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sarahk
This is so frustrating! I have two singing students, 2 cousins who come for a shared hour singing lesson once a week. They are my first students, really great girls doing really well and their parents are lovely too.

I have been very accommodating with them in the past when theyve had drama rehearsals, rescheduling to convenient times and and working late for them when their car broke down but I'm starting to feel like i'm being taken advantage of. The past three lessons that they have said they can come too (spread over about 6 weeks over xmas as it is) have all been cancelled by text message a few hours before the lesson. The first week there was an emergency and nobody could drive them over (they live about 15 miles away), the second week they'd been asked to attend last minute rehearsals for something and then just now i've had a call saying both girls are sick!

I have just introduced terms and conditions with any new pupils I take on but how do I suddenly give these to existing students especially those that don't mess me around? Another difficulty is that these girls pay by the week so I have no way of retaining money and I purchased exam music on their behalf about 6 weeks ago (after their last lesson) and becuase I haven't seen them I'm still out of pocket!

Any advice?

Sarah
JohnS
When I introduced T&Cs a few years ago, I gave them to the pupils/parents and told them that they would take effect from the next month. Paying monthly (or whatever you do) can be included with this. I never buy music for pupils.

Hope you sort it out soon. Life/work is much easier with good T&Cs. smile.gif
Violinia
QUOTE(sarahk @ Jan 2 2008, 02:39 PM) *

This is so frustrating! I have two singing students, 2 cousins who come for a shared hour singing lesson once a week. They are my first students, really great girls doing really well and their parents are lovely too.

I have been very accommodating with them in the past when theyve had drama rehearsals, rescheduling to convenient times and and working late for them when their car broke down but I'm starting to feel like i'm being taken advantage of. The past three lessons that they have said they can come too (spread over about 6 weeks over xmas as it is) have all been cancelled by text message a few hours before the lesson. The first week there was an emergency and nobody could drive them over (they live about 15 miles away), the second week they'd been asked to attend last minute rehearsals for something and then just now i've had a call saying both girls are sick!

I have just introduced terms and conditions with any new pupils I take on but how do I suddenly give these to existing students especially those that don't mess me around? Another difficulty is that these girls pay by the week so I have no way of retaining money and I purchased exam music on their behalf about 6 weeks ago (after their last lesson) and becuase I haven't seen them I'm still out of pocket!

Any advice?

Sarah


How about a rule with these normally reliable students that you'll be tolerant with one or two cancellations over the course of a term but any more than that, especially if cancelled at short notice, will have to be paid for? Because the numbers of cancellations are getting too high from your point of view? I think any reasonable person would accept this.

I used to teach a brother and sister whose mother was the parent from that fiery place they talk about in the Bible. She kept cancelling at short notice or 'forget' to bring them to lessons until I was driven to the lengths of demanding payment for every missed lesson, no excuses. She meekly paid up. I've since found out that she messes around everyone she comes into contact with frequent lies about broken-down cars, mysterious illnesses, injured backs etc etc. It was all a pack of lies from the start! The trouble was she was also very charming and you instinctively wanted to let her off (I don't issue contracts because the vast majority of my students are very good). However, I hardened up (just with her) and she responded well - probably because she knew exactly how much she'd been lying and blatantly messing me around!!! Old posters here will remember her well - yes it was doc mum. I'm very glad (from my point of view) her two kids have given up - it just wasn't worth the headache. smile.gif
Misterioso
I was in a similar situation with late cancellations last year - until I introduced a late cancellation flat fee (minimum 24 hours notice or pay up). I sent a letter to every parent / student - old and new alike - explaining what I was doing and why I was doing it. Nobody complained, and I haven't had half the problems since. (But I don't enforce it in cases of sickness.) I gave a brief verbal explanation along with the letter to two or three students / parents who have never caused me any bother,

I don't think you should feel awkward about handing out Terms and Conditions to existing students. It was pointed out to me that if I took myself seriously, other people would too. You have been very accommodating in the past, and they will expect you to carry on being accommodating unless you put your foot down.

Good luck!



Samick
QUOTE(sarahk @ Jan 2 2008, 02:39 PM) *

This is so frustrating! I have two singing students, 2 cousins who come for a shared hour singing lesson once a week. They are my first students, really great girls doing really well and their parents are lovely too.

I have been very accommodating with them in the past when theyve had drama rehearsals, rescheduling to convenient times and and working late for them when their car broke down but I'm starting to feel like i'm being taken advantage of. The past three lessons that they have said they can come too (spread over about 6 weeks over xmas as it is) have all been cancelled by text message a few hours before the lesson. The first week there was an emergency and nobody could drive them over (they live about 15 miles away), the second week they'd been asked to attend last minute rehearsals for something and then just now i've had a call saying both girls are sick!

I have just introduced terms and conditions with any new pupils I take on but how do I suddenly give these to existing students especially those that don't mess me around? Another difficulty is that these girls pay by the week so I have no way of retaining money and I purchased exam music on their behalf about 6 weeks ago (after their last lesson) and becuase I haven't seen them I'm still out of pocket!

Any advice?

Sarah


Yes, I share your frustration!

I've currently got an adult who has been giving me the "run around" with last minute cancellations - "family problems", "no transport", "crisis at work", "no cash this week" to name but a few! It's a pity, because she's very enthusiastic, is progressing very well, and the lessons are enjoyable.

However, enough is enough, and just before Christmas I told her that if lessons continued to consistently be cancelled from January onwards, I would not be able to guarantee that her regular lesson "slot" would be available, and may offer it to another adult who wants to come later, allowing me to take on another younger student at an earlier more suitable time. She appeared to take this on board, especially when I asked her how she would feel if she kept turning up for work and her employer kept sending her home without pay because he didn't require her services on that particular day. They do seem to forget that Teacher's also have bills to pay!

I haven't been teaching for that long, (and fortunately teaching isn't my sole income) but am learning fast that you need to "call the shots" if you don't want to be messed around! She's due to come tonight......just waiting for the call.......!!!
Good luck
sarahk
Thanks for all your replies. I know i'm just going to have to bite the bullet and give out the Ts and C's, i'm a bit of a wimp though - I haven't quite adjusted to the business running aspect of this yet. My only concern really is losing the students over it as I haven't been doing this long and therefore don't have a waiting list to fill the spaces yet!

Sarah
Susie
QUOTE(sarahk @ Jan 3 2008, 08:56 AM) *

Thanks for all your replies. I know i'm just going to have to bite the bullet and give out the Ts and C's, i'm a bit of a wimp though - I haven't quite adjusted to the business running aspect of this yet. My only concern really is losing the students over it as I haven't been doing this long and therefore don't have a waiting list to fill the spaces yet!

Sarah


I agree with others who say you need to be firm with these particular students, pleasant as they may be. Funny that they should have cancelled lessons over Christmas. huh.gif

As regards your waiting list - I generally try not to have a waiting list since I only work part-time and my pupils tend to be fairly stable. However, I did have a bad patch where a couple left, and I had no replacements and I began to doubt myself. But I think new students are a bit like buses, none coming along for a while, and then several together, so I wouldn't worry too much if these two leave. I'm sure some more pupils will be along soon. smile.gif
Glass Mountain
QUOTE(sarahk @ Jan 3 2008, 08:56 AM) *

Thanks for all your replies. I know i'm just going to have to bite the bullet and give out the Ts and C's, i'm a bit of a wimp though - I haven't quite adjusted to the business running aspect of this yet. My only concern really is losing the students over it as I haven't been doing this long and therefore don't have a waiting list to fill the spaces yet!

Sarah

Hi Sarah. Just been reading this and I can identify with you. I was also a 'bit of a wimp' but getting the Ts and Cs in progress (with lots of advice from this forum) has sorted most of the problems out (there's not half as much sickness as there used to be). Go for it....... You'll soon build up a waiting list as the present pupils begin to respect you more! Good Luck! ps - I do offer flexibility if I have at least 24 hours notice and can swap pupils - I find this works well too as they realize I'm just not out for the money, but actually WANT them to have ALL their lessons for their sakes.
diapason
QUOTE(dcmbarton @ Jan 2 2008, 03:02 PM) *

That sounds a familiar story, and its very difficult accomodating pupils who only come 'every so often'. I don't think you should feel bad about giving them a copy of your T&C's, especially the way they are treating you (however nice they are).

David


and HOW familiar this is....... I have a mature lady pupil (organ) who has lessons once a fortnight because of her "social diary"

She cancels or tries to re-arrange 6 lessons out of every 10 (on average) and about 6 weeks before Christmas the "social diary" kicked in in force. But the thing is that she expects me to hold her fortnightly Thursday 12.30 spot exclusively for her, regardless of how often she makes use of it.
So..........when she phoned to "postpone my next lesson..you DOOO understand, don't you?........" I said "That's OK, but I'm rather busy before Christmas. I'll phone you in the New Year when I can see my way clear and my 2008 schedules are sorted".
Her response was an indignant " I DO hope you're not letting my Thursday spot to someone else!!!"

It's not as if she pays me in advance, or a "retainer fee"...........I WISH!!

She's still waiting. It's a case of "don't call ME, I'll call YOU".

If she decides to "dump" me, I'll hardly feel the jolt £-wise. (sorry to sound mercenary, but I do this for a living and I can fill the spot easily)

Becoming a grumpy old man - I don't think so wink.gif
Dulciana
QUOTE(Misterioso @ Jan 2 2008, 03:32 PM) *

I was in a similar situation with late cancellations last year - until I introduced a late cancellation flat fee (minimum 24 hours notice or pay up).

Good luck!


I think even allowing them the option to get out of paying by giving 24 hour notice is generous! Potentially that could lead to quite a few cancellations and the teacher's income could be unpredictable. I don't do official T&Cs but I do send out a letter outlining what I expect and what they can expect from me - and it seems to work. I simply say that absences are not allowable unless it's because of genuine illness or an important school function, in which case I'll reschedule at a mutually convenient time. However, in reality, if somebody gives me plenty of notice about something else that's important to them, and they're not the messing around type, I will do my best to reschedule that as well - within reason. If they get to know that you're accomodating and reasonable they're less likely to mess you around - especially if refunding fees is not an option! (I'm paid in advance by the term, which also makes life easier! If you want to introduce T&Cs for the first time, it might be better to introduce advance payment first.)
Violinia
I don't give out a contract thingy because I'd rather they didn't think it was OK to cancel at any 24 hours' notice! Neither would I feel right about taking the money when a child is genuinely ill. Do any of you with contracts wrestle with your consciences - or wonder about theirs from time to time?

Think about it - scatty mother forgets to remind child to practise.

Or child comes out of school all whiney going: 'do I really have to go to my lesson today?'

Or they have a party they want to go to.

In all these situations, the mother can cancel 24 hours before lesson and not have to pay that week. You lose out.

On the other hand, child suddenly goes down with raging fever at school and has to be brought home - lesson less than 24 hours later so you have to be paid.

With no contract, I've found 99% of my students to be really good about turning up. On my part, I let it go when the child is ill because they've got enough problems without having to pay me as well. If a child started being ill, or 'ill' more than say once a term, then I'd have to think again, but it very rarely happens.

A couple of weeks ago a mum actually forgot to bring the child to the lesson! I was a bit nonplussed but because they've been 100% reliable for years decided to let it go when they rang all mortified. But no, the mother turned up to the next lesson brandishing the previous week's money for me. I tried refusing to take it, saying we can all make mistakes - but she was adamant.

So for me a climate of trust is best - it seems to work really well. The only person who ever tried abusing that trust was the notorious 'doc mum' and in the end I made a separate rule for her - miss a lesson for any reason and you pay up, mate, because I no longer believed any of her excuses. Some of them may have been genuine but by then I was past caring and just sick of being taken advantage of. Both her kids soon gave up after that and I was glad to see the back of her, frankly.
AnnC
QUOTE(Violinia @ Jan 6 2008, 04:07 PM) *

I don't give out a contract thingy because I'd rather they didn't think it was OK to cancel at any 24 hours' notice! Neither would I feel right about taking the money when a child is genuinely ill. Do any of you with contracts wrestle with your consciences - or wonder about theirs from time to time?

Think about it - scatty mother forgets to remind child to practise.

Or child comes out of school all whiney going: 'do I really have to go to my lesson today?'

Or they have a party they want to go to.

In all these situations, the mother can cancel 24 hours before lesson and not have to pay that week. You lose out.

On the other hand, child suddenly goes down with raging fever at school and has to be brought home - lesson less than 24 hours later so you have to be paid.

With no contract, I've found 99% of my students to be really good about turning up. On my part, I let it go when the child is ill because they've got enough problems without having to pay me as well. If a child started being ill, or 'ill' more than say once a term, then I'd have to think again, but it very rarely happens.

A couple of weeks ago a mum actually forgot to bring the child to the lesson! I was a bit nonplussed but because they've been 100% reliable for years decided to let it go when they rang all mortified. But no, the mother turned up to the next lesson brandishing the previous week's money for me. I tried refusing to take it, saying we can all make mistakes - but she was adamant.

So for me a climate of trust is best - it seems to work really well. The only person who ever tried abusing that trust was the notorious 'doc mum' and in the end I made a separate rule for her - miss a lesson for any reason and you pay up, mate, because I no longer believed any of her excuses. Some of them may have been genuine but by then I was past caring and just sick of being taken advantage of. Both her kids soon gave up after that and I was glad to see the back of her, frankly.


That's exactly what I do, though I do mention Ts & Cs at the first lesson, and there is a copy on my noticeboard. This is purely to enforce the notice period really (4 weeks), but I do say that "short notice cancellations will have to be paid for unless the circumstances are exceptional - at my discretion."
Like you, I find that 99% of students play fair with me - the odd 1% I get rid of.
I did try introducing a signed contract once, and it was not popular. If they are going to mess you about, they'll do it, contract or not.
primrose
QUOTE(AnnC @ Jan 6 2008, 05:37 PM) *
I did try introducing a signed contract once, and it was not popular. If they are going to mess you about, they'll do it, contract or not.
Surely payment in advance is more effective than a contract saying they have to pay even if they cancel? If they've already paid, they can't mess you about.
Dugazon
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sbhoa
It can sound hard to charge people for lessons missed due to illness but this is how it works with things like swimming lessons. They have to pay up front and there are no refunds or rearranged lessons for things like that so why should the music lesson be different? Especially if this is the teacher's main or only income.
In some ways it hits harder if teaching only a few hours. At the moment if one of mine doesn't pay it's a quarter of the weeks takings. Can be a pain when I 'know' I've got money coming in that doesn't actually appear because of a cancelled lesson. Mostly I charge a month in advance now.
AnnC
QUOTE(primrose @ Jan 6 2008, 06:35 PM) *

QUOTE(AnnC @ Jan 6 2008, 05:37 PM) *
I did try introducing a signed contract once, and it was not popular. If they are going to mess you about, they'll do it, contract or not.
Surely payment in advance is more effective than a contract saying they have to pay even if they cancel? If they've already paid, they can't mess you about.


Very true, but I don't believe in advance payments - although I would be the first to agree it's a good idea. If my parents had had to pay in advance, they would not have been able to afford my singing and piano lessons. Likewise, I have never been charged up front for any of my childrens' piano/violin/flute lessons.
It'a also partly to do with my own attitude. If a student arrives for a lesson that's already been paid for (I have one or two who like to pay me when they get paid), somehow I lose interest. There's something nice about being paid for the work you've just done,
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