I have been playing music for over thirty years but have only recently decided to acquire some qualifications. It's not that I need Qs, just that I thought it would be fun to do so.

My main instrument is the mandolin. I also play the octave mandola, bouzouki, low whistle and, more recently, the cuatro del puerto rico.

I looked at the ABRSM syllabus. Erm ... it would appear they either don't rate my instruments as worthy, or they don't know what they are! (Although I'm sure most people know what a mandolin is.) As a result, there are no practical exams I can take, so I'll concentrate on theory.

Moreover, I play mostly traditional Celtic music: jigs and reels etc, and this too, despite being flippin' difficult to play well, is completely neglected in the ABRSM.

Discrimination? Snobbery? Ignorance?

Gordon

I'm afraid this all comes down to the fact that ultimately the ABRSM have to make money to pay the people that work for them and continue running. True, they exist to provide music exams but there is a lot of red tape and expense involved in producing a syllabus: they must hire many consultants (not noted for being the cheapest people in the world); have rigorous quality assurance measures and go through the accreditation procedure. They have to ensure that all of the exams are of equally high quality. I'd guess that some less popular instruments are subsidised by the more popular instruments; there are, however, only a small number of instruments that can be included on this basis so they will have to select carefully. They provide instrument exams for those instruments in which their expertise and main interests lie; if any instruments are subsidised I'd think it would be the less-popular orchestral ones to maintain a full orchestra worth of exams. The examiners are not instrumental specialists so they have to understand all the insturments that are being examined; I suspect the ABRSM would find it difficult to find a large number of people capable of examining the more rare instruments.

The ABRSM exist and provide a service: I don't think that they mean to imply any sort of inferiority of the types of music they don't examine, they just don't have the time and resources and expertise/interest to do it and I suspect that, due to the relative rarity of people playing those instruments, they would be making a loss on examining them and would effectively be paying you to take the exam (unless they set the exam fees at £9000!). It's back to the phenomenon I was discussing in another thread when people see a business they think that they have a right to have a certain service provided: if they haven't taken your money off you then they don't owe you anything: you can't complain that the ABRSM don't provide, for example, a bus service so why something else that they don't do?!

I'm sorry that they don't do any exams for your instrument: maybe you'll find some other boards or organisations that can help. In a short answer to your question I don't think it's any of your suggestions, just financial inviability and perhaps it's not something in which they have a great deal of expertise or interested people.

I think ABRSM only does exams for the Western type instruments, as this is learnt worldwide.

i dont think its discrimination...its just that there are not many ppl who play rare and unique instruments like yours

I am chinese and we have chinese instruments too! but you have to go to a chinese school to take exams i think :P

QUOTE (missfabflute @ Sep 30 2004, 02:40 PM)

I think ABRSM only does exams for the Western type instruments, as this is learnt worldwide. i dont think its discrimination...its just that there are not many ppl who play rare and unique instruments like yours I am chinese and we have chinese instruments too! but you have to go to a chinese school to take exams i think :P

i agree totally with you.
there are so many unique instruments out there, but it's just the fact that you need to pay people with the experience to examine and assess.

Thanks for the responses. I must admit, some of my instruments are slightly less common - but mandolin? I suspect there are more mandolins out there than, say, cor anglais or contrabassoons.

It just seems a bit sad to me that although traditional music, and the instruments upon which it is played, is well recognised in Ireland and Scotland, and that even now there is a BMus in Folk and Traditional Music at Newcastle University, our Royal Schools seem to ignore it.

Still, I (and traditional music) have survived without establishment recognition for long enough not to worry too much about it now. I'll just carry on playing!

QUOTE (Gordon @ Sep 30 2004, 11:11 AM)

Discrimination? Snobbery? Ignorance? Gordon

As if. Asking the ABRSM to provide exams for non-mainstream, non-Western instruments is like turning up at a butcher's asking for bread, then accusing them of discrimination because they don't sell it.

QUOTE

Thanks for the responses. I must admit, some of my instruments are slightly less common - but mandolin? I suspect there are more mandolins out there than, say, cor anglais or contrabassoons.

I'd be surprised, actually, if this is the case. I personally only know one person who plays the mandolin, but four who play the cor anglais and two who play the contrabassoon.

gordon,
The London College of Music & Media offer music exams in traditional Irish music and on various instruments.

I know someone who passed grade 2 banjo with Honours

note the LCM may not cover all gardes[1-8]

there is no grade 3 in traditional Irish music

Oh dear. I seem to have trodden on some sensitive toes here, and I'm sorry for that. I'm really not too bothered by this - the chip on my shoulder is really very small .

Still, I'm not sure what is meant by 'mainstream music' here. I'd have thought classical music (in its widest sense, and woefully inadequate, I know) is as mainstream as folk, blues or reggae. Still, I suppose as a label it's as good as anything. I have a friend who, though he plays traditional folk music, insists on calling it world or roots.

Rather more confusing is desribing the mandolin as non-western!

As confusing as describing the music of Ireland and Scotland as non-western, actually!

Rather than being like asking a butcher for bread, it's more like asking a butcher for black pudding. However, as a vegetarian I don't much like this metaphor anyway.

As to the numbers of mandolins relative to cor anglais and contrabassoons, of course I don't know the numbers. It was to make a point. However, it's not really surprising that you would know more cor anglais and contrabassoon players than mandolinists, is it? As it happens, I know more mandolinists! This merely reflects the type of people we associate with doesn't it?

Thanks to Eire 1916. I've looked at the LCMM website (it's part of Thames Valley University) but couldn't actually find what you described. I've emailed them for info.

Gordon