Hi Everyone

I'm just wondering, how does the structure of learning music (for me, piano) works?

I know there's Grade 1 - 8, then there's the diplomas offer by ABRSM ... but what comes after the diploma? Does ABRSM offer degree in music as well?

PS: Another question, what are the difference between the different types of diplomas offered -- etc. music direction, music performance, vocal training ...

Now, I am no expert, (having never been in a position where I have been good enough to think about doing a degree in music, and having done very few music exams in my life!) so can only give a broad outline based on what I know (or, at least, think I know!)

As far as I am aware AB offer prep test-Grade 1 through to Grade 8-then "Diplomas":DipABRSM-LRSM-FRSM.

There are also off-shoots and alternatives offered such as music medals and performance assessments; and also theory exams and practical musicianship exams for Grades 1-8. Grade 5 theory or practical musicianship is a pre-requisite for practical exams at Grade 5 and above (or a pass in a solo jazz exam?).

The DipABRSM, LRSM and FRSM can be taken in peformance, teaching or direction. DipABRSM has a pre-requisite of Grade 8 practical (with DipABRSM being a pre-requisite for LRSM, etc), and teaching has an additional pre-requisite of Grade 6 theory.

There are also other exam boards who offer similar exams.

The Associated Board themselves do not offer a degree, although the Diploma level exams are supposed to be equivalent to the practical element of a music degree.

Degree level study has to be taken at a university or conservatoire. I believe the standard required used to be a distinction at Grade 8, but apparently although that would now get you into a university, it would not get you into a conservatoire because enough people have reached a higher standard than that by then. Again, this is not something I have personal experience of, just something I have heard other people say, so if I am wrong please people feel free to correct me!

However, having said all this there is no correct "path" or definite structure. You don't have to follow the path of doing all the grades 1-8, and as universities and conservatoires audition, there are probably a lot of people who don't sit the exams. I'm sure there are also some very famous musicians who did not do a music degree! As for the diplomas, looking at the statistics, last year less than 1000 people took diploma exams, and about half of them failed. So it's not a standard qualification!

Please excuse that slightly garbled explanation!

For instrumentalists the approximate equivalent playing standards are:

Grade 8 - Entrance level for conservatoire
Associate diploma - Succesful completion of first year of Conservatoire
Licentiate diploma - Conservatoire graduate
Fellowship diploma - Masters degree in performance

The entrance standard varies with the popularity of the instrument. A lot of people play the piano so it is the toughest. But the colleges generally rely on their own auditions rather than the results of Grade exams. In practice many of the entrants play at a standard far in excess of the minimum, and the best graduates play at a world-class level - well beyond the standard that will earn the highest diplomas.

The above is for instrumental performers. The standards of instrumental performance required for other in-depth music studies (e.g. composition, production) are not so high - though in reality most such students are excellent instrumentalists - usually pianists.

As for the different streams, performance, teaching, direction - I would have thought they are self-explanatory.

Of course a University or Conservatoire degree requires much broader musical studies than the diplomas - which are quite narrow in scope. Many performance degrees offer the option of learning to teach others the instrument alongside learning how to play it yourself. The teaching training/assessment is noted on the degree transcript, and provides a formal qualification in those countries where some kinds of music teaching are controlled professions.

Conservatoires will always audition and the standard on entry will normally be higher than Grade 8, depending on instrument. Most people will play DipABRSM type repertoire for auditions to conservatoires and are easily this standard on entrance. The academic requirements are far less important. Of course, there are still academic music courses to follow at a conservatoire but it is the performance standard that is most important.

Universities rarely audition, but many require Grade 8 distinction plus Grade 6 standard piano skills. The academic requirements will be far higher. For instance, Manchester University will ask for A grades in Music and an English rich subject (like English Literature, History, Philosophy etc). There may well be performance elements of a university degree course, but not to the extent of a conservatoire.

Most famous musicians who didn't do a music degree - there must be lots; e.g. Sir Roger Norrington -did do some sort of postgraduate music study. Whatever your first degree, you can audition to study for a postgraduate diploma at a conservatoire; this is quite a popular option for those who weren't quite ready to put all their eggs in the performing basket at age 18.

The first performance diploma is mostly used to fill the gap between grade 8 and uni/conservatoire for people who are still at school, and many really good performers who know they'll be going to a conservatoire don't bother with it; hence the low numbers.

Whoa ... it sure sounds difficult

Thanks much for all the very useful information. I've actually just finish G7, going to G8, so guess I will focus on this first and see if I'm up to the challenge after that

The basic requirement will be a G8 cert right? Does it have to be a merit or distinction to get me to the diploma stage?

Apart from qualifications, what are the things I need to know or be good in?

No. You just need to pass.

The experienced forumites above have said it all.

Just add a link to an interesting podcast episode talking about the diplomas, which answers many of the frequently asked questions:

http://www.abrsm.org/resources/Diplomas.mp3