I have a pupil doing flute grade 5 at the next session. She is using the new syllabus, and playing the Loeillet from List A.
There are a number of places where it is indicated by a + sign that some ornamentation is required. Some of these have been realised above the music, and some not.
My feeling is that "if it sounds right, it is right" and we have been experimenting with various styles of ornamentation, including departing from the given realisations. But is there a hard and fast rule about what should be done in these places (apart from starting trills on the upper note)?
As a first study clarinet player I am not au fait with all the conventions of Baroque music! Any suggestions gratefully received...

I'd be interested to know views on this too. I'm an oboist so Baroque is more familiar to me, but I'm only now getting to the stage of putting students in for exams where ornamentation starts to be more important. (Have only had grades 2/3/4 so far).

I know what I would do myself, but personally I worry whether it will be frowned upon if it's not done 'by the book'. Eg. in some AB books (like the piano exam books) you get *really* exact formulations for the different ornaments. And it's taught like that in the theory grades too. I don't follow these in my own playing as I think they sound formulaic - but I fret slightly that an examiner might expect them to be done that way!

I went to one of the seminars where the new syllabus was demonstrated and discussed. Apparently the Board are quite relaxed over baroque ornamentation, including which note the trill starts on. There is certainly no compulsion to keep to the editor's suggested realisation, and I almost never do.

Phew!

Go with your gut instinct - I rarely use any written out suggestions.

Aahhhh......baroque............

Baggle x

Baroque ornamentation is a huge area of study. Usually a trill will have three parts; the preparation, usually an appoggiatura, the trill itself where the notes alternate rapidly and then the termination which is often a turn. Shorter trils don't always have all of these elements. Cadential trills usually do though and can sound rather naked without them. In slow movements the notes of the trill be less hurried than in a faster one and it is a good rule that if it sounds right then it probably is.

I'm not a flautist, so I feel like a trespasser here, but I found this VERY useful page:
http://www.oldflutes.com/articles/classicaltrill/index.htm
which mentions Quantz (1752), the bible for baroque flautists, I gather.

Hope that helps!

Can I recommend Frederick Neumann's monumental tome Ornamentation in Baroque and Post-Baroque Music ...

I find it hard to swallow that the ABRSM are 'relaxed' about ornamentation. To me that would like be taking a 'relaxed' approach to playing the right notes...

I guess that meant 'relaxed as long as it's stylistic and appropriate'. Not 'make up whatever you like'.

In the same way some concepts are simplified for GCSE in various subjects: what is expected at that level is not what would be expected at degree level. At diploma level, the expectations are somewhat higher.


And yes, Quantz is definitely the 'Bible' here, and not just for flautists.

I agree with you, but surely there must be some basic fundamentals which need to be adhered to!

Well, yes and no. In the early grades, ornaments can be omitted altogether. The candidate won't necessarily get a distinction mark, but it is sometimes safer to go for a safe, unornamented version rather than a trill that might throw the whole piece off course.

From Grade 6, they are increasingly looking for stylistic awareness from the candidate.

Interestingly, the Baroque pieces in the new Grades 1-5 books have editorial dynamics and articulation. the upper grade Baroque pieces are printed as Urtext.

Baroque Trills!!! Quantz!!!!

Yummy yummy yummy!

attagirl, aspiringmusicteacher....!! indeed...

C'mon guys, no need to get h.e.a.v.y. Let's dig the COOLNESS of these ornaments....sure there are rules but, hey CHILL...........

Guzzling red,

Anna Magdalena Bag xx

Anna Magdalena Bag indeed... !

Haha! LOVE it.

Don't you mean the Notenbuchlein Fur Betty-Sue Bach.

We really do need an Early Music Forum!

I wholeheartedly second that motion..........

I am dusting down my anorak and cultivating my hairy ankles in anticipation.............

A-M Bag x

Oi! I take offence at that! Heehee... I'm certainly not an anorak wearing, hairy ankled Baroque ornamentation lover.... I like to think I'm actually kinda cooooooool.... yeah RIGHT.

My dear, my dear - recorder players don't come trendier than ME! I do a mean line in pink faux snake-skin boots you know. One of my pupes (that you are about to take on!) said "you know for an old person, Bagpuss, you REALLY know how to dress.............................

Gucci (hand)Bag xx

I don't see the connection here. Are early music freaks supposed to be oddly dressed? I cannot see a problem. I am sitting here in my jeans, borrowed man's top from Tesco's and a few bits of hay in my hair, and no shoes as I left my muddy wellies at the door, thinking of just how perfectly normal I look. And I really do want an Early Music Forum.

Humble apologies for my sense of humour.

B.

you make me laugh Bag...

Not needed! It was funny.