I'm just wondering what type of vibrato you use.

I'm a bit confused. I can do both arm and hand vibrato, I'm not sure which one to use and when I should use each one. My teacher only uses hand vibrato. When I watch violin players on TV or on youtube, most of them either use one or the other but not both and the majority of them tend to use hand vibrato. I tried to get my teacher to explain it to me and she said she just prefers hand vibrato because there is better control. But I find that I can control both of them quite well so I'm not sure what to use!

I'm a 'novice' vibrato player ( ) but it's developing quite well and my control has improved hugely over the last few months.

I mostly use arm vibrato but I don't know if it's because I have very short fingers but I seem to use hand vibrato for my third sometimes and fourth fingers most of the time. I think my fourth finger just isn't flexible enough to move the whole arm too. First and second fingers I use arm vibrato... well I try

I think I do a combination...

My first teacher taught me arm vibrato, my second teacher hand vib, and my third teacher kind of combined the two. At least, that is what it feels like, but maybe it is just arm vibrato with the looser wrist that it should have had in the first place. I get the best sound with it so I've stuck to it.

It depends on the piece or the effect/sound you're going for i guess

I am glad I read that question twice!

(A very 'small handed' violinist replying) Absolutely no reason why hand size or length of fingers should affect arm vibrato on the third or fourth fingers. Tension is the main problem - one reason why most pupils claim they can't do arm vib at all - and don't let the first and second fingers star gaze (point up to the ceiling) as that will cause hand/forearm tension as well.

It is important to be able to do both types of vibrato, even if you have a preference for one. As for others asking when to use each type - your emotional response to the music you are playing should be your guiding factor. In general, a wide arm vibrato suits music that languishes or is intensely melancholic (esp. romantic repertoire onwards), while a narrower hand vibrato will enliven something like a Mozart allegro movement.

It's amazing how deliberately using the wrong type of vibrato can make the music sound all wrong. A bit like putting a 33 rpm on at 45 rpm, or vice versa (for the much younger forum members who may only be familiar with CDs, I'm referring to vinyl records).

When I came to my current teacher last year, I had a pretty shaky (no pun intended) hand vibrato. Since then my teacher's worked with me on developing my arm vibrato, and now I seem to use a mixture of the two, but I do still find at times I have to conciously make myself use arm vibrato if I'm tensed up or whatever.

Thanks for explaining it AmandaL! I've been testing it out (I've probably annoyed my neighbours by making strange random noises!), I know what you mean, they do sound different! The arm vibrato sounds more romantic, relaxing and sad. The hand vibrato can be played faster, like a sudden burst of energy. I find that hand vibrato takes up less energy, that's probably why when I watch things like the Proms on TV, the majority of the string players uses hand vibrato?

The beginners orchestra I go to is in a freezing cold church, I find it hard to do arm vibrato when it's cold cos I end up shaking too much!

I think most arm vibratos turn into hand vibrato and even finger vibrato which some players used in the past. Anyway surely it's the width and speed that counts, not whether it comes from the arm or the wrist? One thing I can't stand is a too wide vibrato that disturbs the intonation of the note - it's important to remember that the note should always vibrate to a pitch slightly below the actual note and back to the note, never above it.

Also - avoid a continuous vibrato and try not to use it as a method of tone production when most tone production should come from the bow arm. Fritz Kreisler used a continuous vibrato even through fast scale passages but I'm not sure if anyone else should attempt it! In other words the less you use vibrato the more effective it is when you do use it!

Hear hear -- well said! I hate 'automatic' vibrato.

That's very unusual...
I use a very wristy vibrato but am trying to incorporate more arm into it. Obviously the proportions vary but it's good to have the maximum range of vibrato possible at your disposal.
I agree that it's the sound that counts and I'm actually pretty happy with my vibrato sound right now, but after hearing Levon Chilingirian comment on my playing I realised that having a vibrato generated by the arm allows for a more stable hand position which makes intonation less of an issue.

How come Levon Chilingirian has heard you play?!? That's great!!! A close friend of mine has just become 2nd violinist in the Chilingirian Quartet and I can't wait to go and hear them play....

He judged a competition final I was in. Very good adjudicator (and no I didn't win), his comments were useful and not overly damning or patronising. I was hoping to keep in touch with him and maybe go for a lesson or two sometime but can't find contact details. He seems like the kind of guy who would be a really top teacher...
Wow - that's pretty cool! I hope you get to hear them, keep us updated?

I use my whole forearm, it's really difficult to use just your hand on a cello using the whole arm gives a warmer and more relaxed vibrato

Yes, it is width and frequency that counts, but this is much more likely to be achieved with arm vibrato because it allows greater control.

The note should vibrate to a pitch below the actual note when you are using wrist vibrato. Arm vibrato both flattens and sharpens the note.

Surely even with arm vibrato you should meticulously avoid going above the pitch of the note? I know some violinists do let their arm vibrato take them above the note, which I find personally unbearable to listen to!!!

Do you think it's OK to go above as well as below the note?

Bohemian - wow, you're very brave to go in for a competition with Chilingirian as adjudicator! Bet the comments were good - you're a lovely player. You can contact Chilingirian through the Royal College where they're quartet in residence. If I go to one of these 'coffee concerts' at Wigmore Hall with my mum sometime we must meet up with you! Yikes, just checked it out and seen they're doing a concert at 11.00am on Sunday March 30. Will have to think about this!

It would be fantastic to hear them, and also a chance for you to meet Chilingirian, us to meet, my mum to meet Richard.... hmmmm! They're playing Bartok and Beethoven - trouble is, my mum can't stand Bartok (bit late to change her mind at the age of 87). And I'm going to Brussels in the middle of March whihc means trips to London - aargh, decisions decisions...

Brave is right, wise maybe not! Everyone else in it was 2nd or 3rd year RCM or RNCM so it was pretty daunting, but nice to be judged on a level playing field with them, and at least I wasn't the worst The comments weren't great, but all the criticism was technique, not musical. Anyone can fix technique with time, but at least he wasn't patronising like he was to a couple of people.
And thanks for the contact idea - I'll give that a go.


It would be great to go to that, I'm pretty certain it's during school holidays and if I'm in the country I'll definitely be there. My own quartet are playing Beethoven and Bartok (different quartets though) right now, it's a great programme (esp Beethoven Am, one of the best).

this is gonna sound really bad, but i'm grade 8 vuiolin, and i dont know which vibrato i use!!!!!!!

what's the difference?!

On guitar, everything from finger to arm depending on the piece.

On Violin, much as I love the sound, I'm nowhere close to even attempting vibrato yet. Time and practice... Time and practice....

Cheers,

Matt.

...

Arm vibrato is the one where you move your wrist and arm and produces a wide vibrato compared to hand vibrato which is usually an up and down motion with your finger. I use both, I use arm vibrato when I want a note to sound great, and I usualy use wrist vibrato.

Vibrato is often hopelessly overused these days.

I just wish I could do vibrato - any type!

It's not all that difficult, on cello you basically have to roll your finger back and forth controlling it using the rest of your forearm check out some cellist videos on youtube and observe their techniques

I agree with both comments here. Personally I can't stand the Anne-Sophie Mutter recordings of the Bach concerti. It makes me want to put my heands over my ears and run screaming from the room.

Her vibrato is one of the most uninteresting I've ever heard and in the Bach slow movements, it's just horrendous. Full-on ALL of the time and no variety in it's speed or width. It makes the music sound dreadful and very boring too.

Me too, keep watching youtube to find out how to do it on the violin so I could experiment but I've got no idea. Oh well, I guess it will be one of those things that continue to elude me for now, along with playing a piece half decently at the moment!

My first teacher taught me hand vibrato, my second teacher was a imbecile who didn't teach me either (moving on ), my third teacher taught me a combination of arm/hand vibrato, and my temporary teacher used hand vibrato, so I'm not really sure myself. With a combination of the two I usually get the best sound and control, so I tend to stick to that. Sometimes if the piece I'm working on needs something special I'll try something else, but that's about the only exception. =)

Sydney