I've been falling increasingly in love with violas for quite a while, and at orchestra the other day played my friend's viola It sounds so gorgeous
I really want one of my own... not to take it up seriously but to play for fun at home and stuff. I'm slightly aprehensive about this as that's exactly what i said when i took up violin, and look what happened, it took over my entire life I don't want to end up falling in love with another instrument and abandoning my dear violin - but i won't let that happen I love my violin faaaar too much!
Anyway back to the subject
as it's only for "fun" - no exams or anything, i only want a really really cheap one. but obviously the best really cheap one i can find!
I saw the usual stentor ones, but found this for round about the same price as the stentors http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/A-Complete-Advanced-...A1%7C240%3A1318
It certainly looks nicer than a stentor 1 but whether or not it's actually any good is another question. Do you viola people think it is?

Also how would i know which size to get? I'm very small (5ft2ish) but i wouldnt say my hands/arms are particuarly small. My friend's viola seemed very large but felt entirely comfortable to play, no stretching or anything. I'm not sure which size she has though and probably won't see her for a few months now...

Sorry for the long post!

It's probably best to go to a shop and try them. A full size violin is 14" and violas are generally 15" and above, but its the string lenght thats important not the number of inches. (have you had a look at echelons thread? there's some interesting stuff about sizes in that)

x

Thanks i'll check out those threads.
Is there any way of measuring? (im guessing thats what the thread has right? )
I think i'd be quite embarassed going to a shop and being like 'im a violinist but i want a viola cause i feel like it do you have any that cost about £70'

I do advise you, as you are a good violinist, to try out cheapo violas before buying one (even if you decide to buy a different one). I have this expensive habit of really appreciating quality, even in instruments I play really badly...

I think that looks like a really good deal and I'm tempted myself (although I'd have to hide it from my husband )

But I don't know anything about violas. I know Yitamusic T20 violins are supposed to be good for the money...?

I'd suggest 15 inches - and yes it looks like a good deal. I don't imagine you will be happy with it for very long though, and changing the strings will cost you nearly as much as the viola outfit!

Liz

That's exactly what i'm worried about! I looked at a set of dominants and they were like £50 compared to the £25 violin equivelant.


And Lottie... i will if you will!


Also... could anyone suggest me some good viola songs for listening i'm looking on youtube but don't know what to look for... i'm thinking Elisabeth is going to be good for this! i'm waiting to see her reaction to me and Lottie wanting to come to the viola side!

ffliwt my favourite pieces would have to be the Telemann viola conc (in G possibly) and Glazunov's elegy.
x

I certainly second the Glazunov Elegy and Telemann concerto. You'll not want to miss Bruch's Romanze and the Brahms sonatas either. Oh, I could go on for a while on good viola music.

On the subject of instruments though, I wouldn't consider anything too cheapo if I were you. You won't find it satisfying and, frankly, a set of dominants on a very basic instrument reminds me of the Biblical illustration of a nose ring in a pig!! (Talking about how useful beauty is(n't) in a senseless woman, if you don't recognise that one! )

As for falling in love with another instrument, what's wrong with that? You're quite young and still really developing your tastes, interests and directions. There's nothing wrong with experimenting a bit. Actually, many violists started out as violinists, including my teacher, but EXcluding me!! I was interested in cello first and have never had a bend towards violin. If you like it and find later that you want to take it further, don't fight it, just enjoy it and go with what feels right. I wouldn't give that advice in many situations in life, but when it comes to learning music, it's the only way to find your playing satisfying.

Keep us posted, honey!

I second Glazunov and the Brahms sonatas. Also the Brahms songs for alto, viola and piano.
There is a lovely CD by Kim Kashkashian called Elegies, which amongst other stuff contains the Glazunov and Britten's Lachrymae (based on a Dowland song and possibly my favourite viola piece).
Then there are:
Vaughan Williams Suite for viola and orchestra
Walton concerto
Shostakovich sonata (which rivals the Britten for "best" IMO)

In ensembles have a listen to:
Mozart, duos for violin and viola, kegelstatt trio and sinfonia concertante for violin and viola.
String quartets - any or all, but particularly Britten and Dvorak for maximum violaness - and quintets too, providing they are the type which contain 2 violas not 2 cellos
Oh and the Bridge 3 idylls for string quartet (which Britten used as germ for his "Variations on a theme of Frank Bridge").
You see Britten keeps cropping up?

Oh blimey, I nearly forgot, Bach Brandenburg Concerti 3 (3 violas) and 6 (2 violas)

If I played viola (I did try once, but found that the joints of my left arm were too stiff to wrap round it ) I would be pestering all my string quartet playing friends to play Mozart quintets in G minor, C major and C minor.

I don't get it: The G minor, C major and C minor quintets are all great, but two of the very few pieces of music I find even greater are the D major (K. 593) and E flat major (K. 614) quintets. Why does nobody ever talk about those, while everyone raves about the C major (K. 515) and G minor (K. 516)?

Hey ffliwt!!!!

I bought one!!!!! So it's your turn now

Well I was never going to afford to buy a more expensive one and my teacher may buy it off me for beginners if I go off it but we reckoned it was too good a price to miss.

I can't believe I've bought a VIOLA!!!!

Only, being a dumb greying-haired-ex-brunnette I forgot to tell them which size I needed I've sent them an email so I hope they can get it right.

WOW Okay. What your favourite BEGINNERS VIOLA book

What kind have you bought?

I've bought one of these http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/A-Complete-Advanced-...A1%7C240%3A1318

..the one that ffliwt was looking at

Well, it's only the cost of a haircut and I've just had a new commission come in so I should be able to stretch to new strings/bridge too. It's just for fun and I'm sure I'll find it a new home around here if I don't take to it (although I do like the sound of violas )

Oh oh oh.... just been listening to Telemann Viola concerto in G on YouTube


p.s. do I need a shoulder-rest?

p.p.s I MUST get off the computer and start the commission or I won't be playing anything.... and yes, my dear husband thinks I'm quite mad!

Do you play violin with a shoulder rest? If so I'd say probably

You won't necessarily need one on viola just because you use one on violin - the viola has deeper ribs, making the use of a shoulder rest more unlikely, rather than more likely.

Lottie - put it on your collar bone and hold it up - if the space between your chin and the chinrest is tiny or non-existant, then no - you don't need a shoulder rest. It will feel a little unstable at first, but you'll soon get used to it. Fixing the viola in position is very bad idea unless it's totally necessary (I don't know if you remember that study I posted a while ago, a fair few violists and violinists were tested and needed changes to their set ups - a fair few of them ended up without shoulder rests).

Best bet is probably ask your teacher!

I did have a long post here about whether i wasnt sure to get it or not etc.etc.
But i deleted it all
Cause i just bought it! Wheee

And YAY for you getting one Lottie!
We're all turning into a bunch of viola fanatics on this forum

What size did you get?
I got a 15.5, as i played a 16 inch one before that was fine, but i was keeping in mind that i'm only 5 foot 2 and i only played the 16 inch one for a few minutes

HURRAH! Well done. You'll LOVE it so much.

Allan

Blimey! You'd pay that much for a haircut??

Delighted to see this mass conversion to viola

Congratulations on the new viola purchases! It is a fabulous instrument.

I'm the opposite - I use one on viola but not on violin. The viola seems to rest against my collarbone more than the violin, and it's not comfortable to go without anything. I need to find/make some kind of small pad instead, because my neck isn't long enough to really need a rest.

I use a different type of chinrest on viola to violin too - a centre-mounted one rather than a side-mounted one.

Ooooh isn't this exciting.

They've sent me an email saying it has been shipped and will take 5-6 days to reach the UK. I think it's going to be really interesting to see how we get on... we'll have to pick names when they arrive

I went for a 15" one because my hands are not big and sometimes using my fourth on the violin is still a stretch.

Now how long will it take me to learn the Telemann....?



Well the last time I went to the hairdresser I asked for a trim and something to cover the grey stuff. They put my hair into hundreds of little bits of tinfoil with dye on them, sat me there for two hours (the smell nearly killed me ), trimmed half an inch off my fringe and then charged me £59 for the privilege. When I got to my car to look in the mirror my hair was full of orange stripes So, did I go back and complain? No, I sat in floods of tears and vowed never to go to hairdresser again as long as I live. And now I just wear a hat a lot. And I still look like I'm wearing a pantomime wig but I can't afford to do anything about it.

Well I might have... but I just bought a VIOLA instead... far more worthy

congrats!
What kind did you get? i think I missed that!

that was the first piece i learnt on viola, so not long probably.

We certainly will have to pick names when they arrive
Any ideas anyone?

I need to get some good viola music now I hope it doesn't take too long to get the hang of alto clef. I'm used to transposing a note down cause of clarinet stuff... but now i think about it that's not that relevant as it'd be a different octave and also it's best not to think of it as transposition

What strings could i get for it? For my first choice i may go for a set of dominants just to start with - when i can afford £50 for them that is! I would have been shocked if they were even £40 let alone £50! But before i can even think of viola strings i need a new set of evah pirazzi's for my violin... which is a further £50. whyyy soo expensiiveee

That's what I was thinking. I love Obligato strings but a viola set is £68!!!

But I do collect 2p s in a jamjar...

As for names... my first violin, a chunky usophistocated chap, was called Jim

But I am strangely drawn to call my very first viola... Agapanthus.

Oooh, Telemann viola concerto! My all-time favourite, and I haven't played it for ages!

* (Dashes off to dig out Telemann music) *

Well Agapanthus didn't arrive today and Parcelforce don't deliver on weekends... so perhaps Monday my little friend will appear at the door

Do you think he will arrive with his bridge and soundpost down

He'll probably arrive Monday yes meaning mine (nameless so far...) will probably arrive on Tuesday? How exciting

I doubt it'd have the bridge and soundpost down =/

Slightly off topic here but...given the price of one decent viola string...
If you do collect coins in a jam jar try collecting a larger coin. I collect £2 coins and it reaches £50 very quickly I always buy something for myself - new shoes, handbag or whatever. That 2p coin stuff is too demoralising all that weight and it only adds up to a couple of quid!

It's almost certain, if they're from Yita, that the bridge will be down. The sound post may or may not be in place, but you'll likely want it changed anyway. You'll definitely need a new bridge, the pegs fitting properly, the fingerboard fixing up, new strings, a decent bow and a case (the ones provided are as naff as you can get) - but you'll be truly surprised at the quality of the instrument itself - they're VERY good.

Oh no that'll cost a fortune!
I can put the bridge up myself but obviously it won't be in the exact right place or anything.
+ i was prepared for the cost of strings
but the rest of it =/

i can barely afford all my violin stuff (im only 17) and i'm not going to compromise any violin stuff in order to get viola stuff I just had to pay £80 for a violin repair, and am about to pay £50 for new strings, also need some new rosin, need i go on let alone thinking about violalalala
so i may be slightly screwed...

It's not quite as bad as all that! rosfrog is right - there are things you may wish to change to get the best out of a Yita instrument - but you won't need to change everything at once!

The bridge will be down for transport purposes - it comes padded underneath and tightened flat against the (in my case) violin by the strings in order to keep the sound-post in place. There will be notches on the f holes to show where the bridge's feet should be aligned. I didn't have any problems getting the bridge straight - just loosened the strings gradually and raised the bridge gently into position.

The bow and strings will need changing - but you should be able to get a 'reasonable' sound using both if you can't stretch to changing these just yet.

The case is also perfectly usable but won't stand up to having things piled on top of it! If you have somewhere safe to store the viola at school (my daughter takes her Yita violin straight into the music room when she arrives in the morning) then it should be fine.

I don't know whether others would agree but I'd go for changing strings, bow, set-up, case - in that order.

Have fun! I'm almost tempted to buy a viola myself........

mmm I can put the bridge up too and My Dad can shift a soundpost (he has made a few violins) so we'll muddle through... but the strings and bow etc will take time. And a new case! Don't panic ffliwt, we can rumage down the back of the sofas for lost £1 coins? Oh, and if you're stuck for rosin I have some spare - just PM me if you'd like it

Dear Agapanthus should arrive tomorrow... I can't wait

(p.s. thanks everyone for all the advice)

Yes, don't panic ! You don't have to do it all at once !

If you have to choose, I'd go : Strings, bridge, pegs, soundpost, bow, case.

Do it a bit at a time!

That sounds better hehe

I wonder if my viola will arrive tomorrow too... i know i ordered mine a day after you Lottie but we've had the weekend too, if you get what i mean

I think i'm going to call it Vince, but i do i have a feeling that it's going to be a girl. If so, i may call it Angelica.



I think i'm going to order some strings.
I was saving this £50 for some violin evah pirazzis, but my teacher won't let me change them until my current strings are dead, which may be another 2 months So i mayaswell use it to get some viola strings.
What ones do you reccommend?
What do you use elisabeth?

I used to have D'addario Zyex for violin, i liked them (i prefer what i have now but they were nice) but my teacher hated them! They're the cheapest decent viola strings i've found so far too... what do you think?

I have found a set of Dominant Viola strings for £48 http://www.stringmail.co.uk/viola.htm

That seems a good price.. but I guess I'll wait until my teacher has a look at 'Agapanthus' ( ) so she can advise on the best one to suit. Oh and bridges are not too expensive.. around �9 which is manageable.

And this looks good for a bow? http://www.thestringzone.co.uk/categories/...fibre-viola-bow

But I have only around £50 too and that will mean cutting back on my beloved cappuccinos

I wouldn't worry about changing the set up or buying new bows etc until you've got and tried out your violas. You may find that they're perfectly acceptable for the time being, so I should wait and see.

My strings are the ones that came on my viola, so they'll be Stentor ones. I have a Conservatoire and my teacher reckons the strings etc are just right for the instrument. She said that they're often matched up well by the people who make them, all the more reason to really wait and see what you get when your violas come than start planning loads of upgrades now.

Looking forward to hearing how you both get on. As I mentioned a few days ago, I do like this mass viola-isation that's going on here!!

I dunno about asking my teacher for strings advice
I haven't told her i've got a viola yet
I daren't tell her ever

My strings are Dominants (I think)

I just did strings (Dominants) and bow straight away.
I've just found this post after writing about my Yita viola on the yita viola thread - SORRY MODS - please don't do me for cross-posting.

Good luck with the violas, welcome to the Dark Side!!

Agapanthus still hasn't arrived.. unless there will be a parcel delivery later.

The suspense is killing me!

Edited to say: I've just checked the tracking information and it's not due to arrive here until Wednesday.. but at least it's in the UK now.. somewhere around Coventry? (It arrived in Coventry on Friday - it shouldn't really take until Wednesday to travel the last few hundred miles ) Oh well

OH, poor Lottie ! The suspense must be awful!

Elisabeth_rb - these are direct from the factory instruments, not set up in anyway really, apart from a bridge that fits the instrument - it's highly unlikely that they'll be ok as is.

You may well be right Alan, but there's never any harm in waiting and seeing first.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/A-Complete-Advanced-...A1%7C240%3A1318

I've just had another look at the add - is it my imagination or is the purfling painted on ?

George the viola has just arrived. I'm about to unpack him

I wonder why yours hasn't arrived yet Lottie, as i ordered mine after you?

*hopes that yours arrived today also*

yay Hope you have lots of fun together

You waited to post here before unpacking him???

I am already very disappointed to find out that George doesn't have that lovely looking rosewood or whatever it was tailpiece and chinrest But horrible black plastic things

Ok so what did i expect for £65


Edit: ...ok it's not so bad. Whilst i was setting it up and stuff i was thinking oh dear what have i bought this for The bridge definately needs doing, it has no grooves in it so i had to kinda guess, and it's ridiculously high. I've managed to get the A string tuned and stuff and it doesn't sound too bad atal. I've yet to even get the D string on there - the peg has a hole in one side, but no hole for it to come out of... as if it wasn't already the hardest string to put on, this is going to make it a whole lot more challenging!
Oh and i don't need a shoulder rest either! I was surprised, as it's totally impossible for me to play violin without one, so thought i'd need one on viola too but it's fine so far


Edit number a million... it is physically impossible to tune it...

I live in the middle of nowhere in the Scottish hills so everything always takes an extra day to arrive here. Agapanthus is due to arrive tommorrow.

If it doesn't have the fittings as in the advert it's worth a complaint to them and to ebay? It all sounds a bit worrying!