A teacher I work along side had two of her best pupils take their Grade 5 singing recently and she was disappointed that they only achieved a merit. She then said that they mark harder for Grade 5. I personally don't agree with this and I wondered what others thought.

The marking criteria for grades 1 to 5 is exactly the same. It is different for 6-8.

There could be any number of reasons why pupils get different marks at different grades. My grade marks for all my exams ranged from 109 to 138. Sometimes pupils have off days, sometimes preparation not as good etc.

A merit is still very good though; presumably if they'd only passed.......... The marking is no harder for Grade 5 than it is for 1-4.

I feel a here we go again coming on.....For goodness sake they got a merit tell who ever it is to stop dumbing it down!!

i agree.... at the end of the day, marks isn't everything... a merit is good...

I'm only a parent but having been in a similar situation I don't think this is helpful. If a student works hard and everything goes as well as expected in the exam and the teacher thinks they were distinction standard then questions will be asked.

At the time it happened to daughter it was very confusing. As everyone got lower than expected marks in the special visit it was identified as a harsh examiner. Looking back I expect other things came into play too. Firstly I think sometimes teachers don't quite streach students enough in the sense of asking for more. I don't think it's deliberate or in any way intentional and sometimes potential will be recognised that doesn't transfer itself into skill. I'm not implying bad preperation. Hope this makes sense?

At the time of Grade 5 Oboe I asked similar questions to the OP's friend, so did her teacher. When daughter got a similar mark for Grade 5 Sax we were very happy, it was a bonus. The merit was never an issue but the length of time she had been playing the pieces, in comparism, and all the hard work that had gone into them was. In the end I think we all learnt something from the whole thing parent, child and teacher.

That's quite true and I hadn't really looked at this situation from that viewpoint.

I will go a bit further than the others and say that when it comes to music exams, although it IS nice to see a merit or distinction, I don't really care, as long as my kids pass.

These exams are totally different from others. You can't spend time at the end checking answers, correcting mistakes, rubbing out, re-reading, underlining... etc.

Things can and do go wrong. A nervous child who makes a small mistake can then lose confidence and make more. Some kids have off days, some examiners too.



I think it's been said in the forum and certainly by my son's piano teacher that spending too much time on a piece can be counter productive. The pupil is bored and just wants to get it over with, so it will not have the 'freshness' that it should.

Steve

Oh good. I'm not the only one who feels like this. I also think that merits are very good achievements and exam marks are not the be all and end all of music education. I did look at her sheets further and both girls failed their sight singing and aural but did well in their songs so I feel she may have let them down in her preparation. I have had a discussion about sight singing with her and she doesn't feel that it is important. We don't agree on many things

Surely the marking does get gradually harder between G1 and G5. I know the music is more difficult but I can't imagine an examiner marking an out of tune note, or a hic-up in rhythm as harshly in G1 as they would in G5.

For me thou there is a psychological difference between Grades 1 to 4 and G5 - I know there's a long way to go after 5, but somehow (for me) G5 is where you start to become a real musician.

With regard to a merit being good - of course it is! - If everyone waited 6 extra months before taking their exams then the number of distinctions would surely go up? So in a way the difference between a scrape pass mark and a distinction may be in part down to how quickly people rushed into taking the exam. I say this as I'm thinking of doing G5 next term and think I would pass, but I know if I waited an extra term I would pass more easily as my playing would have improved by then.

Percentage wise I get fewer distinctions than I did ten years ago. I actually think that's a good thing as I felt some of the distinctions were given rather easily. I suspect the Board may have tightened up a bit because whereas formerly some children I didn't really consider to be distinction material were given distinction marks, recently it has only been the really charismatic ones who have achieved a distinction.

Broadly speaking I look at it like this: an average child who has worked well and been well prepared will get a pass.

A talented child who has worked well, shows some feeling for music and has been well prepared will get a merit.

A gifted child who works hard and has a been well prepared will probably get a distinction.

Every one of these achivements deserves praise and never blame. You can try putting the bar higher next time round but when the results come I think you have to react positively.

Having said what I think broadly, you then have to take into account off days, nerves, the particular point in a term or a school year when the exam is done, the element of chance in sight reading and aural tests and all the other things that can go spectacularly right or wrong on the day.

Examiners don't mark potential. I daresay many of them recognize potential even in a flawed performance - but they can't actually give marks for it. They can only mark what they hear.

'Streatching' students isn't easy sometimes for pupil or teacher. pupil thinks they played reasonably well and got some praise for it, but the next thing the teacher says is 'now do this...' or the teacher doesn't comment on the part pupil thought went badly but looks at other parts which takes them by surprize. I always have it (especially the second one), and I don't dislike it, it's just sometimes depressing realizing that a piece is never going to be 'perfect', just 'good enough for ...'. I don't know, but I think the teacher wants the pupil to enjoy playing and think asking for more might make them feel like a bad player and that they'll never be good at playing?



I think that yes, if it goes well and you are confident that you didn't mess anything up too badly, you can expect a good mark. I think it totaly depends on the examiner you have. If the examiner is looking for a technically perfect performance but musicality isn't the most important thing to them, playing musicaly but with a few minor slips can get worse marks than expected. Of course, it can happen the other way round. I want a distinction and aim for it, but I NEVER expect it.








Definatly. Idealy, if you think the piece is ready for the exam that's a long way off, don't play it too much untill a few days before.



Actualy, thinking about this, there are always a bit to work on in any piece I think. Well, as long as you're confident it's good enough for the exam, it's best not to overplay the pieces. Work on some other pieces.

I'm not sure this was totally the issue in this case but I fully accept what you are saying. I do think it was largely a case of harsh examiner/having a bad day. She did play other pieces not just the exam ones. The timescale extended because of lack of lessons over the summer holiday and a delay in the exam due to other pressures on the teacher. One of the reasons why Grade 6 was done in a rush, the merit was worth more than any distiction as the whole exam happened with about 6 weeks prep (scales and aural got her in the end). We also maintained lessons as far as possible over the summer this year.




I don't think waiting six months to take the exam will always go in someones favour. It's not all about talent either but preparation. I think the hardes thing for teachers is picking up on those that can do more without pressure and with correct guidance. It can't be easy having students with widely differing capabilities which must happen in every teaching practice.

Daughter has taken several grade 5's and I think you're right that there is a subtle difference in the way they are viewed and this effects the examining.

Changing Piano teachers in January this year has really made us aware of the difference between teachers and teachers. Not that I have a problem with any of daughter's current teachers. It's about expectations, not sure how to explain.

Recently Emsoboe did a flute Masterclass at RNCM. For ages she's been aware of issues/lack of progress on Flute. She didn't know what the problem was but knew there was something, her teacher hadn't said anything. She was beginning to think about giving up. The masterclass was very enlightening as she found out why she hadn't progressed. It was something with not a lot of effort could be put right and revolved around not taking enough breath. There were also lots of good aspects to her playing but it was a big gamble for her to play in the class in the first place.



This is something that tends to be forgotten, that there's always work ot do on pieces.

The Grade 5 Oboe disappointment didn't reapeat itself this year hence the rush to grade 6, which was never about the exam but getting some of the damage undone, and changing the relationship with her teacher has in a way improved her playing.

I hope that the teacher in question realises how important all aspects of the exam are and expecting students with elements poorly covered is bound to lead to disappointment.

I don't think it's up to examiners to recognise potential and mark on it but it is the job of teachers to harness and support it.

The only problem with waiting 6 extra months is that pieces can really "go off" as a pupil can get jaded and as someone else has said, the pieces lose their sparkle and freshness. Younger pupils can also tend to get faster and faster and start to play more by memory (as they'll have had the pieces for so long) and then mistakes creep in, and detail is lost etc etc. Timing is really difficult to judge for a teacher, and as someone else has alos said, anything can happen on the day, no matter how well prepared.

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The marking criteria for grades 1 to 5 is exactly the same. It is different for 6-8.

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Just curious - where does the idea come from that G6 upwards is different? May well be true, but I'd welcome a PM giving me a source for this opinion ... just seems to me that there should be a sorta smooth progression through the grades.

nick

http://www.abrsm.org/resources/theseMusicExams0607.pdf see page 39.

Ah yes, I remember this now - thank you.

nick