As a high school music teacher (some of the time) I'd decided to start of two youngsters on oboe... bought four reeds, and gave them each a working instrument... one has come back with splintered reeds and bent keys, after only the first week, and I'm cross!

Do I let him have it back with a serious talking to, or give him up as a bad job?

It depends how much the Oboe resembles a pile of scrap metal. Elder son was devastated when he dropped his flute and bent a rod, but his teacher fixed it. I'd try the stern talk about treating these things gently first. (sees pound signs at the cost of new reeds even the winfield ones my pupils use are at least a tenner each)

How on earth does one do that? Even dropping an instrument doesn't usually result in huge amounts of damage unless you're really unlucky! How bad is it?

What did he have to say about it? What was his attitude? One mishap perhaps is understandable, but this sounds like a more concerted attack!

humm.. tricky. same thing happened to me a school flute lent a banana one came back. They were told to go have it fixed. I think if its keys do they realise how delicate the mechanism is and how old are the kids?

The reeds well... they will soon learn(LOL if they want to) about the cost, or at least their parents will!!

Well, I've taken the oboe back, and gently bent back the side Ab key--- some of the rods underneath are also bent, but I might be able to solve that. He's to come and see me on Monday, by which time I'll've had a chance to sleep on it, and see what you all think!

Both pupils knew that after the two reeds I'd supplied them with, they had to buy their own, so his turn has come round rather quickly! He did mention that he'd have to stop his brother and sister playing on it...!

Perhaps you need to have a word with the parents?

I'm a bit worried about you sleeping on the oboe....isn't there the risk of further damage?

nick

By the sounds of things, these woodwind pupils have been doing the same thing with their instruments as some of the kids I teach the violin to - sword fighting with the bow and sometimes even the violin itself!!!!

Whether it's deliberate sabotage (to avoid practice?), or whether they just think fencing with a violin (bow) is just funny, I don't know, but it's becoming an increasingly worrying problem amongst peri groups.

Do these children have no respect for anything? Is our wasteful, 'throw-it-away and get a new one' society getting worse with the up and coming generations?

I'd be a bit more than cross!

Assuming you'd already agreed this with their parents, didn't you explain about the cost and fragility of oboes? Did the parents understand?

How old is the kid? No doubt you'd given them a lesson in oboe care, so the boy's behaviour is unnaceptable and you should tell the parents asap.

Steve

There was indeed the preparatory lesson in oboe care... The parents aren't paying for the lessons- both my HOD and I are relatively new to the department, and because the head won't release any more funds for peris, HOD and I are teaching our specialisms in our lunch break (me woodwind, and him brass and wind ensembles). We're both expending a lot of time and energy, and I think that this is partly what makes me so cross about the treament of the oboe- that I'd 'had a word' about care of it, and that the parents are paying precisely nothing for the reeds or my time, yet it came back in the state it did! Grr!

I think I may talk to him on Monday, and discuss the need for him to buy his own reeds from hereon in- perhaps the expense will make him think on!

I think not charging for lessons or instrument hire is a big mistake. These days, money is God for many people, and they think if you don't pay for something it can't be worth very much - or is that too cynical?

When our music centre lends out instruments (a) there is a charge (£15 per term I think) (b) parents are told they must insure the instrument (again this isn't too much), and the child is only allowed to take it home when this has been done - this really brings it home to parents how much the instrument costs, so that they make sure the child looks after it.

Children today very often do not have much respect for things - you should see the number of pencils, protractors, rubbers and rulers I pick up in a month at school! But cars are rarely damaged, because the parents care about cars. Anyone who doesn't care for an instrument shouldn't be playing one IMO, but it's possible that this boy had not taken on board how delicate an oboe is. Make this very, very clear on Monday, and also tell him that if there is any more damage he will lose the oboe to someone more inclined to take care of it.

Yes, but are they aware of how much oboes cost? Since they agreed with you for their children to learn the oboe, surely they must understand?

I think it's extremely important to have a good line of communication with parents.

I correspond with my eldest son's teacher (she's at the school) via email or phone. With our other son's teacher (private), I see her once a week and also talk via email/phone. Both teachers get my 100% support.

Steve

I second the importance of telling parents how much things cost.

My daughter's trombone is hired from the music school. We pay 75 Euros for the year. Before being allowed to take the trombone home I had to sign an agreement which bascially said that I was responsible for any damage that she might do to it and I also had to provide them with proof that I had insurance for the instrument within a month. The price of the instrument (ostensibly for insurance purposes) was written in large numbers in almost the first sentence. My daughter was very disappointed because her trombone lesson was after the secretary's office had shut so at the end of the lesson she had to give the trombone back to her teacher and wait for me to go and sign the papers the next day (and pick up the trombone then).

That said, the father of one of my oboe's teacher's pupil's teaches theory at the music school and his son is incredibly rough with the oboe and the reeds. Apparently they have had to have the Ab pad replaced three times since the beginning of the year because he forces the two parts together. My teacher has also stopped supplying him with "free" reeds because he has already got through 12 since September (we pay a lump sum at the start of the year to cover the cost of reeds) and this is his third year of oboe playing so he ought to know what he is doing. I do think it is partly a parent problem, however, as I was horrified to see this boy's younger brother bumping his cello (in its soft case) on the stone floor as he walked down the corridor one day.

Both my kids want to "have a go" at my oboe, but I won't let them for dental reasons. Sure when I was learning I knocked the Ab trill key a bit, and the Ab pad was forever filling with water, but save the odd spring pinging (something I got rather adept at fixing myself) I don't recall being heavy on repairs.

I had problems with the Rods in my Cor wanting to continually twist out of place, but that eventually got fixed.

I can recall wanting to turn my oboe into scrap metal and matchwood when working on my grade 8, but never would have, firstly that was the love/hate relationship teenagers have with an instrument when trying to get to that level, secondly I knew what it was worth!

Children need to be told to keep their siblings away from their instruments, especially if they are much younger. A young child could choke very badly on an Oboe reed, get splinters in their mouth anything. That's without the potential for damage to the instrument.

When I first startled learning the violin (ages 10), I borrowed an instrument from my school. It was the most awful violin I have ever encountered, but the first thing we were told before we were allowed to take them home, was that we were NEVER to let anyone else play our instruments!! Maybe this needs to be made more clear!

Poor instrument.

I always think my parents had the right idea when I started learning to play the flute: I payed for it myself. As I was 11 at the time, and it was £175 (a third of my life savings!) second hand, I had plenty of respect for it!

Same thing happened when I bought my upgrade flute 4 or 5 years later, although on this occasion my parents agreed to pay half.

Definetly have a chat with your student. Try not to be angry though, maybe emphasise how you were trusting him to be responsible, and are disappointed etc.

Apologies for my earlier, tongue in cheek post. This must be very frustrating

I think it is difficult getting young children to understand the notion of taking care of things (I remeber as a small boy dismantling my mother's cushions just out of curiousity).

Looks like getting the parents to police instrument care is the best bet. What about taking a deposit for instruments before children can take them home? Deposit to be returned provided the instrument is returned undamaged, any repair costs to be deducted?

best
nick

Thanks for all this

You really think you're doing the right thing, introducing children to the wonders of music, but not charging the parents... we work in a fairly low- income area, and money would be a real obstacle to the parents of the children we teach. I rather like the idea of a 'contract' regarding instrument care and will talk to my HOD about it on Monday. I'm so frustrated, because I really thought I was doing a good thing!

Ho hum...

Our Music Service loans instruments for nothing, they merely ask the family to insure the instrument in case of loss or damage. I have never paid for Oboe lessons for my daughter and the instrument was a free loan. When that insturment back it was in virtually the same condition as when we borrowed it. I even replaced the cleaning cloth, the one that came with it wasn't really appropriate for an Oboe.

Not all families are throw away and that may or may not be the case with this child. I know of some familes where the children are brought up with no sense of ownership. Lots of things are communal, lack of discipline and self discipline means that they don't respect other peoples property.

We pay £15 a term for hire but don't have to insure the instrument, and lessons are free. If it's damaged severly I think you'd have to pay (if teacher couldn't repair it) but accidental damage is overlooked and repaired by the teacher. If you're in the Youth Orchestra you may be offered a Youth Orchestra instrument like me by your teacher, and that's free (although everyone pays £20 a term for Y.O. fees, even if they have their own/music service instrument.) However, my Y.O. cello is very chipped on one side making it not attractive so I would love my own, especially seeing as two people who sit in Y.O. not playing and don't go to their lessons have their own.

I feel I should add, try not to be too disheartened by this. Your aims are truely admirable.

Try and consider it a learning experience, and hopefully with time you'll make a real sucess of it.