just wondering which of the many music colleges in the uk are good for bras instruments?

i know its too late to apply to some of them for me, but i am interested, as some of the hro ntutors at some of the colleges ive never heard of, but they might be great teachers who arent well known for they performances in orchestras/shows etc.

My Dad's friend teaches a brass instrument at RCM, I think.

my ex-horn teacher studied at the RCM, which is supposed to be very good for brass.
(i don't have a horn teacher at the moment. )

The best music college for horn and brass in general(and I have this on the excellent authority of several people who know what they're talking about) is...............................
Guildhall in London.
I know two horn players who got in to every single music college they auditioned for, and one even had a scholarship to RAM, and they both chose Guildhall. It's not the prettiest, but the teachers are the best. It's also the most difficult to get into-look at the audition requirements compared to the other music colleges!

has anyone tried playing the Bagatelle Guildhall request for the audition? its stupidly "modern" and the composer (Julia Gomelskaya or something) is obseesed with the interval of a tri-tone, especially in the lower register, and i had no idea how im going to figure out how the piano part fits in with it.

the horn tutors at guildhall are Jeff Bryant, Hugh Seenan, and my personal horn god man Richard Bissil.

QUOTE (hornplayer @ Oct 9 2004, 07:44 PM)

has anyone tried playing the Bagatelle Guildhall request for the audition? its stupidly "modern" and the composer (Julia Gomelskaya or something) is obseesed with the interval of a tri-tone, especially in the lower register, and i had no idea how im going to figure out how the piano part fits in with it. the horn tutors at guildhall are Jeff Bryant, Hugh Seenan, and my personal horn god man Richard Bissil.

Oh my goodness I hate the Bagatelle!! I can't bear playing it because I hate it so much, and out of all my pieces it probably needs the most practice because of all the stupid nasty intervals. I hate the low Es that keep on appearing, and there's nowhere to breathe, and getting it with the piano is going to be mad! I'm not looking forward to it!
On the other hand, I absolutely love the Oscar Franz concert study (also a guildhall set piece). It's far too beautiful to be a study!
Which piece have you chosen hornplayer? I went for the easy option- doing the Mozart!

according to my friend who plays th saxaphone, trinity is the best

i chose the reverie by glazanov because its so lyrical and gorgeous (altho breathing is a problem at such a slow tempo, crotchet = 60) and also mozart is over played and you have to play a cadenza dont you?

apparently, altho i didnt hear it, some kid played the theme to star wars as one of the candenzas in mozart's 4th horn concerto?!?!?

btw, did you get to the final round of the nyo? you never emailed e back

hornplayer xx

QUOTE (hornplayer @ Oct 10 2004, 08:56 PM)

i chose the reverie by glazanov because its so lyrical and gorgeous (altho breathing is a problem at such a slow tempo, crotchet = 60) and also mozart is over played and you have to play a cadenza dont you? apparently, altho i didnt hear it, some kid played the theme to star wars as one of the candenzas in mozart's 4th horn concerto?!?!? btw, did you get to the final round of the nyo? you never emailed e back hornplayer xx

My pedal A flats aren't so good- otherwise I would have done the Glazunow- it's beautiful! Yes, you have to do a cadenza for the Mozart- I'm just going to steal Dennis Brain's! I've never heard the star wars theme in a Mozart cadenza but have you heard the 'lyrics' to the tune of the rondo from Mozart 4? they're hilarious!
Yes I did get through to round 2 of nyo- I never got your email!! so sorry! did you? I'm sure I'll see you there!

i know some one who auditioned for several music colleges on horn and chose eventually to go to the royal northern college of music. (he did get a scholorship though...)

thats good cos ive applied to the royal northern!

yeh i got thro to the final round of the nyo auditions. which day are you auditioning? i might get to see you face to face before the nyo course (assuming we both get in).

am slightly worried that jim beck wont like my choice of audition piece - hindemith sonata first movement...........


my horn teacher went to trinity college, altho she said the only reason for not going to guildhall was that she didnt realise the auditions were so soon and she wasnt prepared or something!

where else are you applying hgirl?

Good luck with music college auditions and with final auditions for the NYO. Hopefully we can all look forward to seeing you play on TV in the proms next year! Were you in the NYO last year or is this the first year?

QUOTE (hornplayer @ Oct 13 2004, 05:10 PM)

thats good cos ive applied to the royal northern! yeh i got thro to the final round of the nyo auditions. which day are you auditioning? i might get to see you face to face before the nyo course (assuming we both get in). am slightly worried that jim beck wont like my choice of audition piece - hindemith sonata first movement........... my horn teacher went to trinity college, altho she said the only reason for not going to guildhall was that she didnt realise the auditions were so soon and she wasnt prepared or something! where else are you applying hgirl?

My auditions on the 1st saturday in November. I've been doing so much musical college practice I've sort of forgotten about it! I haven't looked at the study since I did the 1st round audition!
I played for Jim Beck in the 1st round, he was really nice to me (although I did play the Strauss and not Hindemith!) he can't complain if you play it brilliantly, which I'm sure you will!
I'm applying to RNCM(joint course with the university), RAM and Guildhall. My teacher went to Trinity too, but he didn't encourage me to apply there, not exactly sure why!

Btw, I wasn't in the NYO last year, I didn't audition. I sort of wish I had now!

i did audition last year, but it was a rushed decision (i posted the application the day of the deadline!) and i didnt get a chance to have a horn lesson before the audition............. (i didnt get in)

you have two rounds of auditions, the first in spetmeber is the regional heats, and then the final auditions in november where you audition against the existing members, and for lower brass (tuba, trombones) you audition in a workshop situation which sounds really scary!!!!!!!

im auditioning on the saturday aswell!!!!!!!!! at about ten o'clock tho, which means getting up about 5am - ish to get to the venue in time. i wish it was at the RCM, which is a lot easier to get to!

im also applying to guildhall and the royal nothern (joint course), but my third is birmingham conservatoire. i didnt really want to apply to the royal colleges, i'd never heard of the hron tutors, and a mean nasty girl in my year is applying to both on a stringed instrument, and i want to be as far away from her as possible!!!!!!!!!

just finished practising the bagatelle - its actually clicked really well, and ive only had it for about 10 days! dont wanna peak too soon, altho i havent tried it with piano yet!

Oh my audition is at 2.30 ish I think. My flight leaves at 7am and I'm staying with some friends in London on Saturday night and then flying home on sunday morning. So much effort for one wee audition! I hope they pay my travel expenses!
Do you know any of the players already in it? Do you know how many places there will be for new people? How many horn players will get through to the final round?

I hate Bagatelle!!! I don't think I'll ever come round to liking it, though I'm trying to force myself cos it really needs a lot of work!
Hope things are all going well for you!

I have no idea about existing members, cos I've recently found out that you can stay on after you've left school as long as you aren't still at music college.

I wont be seeing you at the auditions, as mine's at 10.10!
so i'm gonna have to get up at about 6-ish to cathch the train there. not impressed.

btw, when you met Jim Beck, did he always tell you in rehearsal to "put a down arrow on that" ?

QUOTE (hornplayer @ Oct 16 2004, 09:48 PM)

btw, when you met Jim Beck, did he always tell you in rehearsal to "put a down arrow on that" ?

no idea what you're talking about! Though I have only met him 3 times- once when I sat in on a lesson he was giving, once when he brought me and a friend out for drinks and once when he did my first round nyo audition, so he's never actually taken me in rehearsal! what does he mean?

QUOTE

btw, when you met Jim Beck, did he always tell you in rehearsal to "put a down arrow on that" ?

he told us to draw a down arrow on a lot of notes in sectionals, because he always thought individual notes were sharp! it turned into his catchphrase in the end!

i remember he didnt like my use of vibrato in the top reigster, i suppose in hindsight he DID have a point (i was only experimenting and it didnt sound so good), but i now reckon i've got it mastered. not that i'll use it in the audition, just in case he still doesnt approve!

QUOTE (hornplayer @ Oct 17 2004, 09:26 PM)

he told us to draw a down arrow on a lot of notes in sectionals, because he always thought individual notes were sharp! it turned into his catchphrase in the end! i remember he didnt like my use of vibrato in the top reigster, i suppose in hindsight he DID have a point (i was only experimenting and it didnt sound so good), but i now reckon i've got it mastered. not that i'll use it in the audition, just in case he still doesnt approve!

In that case if I'm ever in a rehearsal situation with him he'll be saying that ALL the time- I'm always sharp, always always! Exhaustive research has revelaed that it's partly due to my horn and partly due to me, so I'll probably end up having to dram massive arrows all over my music!

Hi hornplayer!

How did your nyo audition go?? Mine was a bit of a disaster! I warmed up far too much so my lips were wrecked going into the audition- I can't believe I was so stupid! The panel were very nice to me though. There's no way I'll have got in. I hope yours went well!

mine went well, apart from a few stupid slips in the study, which must have been nerves cos those bits never normally went wrong!!!!!!!! the room was stupidly hot too, my horn was slipping a bit.

i dont think jim beck likes me, he kept asking me to move it along when i was taking a bit of a break between the study and the hindemith. the talk went well, altho i said i wanted to go to manchester, and i dont think jim beckl wants to teach me horn.

got the letter just now, didnt get in, but i might write and see what their comments were, to make some improvements.

bit disappointed, especially considering the number of split notes the horns made at the nyo proms, i think i could split as many as they did!

hope you got in.

hornplayer xxx

Hi hornplayer!
I'm so sorry you didn't get in. It sounds like you played well- writing off to find out their comments is a really good idea.
I thought my audition went quite badly, entirely my own fault of course cos I warmed up too much. The piece went ok but I made lots of silly mistakes in the study, must have just been nerves I suppose!
They were nice to me in the talk though, and seemed bent on trying to find out whether I was going to uni or music college. I don't know that myself yet so I couldn't tell them! I completely forgot Jim beck taught at Manchester and I said I didn't really want to go there even tho I'd applied, and if I went to college I'd want to go to Guildhall! They must have taken pity on me cos they let me in! i don't really feel like I deserve it.
I'll be sorry not to see you on the courses- I'm sure we;ll bump into each other at some college audition or other- do you have your date for the Guildhall workshop yet?!
I'm terrified about the music college auditions now!
hgirl
xxx

the guidhall audition is in december. cant remeber the date, everything's a bit crazy at the mo.

did you get into the nyo? you never actually said, and they havent changed the names on the nyo website...........

QUOTE (hgirl @ Nov 10 2004, 09:59 PM)

They must have taken pity on me cos they let me in! i don't really feel like I deserve it.

Oh I did say! I did get in- though it hasn't really sunk in yet. I'll pm you the date of my guildhall audition- I'm sure they'll be on the same day cos of the workshop, unless millions of horns are auditioning..........

i have the same date as you for the audition, so i'll see you at the workshop! please be nice to me tho, i've got three days of interviews mon-wed before the guildhall audition.

crappy royal northern have given me a date that's the same as my interviews, and i've given them at least three days to get back to me with a new date! grrrrrrrrr................

QUOTE (hornplayer @ Nov 25 2004, 03:14 PM)

crappy royal northern have given me a date that's the same as my interviews, and i've given them at least three days to get back to me with a new date! grrrrrrrrr................

They did that to me too! In the end I didn't go to my RNCM audition because I got a scholarship to the Royal Academy and I'd rather be in London than in Manchester anyway. Guildhall is my first choice though! Of course I'll be nice to you in the workshop- you have to be nice to me though, I'm going to be terrified and my Cambridge interview is the next day!!!
Good luck in all your preparation, I hope your other auditions have gone well.

hey hgirl, just got home after 5 days of interviews and auditions, how did you think guildhall went?

im quite disappointed them didnt ask me to interview, oh well........perhaps i shud have played the Mozart like everyone else!

i hope they accept you, you played really well, the other versions of the Mozart didnt have anything on yours.

hornplayer xxx

How did you hear me? You weren't in my workshop were you??? Were you in the morning session? I looked down the list of names when I arrived and I was sure I saw your name towards the end of the list- I assumed you would be there in the afternoon. Did you play Reverie or Alla Caccia? I can't believe I didn't say hello to you or anything- that's terrible,you should have come and spoken to me! I was in such a daze that day though- our flight was delayed and we arrived really late, and my audition was the first of the day and I was really flustered, and Hugh Seenan was late and didn't even hear it and then I had to go first in the workshop etc etc etc- it's no wonder I was a bit dopey!
The interview was really informal and I can't see how they decide on people based just on that. Apparently 3 people were chosen for interviews from the afternoon workshop which means 9 people got interviews and they'll take 3 or 4. I find out tomorrow. I'm so scared! I had my Cambridge interview on Friday morning so I've had a rather stressful two weeks! How have your other auditions/interviews gone?

hgirl

There is one brilliant thing about the Guildhall auditions...........................................

we never EVER have to play Bagatelle again!

hey, im sure i was in the workshop with you, i was the crazy girl in the green top who played Alla Caccia!

i wasnt really in the right frame of mind for guildhall, i'd been up since 6am to catch a train from oxford, had to change at readsing, then get the tube from paddington to the babican - the tube stop is nowhere near the actual barbican! sunday to wednesday i had oxford interviews for music, and as my sister's at oxford and she stayed in college for last week i slept in her room and left my suitcase there while i was at guildhall. wasnt the best plan in the world because i could only take the bare essentials with me to london and i didnt get my suitcase home til saturday!

i really wished i'd played the mozart, i went off all the mozart horn concertos when i was about 14 as everyone in my county youth orchestra played them as my warm up and they do sound pretty much the same if you hear them all played badly enough times! i am now working on the whole of no. 3 as my "punishment" to myself for not doing myself justice in the guildhall audition.

i was just so tired after no proper sleep since the saturday beofre and i was stressed from all the work i'd missed at school. oh, i dunno, after experiencing the tube with my horn i dont think london is for me anyway.

i cant belive i played alla caccia so slow, i hadnt practiced it that slow before, but it had been so long since i'd played it with the piano i couldnt quite remember the performance tempo, as i usually practice pieces under tempo to ensure everyones working well etc.

oh well, i've still got a place at the birmingham conservatoire. they were really nice to me there and its less hassle to get to. i hope you have got in to guidhall, you were clearly the best out of our workshop.

hornplayer xxx

ps, could you understand what hugh seenan was saying? in my audition i couldnt make out what he said, so when he aked me if i was ready to begin i just kind of looked at him a bit funny while i tried to work out what he'd said! oops.

you're right, I'm so glad we dont have to practice the bagatelle anymore!

QUOTE (hornplayer @ Dec 14 2004, 08:04 PM)

Oh I thought that was you! but when I looked back at your earlier posts you said you were going to play Reverie, which confused me a bit. If it's any consolation, you were MUCH better than the girl who played Reverie. It sounds like your journey there was pretty stressful- I know exactly what that feels like! I arrived in such a state and then they told me Hugh Seenan was going to be late and it would be 40 minutes before I'd have to do my audition, so I wrecked my lips in the bagatelle rehearsal with the pianist and then they came in and said that a substitute for Hugh had been found and I had to go down right away! aaaaah! I also learnt an extra piece cos I didn't read the requirements properly- I thought we had to do 2 of the Oscar Franz Studies, and the extra one was sooooooo much harder than the one we actually had to learn, so I had to explain that to them as well, making myself look like a complete bimbo! The Barbican tube station is really confusing isn't it? Apparently Moorgate is the closest one to the actual barbican.

I think you were right to have played Alla Caccia, at least they listened to you with fresh ears, and it's always good to stand out. Don't punish yourself with the Mozart- it;s not worth it! I only played the Mozart because I was speaking to Michael Thompson in the summer and he told me to play a Mozart for my Royal Academy audition, so doing it for Guildhall just saved me learning another piece. As for your tempo, it was a little slow to begin with, but when he told you to speed it up you played it really well. It really demonstrated your teachability, which is what they were looking for I think. Bissill just waffled something at me about breathing, which i took to mean I was breathing too much and not playing loud enough, but I didn't think I rectified it when I played again. i also felt I had so much less time and some of the others. I don't think you should beat yourself up about your choice of piece or the way you played it, because I think both things were excellent. I don't know how they could have chosen people from that workshop. I suppose the first audition must have counted for most of it.

I could understand Hugh Seenan ok- coming from where I do, I'm used to weird and wonderful accents! I was more worried about them being able to understand me! However, I don't think either of us were in as bad a position as that poor spanish boy!

Congratulations on getting into Birmingham! I hope your Oxford interviews went well- I didn't know you had applied there. What college was it? I found out on Monday that I got into Guildhall, though I really don't understand why. I certainly wasn't the best in the workshop- I think they loved that poncy guy who played the horn like a ballerina the most! I hope he isn't in though- I don't think I could bear spending 4 years with him!

hgirl
xxx

congraluations! I take it you're going to Guildhall then? what about Cambridge, how did it go? and a scholarship to the royal academy?

ah, thanks your comments! i think they already knew who they really wanted before the workshop, my bagatelle wasnt great and my study i kept moving too much for some reason, perhaps to stop me shaking, or falling asleep!

you could kinda tell they were running out of ideas on how to improve the Mozart's after about the third guy!

I think the reason you didnt get as much time is that they were worried they would run out, also you played it perfectly so they wasnt anything richard could have improved on. I thought I would have liked Richard Bissil more than Hugh, but richard seemed to think anyone who hadnt learnt lip trills was lazy and that movement + music = bad player. perhaps that's a bit harsh, but hugh seemed to realise that we're still learning technique etc.

I wonder how the italian guy interpreted the bagatelle, he was clearly very musically, but it didnt sound like he was into contemporary music.

The dancing guy was so good tho! the movement was a bit too more, and one of the other guys dancing was worse! were you the only girl who got an interview?

I applied to Jesus College Oxford, the welsh college, which was nice cos there wernet as many stereotypical public school people there. the oxford interviews are different to the cambridge in that you stay in college overnight, which i think helps you know what the atmosphere of the place is like.

hornplayer xx

I think I will go to Guildhall, even if Cambridge offers me a place. I had to stay overnight in Cambridge cos my 1st interview was at 9.30am, and it was really nice, but I think I just love music too much! I had 2 interviews and one was good and the other bad, so I don't know what to think. I don't really care either, though I suppose it would be nice to be able to say I got an offer!

I definitely liked Hugh more than Richard. I think Hugh was right- a little movement is good, as long as it doesn't stop you from playing well. That guy that danced around a lot was amazing though. I'm sure he has got in, and they took 2 boys from the afternoon session, so I'm the only girl. They interviewed 9 people out of 18 though, and they've made some reserve offers I think. I'm still in shock about the whole thing. I know some of the horn players there, and they're just so amazing. I'm going to have to work so hard between now and next September!

What's your first choice then, Birmingham or Oxford? I know someone doing Music at Oxford and she seems to love it. You find out next week don't you? Good luck!!!!

hgirl
xxx

I've been offered AAB by Oxford at Jesus College, so I think I'll take it!

I just fell in love with the place when I was staying there, and I didnt like the atmosphere in Birmingham at night with my horn whereas Oxford was "magical" with all the christmas lights and trees and the mist.

I got a bit depressed after Guildhall, thought about all the work I'd put in and all the rejection I'd got back (NYO, Guildhall, Joint course at Manchester, got rejected from my county first youth orchestra first time round!) but I feel alot better now. It felt a bit weird that Guidlhall literally judged me on my playing and nothing on my personality or brain or commitment.

Oh well, I'm really happy now after Oxford and everything, plus I start a 6 day orchestra course, the first one I will have done with my county first youth orchestra (they are a bit mean cos people from the area and are 18-21 at music college etc. are still aloowed to stay in!). We're playing Mahler Five tho, and they've sent me the first part, probably bumper horn rather than principal I think, but with the symphony I'll probably still play all the good bits anyway!!!

You will have to do loads of work for Guildhall, but then you won't have the pressure of A level exams to think about, in fact, you could just walk in, put your name on the answer paper, not write anything and still get into Guidhall!

hornplayer xx

Hornplayer!
Congratulations on the Oxford offer! That's amazing- you'll have a wonderful time! I just found out I got an AAB offer from Cambridge so I'm in a bit of a mess trying to decide where to go!
I'm so glad you're feeling a bit happier- last term was such hard work for everyone, hopefully this one will be a little better!

hgirl
xxx

congrats on your offers hgirl and hornplayer!

thanks clarinetlover!

which college at cambridge? you've got a tough decision now, one of the top unis (am i right in saying you were being interviewed for english?) or the best music college for horn.

i think i might see if I can have Birmingham Conservatoire as my insurance offer, because I really liked it there and everyone was so kind to me, plus all the offers I have atm are AAB or ABB (royal holloway - i'm NOT going anywhere near london!).

How was the nyo btw? did you get on ok with jim beck?

oh and I've turned full circle on my opinions of the Mozart horn concertos, my music service want me to do no.3 for the end of year concert in june!!!!!!!!! with a proper (student) orchestra and everyone! now all I need is a stunning dress for the performance!

hornplayer xxx

wear that nice black one you had for ESO! (or maybe you should save that for when Bubblefish goes to Broadway)

Oh it's Clare College for English. I don't know what to do!!!! Advise me people!
I had a great time on NYO, though it was a very intense atmosphere and there were lots of very young people who were all at specialist music schools- it made me realise how deprived my area is in terms of providing music education! It was also very strict compared to the other courses I've been on, but despite that I really enjoyed it. The standard was amazing and Jim Beck was a sweetie to me because we're from the same place.
Having a music college for an insurance seems like a brilliant idea- i'll look into that!
Well done on the Mozart Concert by the way! I'm glad your opinion has changed, you gotta love the old Mozarts of you're a horn player! I think I'm doing Mozart 4 this year with an orchestra- hopefully anyway!

hgirl
xxxx

QUOTE (hgirl @ Jan 11 2005, 09:04 PM)

Oh it's Clare College for English. I don't know what to do!!!! Advise me people!

have u applied to do music or english or am i getting completly confuddled?!

if so do MUSIC!

Natpat

xx

QUOTE (clarinetlover @ Jan 12 2005, 10:07 PM)

have u applied to do music or english or am i getting completly confuddled?! if so do MUSIC! Natpat xx

I have an offer from Cambridge to do English, but I also got into some music colleges to play the horn, including a scholarship to the Royal Academy, so I don't know what to do!

defintiely something music related. hmmmm....royal academy i think

but guildhall is like horn heaven, once you get in there you're made for life! although to get in you have to be pretty amazing anyway..................

QUOTE

wear that nice black one you had for ESO! (or maybe you should save that for when Bubblefish goes to Broadway)

lol cheeble, i would wear it but;
1) everyone at music centre already seen me in that a hundred times cos its been my conert dress for donkeys years

2) i wanna get a big pretty coloured ball dress thingy (copyright clarinetlover) as then i'll stand out from the sea of black and white of the orchestra. plus getting a new dress is always fun! i was thinknig of a red satin number...........or gold................
*drifts off into a girlie dream of self in a pretty gold dress*

hgirl, if you really want to do english then go to cambridge, cos then you can still be in the nyo next year, (and most of the nyo go to clare college anyway!) and you've already got your DipABRSM so you're technically first year music college standard anyway. also, you clearly love playing horn so its not like you wont make an effort to go play horn at uni. plus its CAMBRIDGE, (and cheeble might kill you if you don't go!)

then again, i might kill you if you don;t take the place at royal academy (a scholarship to music college donesnt come on a plate you know!)

btw, the nyo do a one day course for the ppl who didnt get in but got to the final round (like the retard that i am) on the 2nd april, so the lovely jim beck will be seeing me. is in when your next course is? or just before? i rubbed the dates out of my diary as i didnt get in so i wont be needing them..........

hornplayer xxx

do most of nyo go to Clare college? that's brilliant!
I think I'm going to accept the offer from Cambridge because I can always do a postgrad at music college if I still want to, and as I play a brass instrument I can only physically do about 3 hours practice a day (at the most!) which I can still do at Cambridge while doing English.
I think I'm going to have Guildhall as my insurance, though I feel awful about turning down a scholarship from RAM.
Oh are you coming on the 2nd of April? The course is on then, so I'll probably get to see you!! I had a great time on the christmas course, everyone is really lovely and friendly, it'll be lots of fun!
hope school's not too awful this term!
hgirl
xxx

QUOTE (hgirl @ Jan 18 2005, 04:50 PM)

do most of nyo go to Clare college? that's brilliant!

In my day (50 years ago), quite a lot of them seemed to go to Downing (founded 1800). Clare is the second oldest (1326), had a good reputation for music in 1954, and I believe still has.

QUOTE

I think I'm going to accept the offer from Cambridge because I can always do a postgrad at music college if I still want to, and as I play a brass instrument I can only physically do about 3 hours practice a day (at the most!) which I can still do at Cambridge while doing English. I think I'm going to have Guildhall as my insurance, though I feel awful about turning down a scholarship from RAM.[...]

I think you have made the right choice. As you say, you can keep your practice going and study music formally later, if you want to. If you go to the Guildhall, which course will you follow? They had a degree course a long time ago, and presumably still have, so you might look at that.

QUOTE (hgirl @ Jan 18 2005, 04:50 PM)

I think I'm going to accept the offer from Cambridge

YAAY!

See ya there!

calm down cheeble calm down!!

*bounce bounce bounce bounce bounce*

calm?? me???

QUOTE (cheeble @ Jan 19 2005, 04:22 PM)

*bounce bounce bounce bounce bounce* calm?? me???

yes cheeblina CALM!!!