I don't think her learning the piano is tying herself down. However if she's set her heart on a career in music at 16, then I'd let her ride with it. I felt tied down by relatives who wanted me to "get a proper job". Loads of short contracts in clerical and admin later and I was in a position to follow my dream (although I had managed to pursuade them that I should read music at uni).

I'm much happier now, even though finding work, and the business side is not for the feint hearted.

I really don't mind if she chooses Music or another career but it would be silly not to recognise for certain courses in music Piano is essential. Having good Piano skills won't stop her from doing something other than music but not having them could prevent her rom getting the course she might want if it's still her desire.

Emsoboe is lucky as she's got strong maths and science skills and if she needs support in either of these areas later she will get it. My eldest had to have science tuition because the teacher was going to run out of time to finish the course. At least if most of her music qualifications are in the bag there will be time to follow up on other things.

What a sane mother! Pity there are not more of you about!

Thank you!! sometimes I really doubt that I am sane. It would be much easier to ignore it all Not to mention cheaper

I go through that all the time with my two, but in the end I think its worth it.

With all the angst of having a talented child, and trying to find the best path for them, I thank my lucky starts that the other two are "normal -" at least, so far they seem to be!

Burl

Meeting with the Deputy and Music Teacher this afternoon. Why are my knees shaking?

At least this time I'm taking a friend, who has a musical child in a different school.

Hope it goes well.

Had been wondering how things were going - nearly resurrected this thread yesterday to ask, but then decided not to in case I put my foot in it.

Good Luck! Maybe it's the music teacher who should be feeling anxious, not you!

Thanks

For one week only the Teacher made an attempt to teach. She's very unhappy that daughter won't go to the after school classes anymore. I think it's to do with getting told off for doing the Appraisals and Briefs without asking the teacher's advice. I must be missing something as I thought it was their duty to give advice not to be chased for it.

Thanks to Barry, Katyjay and Andante the Recorder quartet has been recorded. Petrat very kindly allowed this to happen at the Anglesey event. We are very grateful.

Tomorrow is the big day for the performances, teacher doesn't have a clue what she is playing, hasn't even asked to see them. We are hoping that the Sax Quartet can be recorded on Wednesday of next week.

I think we'll both feel much less stressed once this is done.

I managed to get a tutor by searching the internet and he's fab. Young, to my knowledge no PGCE but he can definately teach. He's put so much effort in to tracking down music and discussing things with her. I'm so impressed!! Wish I'd thought of it sooner. I should add he's a research student and conservertoire graduate.

If I'm not satisfied today I'll be taking it further, this is the long promised meeting after my last visit into school.

Good luck- hope it goes well.....

Very best of luck from us too, hope they give you what you need.

Burl + Joel

Not a chance!!!

The music teacher is just wonderful!!!

My friend was shocked at her lack of eye contact and general behaviour during the meeting. She told the Deputy that she found the teacher intimidating and agressive.

Daughter won't go to the after school classes again and I left the Deputy under no illusions that the woman is not doing her job. Whether he can accept it or not is another thing. Teacher left meeting returned to class and totally blanked child.

at teacher...



Not a problem. It's a lovely composition



I agree, I think you'll both feel a lot better. Do wish emsoboe all the best with the performances.





I don't blame her not going to the after school classes again - that is frankly quite shocking on the teacher's part, in so many ways. *boils gently in front of computer screen*

Well the woman surpassed herself again today!!

Took emsoboe for her GCSE performance recordings, the teacher looked at a video of her on a recent concert and proclaimed the piece "depressing".

She made her Sax teacher feel uncomfortable, so much so that he made a couple of errors in the piece. He was very sorry, not his fault, he confessed to feeling intimedated.

Piano Teacher, who is older and wiser ignored the rudeness and tried to engage her in conversation about the volume of the Piano and daughter's compositions. He felt she was making up the response to his question about the compositions. She didn't reply to the volume one at all despite being asked twice.

I really wonder what she's thinking about, her behaviour is giving her away to people she doesn't know at all.

This is absolutely appalling. I do feel as a teacher, and I am one, that it is imperative to be professional. It is possible to have fun and be approachable but at all times one must be professional.
To upset two other musicians is amazing.
Can I ask what will happen with A level. I know you say it will be over after then end of this year but how will emsoboe do A level.

I'm not generally in favour of bigger schools but one advantage is that there isn't a single teacher in sole charge of a subject. This teacher couldn't behave as badly if there were other music teachers in the school.
Please give emsoboe a hug from me.
Dora

The school doesn't at present have a sixth form, but it will the year emsoboe leaves. She will not be attending and we will be very careful to make sure she gets the right place for her.

I think this teacher is depressing...



Words fail me...

I'm really sorry to hear all this, things really aren't getting better.

I know you've said before that you're happy with other aspects of your daughter's education at this school but if she is going to move at some stage anyway, is it time to think again about where your daughter is going to be happiest now? I suspect that frustration and worry about all this must be affecting all aspects of your and your daughters life and I can't help wondering if a change sooner rather than later would be a change for the best.

Good luck in getting through all this.

I think what you are suggesting makes sense on one level. It's not just because emsoboe is settled in other aspects of her schooling that I don't want to make a drastic change. Over the last year we've really sorted out her instrument teaching and all the people she now works with are very kind and supportive to her as well as being good teachers.

A couple of her teachers already work at the local specialist school and two more are very well qualified another has an excellent approach to teaching her. I think if she was generally unhappy at school and didn't have the right instrumental support then it would be the right thing to do.

There's always the option to ask for her to be removed from class music lessons once the GCSE is over, there's only about 4 or 5 more before then.

I would certainly do that, and let Emsoboe move on and leave this woman behind her.

Well, that's just the most stupid thing to say! The piece is good; it suits the instruments being used as it sits well under the fingers and is in exactly the right style for recorders, it is full of contrasts of key and rhythmic detail and it works! It is a well balanced piece and cannot be described as being depressing at all. We were impressed with Emily's composition and it added greatly to our concert.

I think that you have both been more than patient with this "teacher" and I would have snapped ages ago if I had been poor Emily. I was lucky enough to have had a real musician teaching me for O Level music many years ago as well as a well known composer who would let me take in my efforts at composition to my aural training lessons. I am not sure that I would have produced as good a work as Emily's composition without their help at her age. Well done Emily.

Sorry if I was misleading. It was a Grade 6 flute piece Adagio Molto and Allegro Con Brio Jardinari (SP). Why she had to watch it and comment just before the practicals is anyones guess. The Music Service must have sent all the schools a copy of the DVD, it was from a soloists Concert they held a couple of months ago.

It's not the first time she's said something as stupid as this. Her and the Head dislike the Jazz piece The Wedding (anyone doing G4 or G5 Jazz will know it). They wouldn't allow it to be played at Presentation Evening. The reason...It's depressing!!

I don't know what she thinks of either composition. The Piano Teacher asked her and he was furious as he thought school teacher was making the comment up (something to do with 3rds or 7ths). Not even sure which composition she was talking about. It didn't make any sense at all. Even though I've said what she's like it didn't stop him being shocked on meeting her.

I wonder if the Teacher is capable of reading it as she's asked for a Recording, we've just sorted it (busy week with concerts). It's not an absoloute requirement of the exam board.

I don't get why this woman has been defended to the hilt by management, her behaviour is unacceptable on all levels. She can't look anyone in the face and gets angry at any attempt at discussion.

You'll have to get Emsoboe to play either the Cantilena (2nd movement) from the Poulenc sonata or the slow (2nd) movement from the Mathias sonatina for them. These both require a kind of eerie feel which people often don't expect from a flute and would probably be classed as 'depressing' by some people because of the mood they portray (that said, I think the flute is very well suited to these pieces, and I really like the Mathias - but there do seem to be some people who think that flutes have to always sound happy ).



She's being defended in public - but you don't know what's going on in private, and it may be that the senior teachers have said negetive things to her in private which have unsettled her and made her feel the need to be defensive.

(N.B. I'm not trying to defend or side with the teacher here - just observing that that full picture may not be visable as you don't know what has been said to the teacher by the senior staff)

Well she could have played the Schumann Romance No1 on Oboe that might have cheered them up a bit too

I get the impression the public "face" is the private one. There's absoloutly no empathy whatsoever for the child's situation. It's like they are viewing the music teacher through rose coloured specs.

It's not like they really need me to tell them how bad she is the very fact that there's no after school music (except the GCSE group which is less than half it's original size). They can't even muster a choir of any description. Teacher claims the children are not interested (quite a few having singing lessons at school). They don't go as she turns up late, gets them to sing depressing songs and can't manage the accompaniments. a pair of eyes and ears is all that's needed to discover this.

I think she might like it too especially if it's Rose

I like the Schumann Oboe romances, particularly no 3, of if she wants a particularly cheerful (not) piece she could always play the Poulenc Oboe Sonata, or one of those lovely slow movements from the Albinoni Oboe Concerti.

The fact that she composed a piece that fitted the recorder to sell is credit to her. I wish other composers would take so much care in composing within the limits of the instruments they were composing for.

Notmusicmum, you might need to have another word with your music inspector friend to get someone independent to mark Embs GCSE coursework.

That shouldn't be a problem as all the work has to be submitted to the moderator, when there are less than 10 candidates. The Deputy has already said he's expecting A* (not that I am), that leaves removing something as the only option and I'm going to make copies of everything in the folder. I managed to buy a folder with a clip that takes some working out how to open it

The teacher has argued throughout that she is doing everything she can to teach properly. I suspect she won't try and mess with the result. Although nothing would suprise me.

The only slight concern, looking at the exam boards info they don't view it well if the teacher doesn't indicate that they have given any help or advice on the appropriate form. She hasn't given any help so it's going to be difficult for her to do that. I'm just hoping the performances act as an indicator of daughter's overall musicality, she did a G6 Recorder piece for her solo and an intermediate Jazz Sax duet for the ensemble.

Re. the form. As I recall your daughters piano teacher helped with some of the compositions? His name and some details of what he contributed should go on the form.

In addition, if I recall rightly from my own GCSE experiences, it'll be your daughter that fills in and signs this form. I can't remember if the teacher / people who have assisted also have to sign it, though I expect her main class teacher probably will.

The form is their to declare any help recieved, and legitimise it. My grandmother was mention on my sisters DT form, for example, because she helped sew something my sister didn't have time to finish. It was fine.

Perhaps one of the forum class music teachers could confirm this?

Her Piano Teacher helped Record her composition initially and gave her some advice about what to look for and avoid (he's a performer not a composer). She has had some direct input which could go on the form as it's been advice on the level that the Teacher should have given. I doubt she would loose marks for the advice she's had but I don't think this particular form is for pupils.

Should add that I've no problem with the marking being based on actual help. I object to her loosing marks under the assumption she's had help from the teacher, which she most definately has not.

Speaking as a former head of music in a large performing arts specialist status school, I don't think you should worry overly much about the actual mark your daughter will receive.

The marks for GCSE always do reflect back on the teacher, and so, even the meanest, most unprofessional teacher is unlikely to hinder a top student being granted an A*. They might, infuriatingly, take a lot of credit where it may not be due, but you just have to laugh behind your hand at this and move on!

I now frequently find myself working with GCSE and A level students who do not feel they are being adequately prepared for the exam. I advertise as doing this, and fortunately, I'm able to maintain positive relationships with a number of music staff in the music departments of local schools, which helps!

Sounds like my daughter's situation.




I've already made it very clear that she has to take no credit for my daughter's mark. Why should she when she's done nothing. I know it's been said previously in this thread but we are paying these inadequate teachers through our taxes.

I don't understan why these probelems are allowed to exist, though I do believe that it's largely due to cost cutting by the schools.

I've recently been studying for a management qualification and I also wonder whether this occures due to poor recruitment.

Now we're back in term time and the listening exam is alarmingly early, are things any better? Have you done the TT yet?

Well the teacher put about 4 sheets and a load of flash cards for revision in her school based folder. One of them talks about the piece of music they listened to, a bit silly when she hasn't. The Flash cards are usless as the work hasn't been covered in the first place.

The terminal task is tomorrow.

The course work was handed in 4 weeks ago and no feedback has been given whatsoever, not that I expected any.

Lots of work still to od before the listening paper but not worrying about it anymore. There's only so much banging of head against a brick wall anyone can do. the teacher insists and has convinced the Deputy there are only 4 things they can be asked on in the exam. What can you do?

Not sure what a terminal task is , but hope it goes well tomorrow.

Thanks!! I don't really understand it either They are given a rhythm and 30 mins to compose or play a piece around it. She's not particularly worried about this aspect of the exam as she has a routine of composing part of it an then improvising.

I don't know either, but I can't help thinking they could have come up with a less intimidating name for it!!!

slightly off topic, so apologies to notmusimum -

at the Calais end of the channel tunnel there are signs which direct drivers to
'Terminal Fret'

I guessed it might mean freight terminal - but it always makes me smile - I sometimes think terminal fret is something a lot of us suffer from !

I've been thinking that too. It sounds a bit like they're wanting the students to die (sorry, but it does...).

It does sound like it, doesn't it

Yes, I've had some difficulty explaining this to some parents. It is an unfortunate name; 'its perhaps the name given to a nurse who has to switch of a life support machine', as one less understanding parent put it to me.

Basically, they are given three stimuli, one rhythm, one melody and one chord sequence, and they can choose one and they then prepare a very short composition based on it in 30 minutes. They have to repeat their chosen stimulus exactly the first time, but then are left to develop it. Mine are taught to do either the melody or rhythm and then:

-produce 16 bar piece in simple 4 bar phrases with clearly identifiable form (AABA/AA'BA/ABCA') etc
-make sure it has plenty of the melodic techniques that get the good marks (sequence, pass/aux notes, ornament/variation, modulation etc.)
-make sure it is instrument specific and that the music reflects this
-make sure it has some (but not too many) performance directions

The weaker candidates end up doing it a little mechanically, though enough to pass, for the more able, the above gives them a basic framework from which to expand on.

Of course Emsoboe hasn't been given any of this information. She's hoping to do similar to the mock where she scored 14/15 all the work will be moderated so she oculd end up with any mar

I'm a maths teacher, but I imagine the form for music will be the same in this respect to the form for maths.
(although there's no longer any maths coursework, which means I got an extra four hours a day in my Easter holidays this year! yay! )

There is a section which says, effectively, "this is the candidate's own work other than as detailed below" (where the candidate - or teacher - can write down any help they (the candidate!) had) and then the candidate signs and the teacher signs. The section in which you write the details says "Help given that was over and above normal classroom practice". Interestingly enough, in eight years and well over 1000 candidates, I've seen that part of the form completed exactly once.

Daughter hasn't been asked to complete any forms for the GCSE music. We looked online at the exam boards website and printed one form which was essential. There is another one which asks about technology but we weren't sure what to do about that one. In the end daughter included the technology in her written work (edirol R-09) we only used a recording device for the compositions. I'm sure there is still a chance she will need to complete this.

From what i can gather there is a form that the teacher uses to explain what help/guidance the pupil had. If I've read it rightly the exam board expect this to be completed by the teacher. They fully accept that candidates will require some support during the course. In this instance the teacher cannot fill this out as she didn't give any support, guidance or advice. I'm not goign to worry over it anymore I hope the fact Emsoboe has identified that she plays wind instruments regularly and indicated that she played on her own compositions as well as the required performances that this will be enough to help the examiner understand where she's at.

It wouldn't be a problem for her to outline the support she had as I'm sure that it's much less than many and was on elelments of the composition where it's entirely acceptable. The ideas were certainly all her own and no-one saw the compositions until they were more or less, first draft, complete. As she plays all the instruments she composed for she was always within range even if it was a bit tricky to play at times. Her problems were more to od with harmony and chords clashing.

She had a massive bit of praise form the teacher this week who told her the coursework was "fantastic". They all go to the board so we'll just have to wait and see what the result brings once the listening paper is over.

If it's any help, I usually gave out the coursework forms in a lesson the week before the coursework had to be sent off to the exam board (which is about now, so it should appear quite soon). The students filled them in and signed them and I collected them back in again. I think the whole form-completing-and-signing took about 5 minutes in total! What your daughter has written sounds fine to me.

How did the TT go? We're doing ours at the end of the week.

Really don't know. She's always had a way to deal with it that uses her improvisation skills. Writes so many bars, plays them improvises a section then repeats the first section. As far as she's concerned it's not a problem. Just hope the moderator feels the same

I think she said it took about 5 mins to write it out but could have this wrong.

Good, glad it went well. She should be able to get her mark before it goes to the moderator.

Nothing is normal in this senario. The rest of the groups coursework is due in end of this week so I wouldn't imaging thye will be marked for another week or so. We'll have to see how it goes.