Now then all

I've just started studying my ABRSM Grade 8 guitar and have a couple of questions

Now, I've been playing guitar for 12 years (I'm 18 so pretty much been slogging at it my whole life) but have never really taken to classical until recently.

I haven't done any previous grades and am more used to reading tab than dots (doesn't mean I can't read just I'm a touch rusty) but was wondering if anyone had any charts or links to charts that show the correlation of the frets to music notation?

Secondly I'm just interested to know how many pieces for the classical guitar are written down with two parts (treble clef and treble clef an octave lower). At the moment I'm learning Capricho Arabe by Tarrega and this piece is written in this way (and somewhat bizarrely showing two seperate keys on each stave).
Is this fairly unusual or is it standard at this level? (feedback on either point is welcome).


peace all
Dowlie

It's usually written on one stave.
I don't know the piece you're referring to, but I suspect that it's been arranged over two staves just because it's bi-tonal. Writing it on one stave would make it difficult to understand what was going on with the keys and would require a lot of accidentals.

Hi Dowlie,

Am a bit surprised by this opening. Great that you're having a go at the Classical side of our instrument but to go in at grade 8 seems a bit intense. Are you studying with a teacher at the moment? Have they recommended grade 8 for you?

I'm also curious that you've only just come into Classical style playing. The techniques (both right and left hand) are quite different to playing on steel string acoustic or electric (yes I play these too) so has your teacher been over these differences with you?

The need for a chart I would find slightly alarming if you're going for graded guitar exams. by grade 8, if playing classical, you should know where each note on the stave is represented on guitar as you're going to have to do it on the fly in the exam (sight reading test). You shouldn't need pointing to a chart either if you're going to be going in at grade 8, you should already have grade 5 theory so if you take each fret to be a semitone and you know where each open string is on the stave then the kind of chart you're hoping for should be the work of minutes to prepare. If not, perhaps think of trying a lower grade (no shame in that) doing some more theory or taking some more lessons.

If you can read, you don't really need this kind of chart. If you need this kind of chart.....



Whilst there are some pieces that use double stave notation (the last movement of the Britten "Nocturnal" and several versions of the Bach "Lute" Suites are examples) Capricho Arabe is not one of them.

http://www.muslib.se/ebibliotek/boije/pdf/Boije%20827.pdf

The above is a link to a public domain copy (from the excellent Boije collection Music Library of Sweden) and is as close to original as you're likely to get.

You'll note that it's written on one stave. I've seen a few versions in a few publications of this piece and haven't seen it in the way you describe (I didn't do it for my grade 8, I took the Giuliani from that list but still...) what publication are you looking at?

Please don't think I'm trying to knock you down. As I said, it's great that you're having a go at Classical (welcome to the dark side - we have cookies) but with the questions you're asking, I feel that you might be being a tad ambitious and should perhaps look at discussing this in more depth with your teacher.

Finally, to give a bit of perspective. When I did my first Classical guitar exams (all those years ago) I was playing stuff by Metallica, Knopfler, the odd bit of Vai and Satriani, Paul Simon, bits of Jazz, etc, etc....

The grade I went in at? Grade 3.

Note that I am NOT saying that all of those groups/players are below grade 3 (far from it) but that the change in instrument, techniques, approach to reading and a whole host of other things meant that I had a rather steep learning curve.

Have a look at these.

Fernando Sor Op 35.

http://www.muslib.se/ebibliotek/boije/pdf/Boije%20481.pdf

http://www.muslib.se/ebibliotek/boije/pdf/Boije%20482.pdf

Matteo Carcassi Op 60

http://www.muslib.se/ebibliotek/boije/pdf/Boije%2094.pdf

If you're grade 8, these shouldn't really phase you. If they do give you pause, then I urge you to give a lower grade a try (and to find a teacher if you're trying to do this on your own.

All the best.

Matt.




Hi Teigr,

Please see my post for link to this piece. Bi-tonality not an issue.

Cheers,

Matt.

That was a bit of a monster post

Ok firstly the copy of Capricho Arabe I found was bi-tonal (no idea why but it was) but thanks for the link to that copy though.

Secondly I do have a tutor and I can read music. I met with her for the first time today and we had a look through the pieces and she conceded that it was all groovy for me to hop in at grade 8. Perhaps I should clarify, classical guitar is the final frontier for me in terms of my guitar playing. I've done shed loads of fingerstyle stuff before so my right hand technique is already good. Yeh I need to re adjust to this style but it isn't exactly difficult.

Thirdly, I do know where the notes on a stave are on a guitar. It'd just be nice to have a reference (I don't think I made that particularly clear). And anyways, like I say, I've only just started on this classical thing so a couple of "novice" complications are bound to arise.
Having said that though, looking at those pieces, there is nothing there that I look at and think "Oh s**te I've got to try and play that.

Thanks again for the links to the pieces though
Favourited the site


Dowlie

I was just going by his description of it - two staves, with different key signatures.
I've looked at the link you gave and that's nothing like he described. Single stave and just one key signature (well, just one at a time anyway). I wonder what it was he was looking at.

The only bi-tonal stuff I've really come across is for organ, so it's basically one hand in each key - I dread to think how it would be done on guitar.

Dowlie> Can you point us at a copy of your version?

http://www.sibeliusmusic.com/cgi-bin/show_...pl?scoreid=2697

this is where i got the version from that i was working off
Think it's someone's re-arrangment though

Mystery solved...
"This piece, Eastern in style, was first written for classical guitar. To retain this feel, this arrangement for solo Bb clarinet has a guitar accompaniment."

So, it's been arranged for clarinet and guitar, with one part transposed accordingly.

OK, I admit I couldn't see the actual score on my screen, but I did note that this version is for Bb clarinet with guitar accompaniment - could explain why the keys are different, as the Bb clarinet part would be transposed!

Edit: Sorry, Teigr, didn't see your post until I'd posted mine!

I feel somewhat dense now

It's amazing what can be found out when you just read something
I am a tad excitable however and just jumped in trying to play it


Dowlie