retiring fully?

I agree with the others in that you ought to be looking for an alternative..good luck x

Would it be "2 teachers" if one was classic and one was fiddle?

I'm not entirely certain there's a conflict.

Oh dear, it sounds like the school might not have realised that they are 2 different disciplines and/or that at your level you really need a teacher with the right background.

Thanks for all the replies .
They really struggled to find a replacement. We do have a second strings teacher but she is a lower strings specialist and usually only teaches 1st/2nd year upper strings.
He told me a while ago that he's more than happy to suplement my lessons with her, but he lives an more than an hour away so seeing him regularly enough could be a slight problem.
Fiddle teachers tend to teach by ear rather than using music. This in itself is completely contrary to how I've ever been taught. Not that I'm against change or trying different techniques, but it's not how I've ever done it.
*Tries not to rant about ill-equipped Highland schools* Perhaps they need someone to point it out to them...

Thanks for all the advice. I'm going to speak to my current teacher about what he thinks and then perhaps seek the advice of the head of department, who is a friend of mine anyway. Why is nothing ever simple?

Me neither! I'm not sure if I would involve the head of department just yet, in case you offend somebody unneccessarily. If it was me, I'd speak frankly to the current teacher to see if she's happy about you asking advice - or even having the occasional lesson - from the other one, and if so, there's no problem.

There's still the problem of not having a suitable teacher if Miss Ross wants to continue to study classical violin rather than (or in addition to) fiddle.
I would imagine that at her level she really needs the right teacher.

I meant there would be nothing wrong with talking to your old teachers, to me the two instruments are different enough to be able to do this, like having trumpet and piano lessons.

I meant it wouldn't be undermining your new fiddle teacher as it's a different instrument.

Maybe talk to your new teacher too. As you have said, she looked uneasy when you brought out a Bach concerto. Have you had any/many lessons with her? They will give you a clearer idea of what you're up against. If it seems she's really not going to cut the mustard for you classically maybe less frequent lessons with your old teacher would be more appropriate.


Yes, she may say "Oh what a relief, yes of course", and then your problem is solved

Certainly I would avoid having lessons or taking advice "behind her back" as it were. If it's clear she's not the teacher for you and she's unhappy with you asking someone else's advice then maybe you don't want lessons from her anyway!! Alternatively maybe she would be willing to teach you some trad music and techniques (if the lessons are free) and you can continue work on your classical stuff with occasional advice or lessons from your old teacher?

Agreed.

As long as everyone knows what's going on, having lessons with more than one teacher shouldn't be a problem at your age/standard. I wouldn't recommend it for a beginner or a young kid - way too much scope for confusion.
If you have regular fiddle lessons in school and occasional classical lessons with your old teacher, there shouldn't be much overlap between what you're working on with each, so as long as they both know what's happenning, I think it would be fine.
I have organ lessons with two different teachers (who know each other anyway) and we just keep clear divisions between what I work on with each (service music & technical work with one, AB exam pieces & scales with the other). It'd get confusing if I did, for example, scales with both and they each wanted me to use different footings, or if I did the same piece with both and they suggested completely contradictory things about registration or ornamentation or whatever. But with negligible overlap between the material covered, they're each free to take their own approach without having it contradicted by someone else.

Going back to what Sarah said, it's important that both teachers know that you're having two sets of lessons and they're each aware of what you're doing with the other. That way, there's not likely to be a problem of some aspects of learning being neglected completely (with each teacher assuming you're doing it with the other) or some being doubled up on (wasting lesson time that you could be spending better working on something else, as well as risking dealing with contradictory approaches). They don't need a detailed account of your lessons with the other, just the occasional quick update giving them a general idea of what you're working on and any particular technical problems you're having.

Good luck with it,

T.

People have suggested that it is fine to learn fiddle with one teacher and classical violin with another. I actually don't think you should do this as each will be detrimental to the other. I think you need to choose which you want to study and have one teacher who is good enough to teach it.

Best of luck

I don't really have a choice about whether or not to have lessons with the new teacher. Once you're taking a certificate music course in secondary school, the school is obliged to provide a suitable instrumental teacher free of charge for the duration of your course. So far, this has been fine, but when it came to replacing him they discovered a serious shortage of suitable teachers (our school is quite out of the way and so the replacement would have to be willing to travel).

For this reason, I think it's only fair to have lessons with her for a while even if it's not what I want to do. I've got my last lesson with my current teacher in an hour or so and am hoping that he will bring up the subject. Thanks for your contributions .

Ok, just a quick update.

I had my last lesson with previous teacher yesterday . Whilst playing a baroque piece I accidently resorted to playing an open E and realised that I'd been doing so since asked not to play 4th fingers by a fiddle teacher last week . When I explained this to him he realised how concerned I was about having a fiddle teacher but has told me that I shouldn't feel bad about contacting him at any point. My class music teacher came in at that point and assured me that if any problems arose, something would be done about it. So it would seem I was worrying over pretty much nothing, but posting here certainly helped (sorry for whinging at you all! ).

Oh, and he also added that when he's in a retirement home he wants me to go and play for him .

Thanks for all your help .

3 posts in a row - sorry!

Final chapter of the story. I had a lesson with my new teacher today. The only word I can use to describe it is 'amazing' . She told me that she hasn't taught classical violin to this level before, but she gave me some fabulous positive constructive criticism. I think I learnt more in an hour than I had in quite a while, and she's so complimentary that you can't help but like her.

It was clear from the off that she has no intention of suggesting I change to fiddle, and for that I'm really grateful. I think things are going to be just fine.

*goes off to practice with even more enthusiasm than before*

That's great news....

You sound a lot more positive about the situation and raring to go!

Does it mean we'll be seeing you less due to more practising?!

Excellent! What great news!

Wow, you Scots are so lucky! I have posted elsewhere about the cost of music lessons in our area, and although my son is doing A-level Music, we don't get any help towards his lessons (£43.50 per hour through our local music service).

Anyway, I'm glad your story has a happy ending and hope the new teacher continues as nice and helpful as she was in your first lesson.

£43.50 Per hour!! In wiltshire, the average per hour seems to be at £20-25! i've only ever seen one other teacher in wiltshire charge that amount! what instrument does he play, or does he sing?