I'm trying to compose a piece for an ensemble, up until now I've got the main part for two Trumpets which I've been able to come up with by experimenting on my own Trumpet, but how is it best to come up with something which sounds good for the other instruments? (this is the first real bit of composition I've done)

I can ocassionally get onto Sibelius at school, but am not very competent in it and would rather not have to use it for composition.

Thanks

Could you talk to people that play other instruments and ask their advice on what sounds good/bad for their instrument? Having a jam together can often prove inspirational for composing.

It's a new adventure!

I did a string quartet for G4 Composition and booked a lesson with a strings teacher to talk about it.

Playing with the other instruments is a very good way of learning about them, but you can also get much useful information out of books. Gordon Jacob's "Orchestral Technique" is good introduction to orchestration, which discusses the instruments in their families and also covers how to put combine then in a score. For very complete information on the characteristics of a large number of instruments (six sizes of flute, five from the oboe family, 10 clarinet, two bassoons , seven saxophones etc.) I have Blatter, "Instrumentation and Orchestration" (second edition, 1997, 508 pp.; Simon & Schuster, New York, NY 10019; ISBN 0 00 02 82 864570 70 7). In particular, for each instrument, he gives the profile of natural dynamic level with pitch, discusses the character of different registers and describes alternate methods of sound production (e.g. pizzicato, mutes, multiphonics, key slapping). He also gives three ranges, "elementary", "high school" and "professional", and lots of examples of good writing, mostly from the standard orchestral repertoire.

Ok, thanks. I'll see if I can find a copy of either of those books, that might help

The issue is I can't really get to come up with ideas, I need at least some basic ideas for them... Although I know exactly who I'm composing for (Clarinet, Violin, Viola, Cello and two Trumpets - the ensemble already exists, it's just something my teacher's wanting me to do for it) they're all pretty good so I hope it should be alright, but the Clarinetist is now on exam leave, so it's a bit difficult...

Make sure the trumpets have got their mutes with them: then they can make a trio with the clarinet. Of course, you can also give them plenty of rests when you want one of the other instruments to dominate. Indeed, by the time you get to six instruments in an ensemble, they all need to have rests from time to time.

This reminds me that page turns are possible not only at rests, but also anywhere that the player needs only one hand for the instrument. A trumpet with a pinky hook can do that whenever the valve sequence is not too technical; open strings can be either bowed or (as in the Bartok Sonata for Solo Violin) plucked with the left hand. Some clarinet notes can certainly be fingered with the left hand; I don't know whether it can be held securely. A flute can, as can a horn, but the horn would have to be muted, since otherwise removing the hand from the bell would make the note sharp.

As a clarinetist the only note I am really comfortable turning pages on is g above middle C. The ones which are doable but precarious are middle C to D (Or Eb dependent on context) and the range a twelfth above that.

Talk to people about the instruments that are being playing, get hold of recordings and follow the scores as well, to see what works well and differing sounds in different ranges. If you want to post up the parts, then people are usually quite happy to see if its playable

Another book that I highly recommend is Samuel Adler, The Study of Orchestration. The third edition came out five or six years ago.

Is this music going to be tonal? If so, one approach would be to start by coming up with (provisional) harmony, if harmony wasn't already in your mind when you created the trumpet parts. That would steer you strongly towards a bass part, though you should be careful not to focus on simply making the inner parts fill out the chords, leading to dull parts.

Whether or not the music's tonal, it might be good to have the other parts play phrases that clearly derive from the existing trumpet parts. These could be just exact copies slid up or down diatonically, or in a related key if there are modulations (if the music's tonal) or the rhythm of the phrase used on different notes - eg, in similar motion to the original phrase, or inverted, on a completely different arrangement of pitches, or even on a single pitch.

Another possibility is: if there are any striking, short patterns - eg three of four notes with memorable rhythm and/or pitches lasting a second or two, either in the existing trumpet parts or that you write in another part - you could pick a couple and put them in significant places in the other parts.

The best outcome, in some respects, would be if all the parts appeared to act independently and were interesting in themseleves, whilst also being clearly related to the other parts and delivering your chosen harmony (or whatever) effortlessly, and with a few invigorating surprises during music that's otherwise progressing somewhat as the listener would expect. But if you could do that, we'd probably all have heard of you already.

I think, initially, you ought to continue in an exploratory phase, like you did in coming up with the trumpet parts. There's nothing wrong with a "what if ..." approach, where you just put some notes in the score (eg a phrase copied from another part) and see what it sounds like - even if it sounds awful, it might give you an idea of how to do something similar but better, or even spark a completely different idea. It doesn't matter if you enter the notes in a mechanical way, unable to hear how the instruments will sound together until you've (eg) heard the music played on the piano or by a computer program. In short, en route to the finished piece, it doesn't matter what you do to come up with ideas and how many bad ones you discard. But, once the piece starts taking shape, you may well find that you mentally hear passages that you simply want to write into the score.

It would be very surprising if you could do all this in your head and then write it down. It would also need a high level of skill to mentally hear all the parts you've written in a score, without any playing out loud of any kind - though perhaps you can do that?

I suggest that, since you have access to Sibelius, you should do some exploratory work either in Sibelius or in any other program that lets you get instant playback of what you're trying out (eg at school, my daughter has Garage Band; at home, I have Cubase). These programs also give you a rough idea of how the instruments will combine, though they might let you get the balance wrong - eg by turning down the trumpets' volume to let the clarinet be heard.

I hope that helps.