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Navanwoman
I have my Grade 8 piano in two weeks but I've been long thinking about taking up a second instrument.

I have rather small hands and short fingers unfortunately (just about and only just make the octave on the piano). Not sure if this will help or hinder me in playing other instruments.

I haven't a great ear. I know when things sound right or wrong, but can't sing and can't work things out by ear. I have MASSIVE problems in the aural section of exams. But I love playing music and am told I can play with nice expression.

Because of my weak ear I've ruled out string instruments smile.gif
I'm thinking of maybe the clarinet, or perhaps the flute. But maybe there's something I haven't thought of....
sarah123
I wouldn't be too quick to judge your ear. As a pianist, you've never really had to use it as all the notes are just 'there'. I thought much the same thing, but I've found it's improved a lot since I took up the fiddle, so maybe you shouldn't rule out strings too quickly.

Obviously, if you have small hands you probably want to avoid the really big instruments, but it shouldn't restrict your choice too much. Just pick an instrument that you really like the sound of. If it were me, I'd probably would probably be the clarinet, but that's just personal preference.

Have you thought about the recorder? biggrin.gif ph34r.gif
hello_cello
Sarah, who hasnt ill.gif

What about organ? I think that will be fairly easy to pick up, as you will already have a good knowledge of keyboard playing, which will help alot.
You could take up something completely different... bell ringing at your local church!
Mad Tom
QUOTE(Navanwoman @ Mar 21 2009, 09:19 PM) *

I have my Grade 8 piano in two weeks but I've been long thinking about taking up a second instrument.

I have rather small hands and short fingers unfortunately (just about and only just make the octave on the piano). Not sure if this will help or hinder me in playing other instruments.

I haven't a great ear. I know when things sound right or wrong, but can't sing and can't work things out by ear. I have MASSIVE problems in the aural section of exams. But I love playing music and am told I can play with nice expression.

Because of my weak ear I've ruled out string instruments smile.gif
I'm thinking of maybe the clarinet, or perhaps the flute. But maybe there's something I haven't thought of....

On the piano small hands make some things more difficult, and some of the repertoire impossible, but if you can manage an octave then they do not prevent you from becoming a very fine pianist and there is still more great music available that fits your hands than you will ever learn in one lifetime

But I guess that you are not wildly in love with the piano, otherwise you would not be thinking of playing another instrument.

The way to choose your instrument is to hear it played and be seized by a desperate passion to be able to play it yourself. And for this passion to continue after the first few attempts, when you find out what a difficult journey you've started on. I hear no passion in your mention of the flute and clarinet. Suggestions from other people of their favourite instrument aren't going to help.


miss sooky
QUOTE(Mad Tom @ Mar 22 2009, 08:00 AM) *

QUOTE(Navanwoman @ Mar 21 2009, 09:19 PM) *

I have my Grade 8 piano in two weeks but I've been long thinking about taking up a second instrument.

I have rather small hands and short fingers unfortunately (just about and only just make the octave on the piano). Not sure if this will help or hinder me in playing other instruments.

I haven't a great ear. I know when things sound right or wrong, but can't sing and can't work things out by ear. I have MASSIVE problems in the aural section of exams. But I love playing music and am told I can play with nice expression.

Because of my weak ear I've ruled out string instruments smile.gif
I'm thinking of maybe the clarinet, or perhaps the flute. But maybe there's something I haven't thought of....

On the piano small hands make some things more difficult, and some of the repertoire impossible, but if you can manage an octave then they do not prevent you from becoming a very fine pianist and there is still more great music available that fits your hands than you will ever learn in one lifetime

But I guess that you are not wildly in love with the piano, otherwise you would not be thinking of playing another instrument.

The way to choose your instrument is to hear it played and be seized by a desperate passion to be able to play it yourself. And for this passion to continue after the first few attempts, when you find out what a difficult journey you've started on. I hear no passion in your mention of the flute and clarinet. Suggestions from other people of their favourite instrument aren't going to help.


I completely agree that passion is key - it sounds sentimental but I think a genuine love for, and commitment to, a particular instrument is essential when learning as an adult and trying to juggle multiple other responsibilities - is there anything that really 'speaks' to you or you feel might be calling you?!
Navanwoman
QUOTE(Mad Tom @ Mar 22 2009, 08:00 AM) *

But I guess that you are not wildly in love with the piano, otherwise you would not be thinking of playing another instrument.


Thank you for your comments, I appreciate you taking the time to reply. However I wholly disagree some of your statements, and I feel it's not your place to judge how 'in love' I am with my piano. As it happens I am deeply 'in love' with it and play for hours every day. wub.gif wub.gif wub.gif I dislike myself for even bothering to try explaining or proving myself to a complete stranger unnecessarily, but there you go! your comments really irked me and I wanted to say something biggrin.gif

I enjoy music in all it's forms and love the tone of many different instruments. I am interested in trying something new and disagree that you have to be totally passionate about something to enjoy playing it. I am a school teacher, an adult learner and music is (and I suspect always will be) one of my most favourite passtimes. I have no ambition to become a professional musician.

My reason for posting was out of interest to hear what instruments other people chose to learn and why. I am deeply moved by the sound of the violin, but I know from the guitar that I have problems tuning stringed instruments. I know when something's 'off', even by a small bit, but I find it so difficult to correct it.

Sarah, I'd be very interested to know how much you felt your ear improved?
sbhoa
I'd say choose whatever you'd most like to play without (if possible) trying to anticipate what might prove easier or more difficult.
sarah123
QUOTE(Navanwoman @ Mar 22 2009, 06:29 PM) *

Sarah, I'd be very interested to know how much you felt your ear improved?


A lot smile.gif

It's helped pitch perception in general I think, so knowing whether something's in or out of tune, recogising intervals, sight singing, being able to pick out a bass line etc.
Roseau
QUOTE(Navanwoman @ Mar 21 2009, 08:19 PM) *

Because of my weak ear I've ruled out string instruments smile.gif
I'm thinking of maybe the clarinet, or perhaps the flute. But maybe there's something I haven't thought of....

Intonation is not always straight-forward on wind instruments either. Just pressing the right keys doesn't mean the note will be in tune - embouchure and breath support (or lack of) will effect the tuning of the note quite dramatically.
Teigr
As you don't have a clear preference for a particular instrument, have a think about what you want to do with one. You already said you want to have fun playing, but different people have different ideas about what's fun.

As piano tends to be quite a solitary instrument, do you want something that offers lots of ensemble playing opportunities?
See what you can find out about local ensembles as going for cornet if there's no local band or violin if there's no local string group or amateur orchestra might make it harder to find playing opportunities. (I know you already ruled out strings, but this is just an example).

Is part of what you enjoy about piano the fact that you can play harmonically complete music by yourself?
Other keyboard instruments or plucked strings could be worth exploring.

How much space do you have at home? What sort of car do you drive?
A flute is easy to store and transport. A double bass? Not so much...

Do live in a detached house, or something with shared walls (and how sound-proof are those walls)?
Classical guitar is unlikely to annoy even the closest of neighbours, but drum kit could easily antagonise half the street.

You said you're a school teacher. Do you teach primary or secondary?
Way too many primary schools involve well-meaning parents/teachers in teaching the recorder, even if they have no real understanding of it, so kids get into really bad habits like playing with their hands the wrong way round. Learning the recorder properly could be useful for a primary school teacher.
Whichever type of school you're at, there may be opportunities for you to learn and/or practise at school, so that may affect your choice too. Access to school orchestra percussion instruments or a harpsichord would give you a chance to learn something that would otherwise be quite difficult to arrange.

What sort of music do you like?
If you prefer early and baroque music, then clarinet or sax might not be good choices. If you love jazz, then something like oboe wouldn't be the most suitable.

Given that you're already quite experienced at piano, how well do you think you'd cope with being a struggling beginner all over again? If you think you'd be very impatient to get past the very early stages, go for something which normally offers quick results rather than something that's generally more challenging to start with (flute or cornet rather than violin or French horn).

If you want to get into orchestras and so on, consider the demand for various instruments. Strings and the less popular woodwind and brass instruments will give you much greater chance of getting in than flute or clarinet.

What can you afford to spend?
Bassoons are expensive compared to trumpets.

Do you like to sing?
Guitar (and other plucked strings) could be a good choice as it would let you accompany yourself (or others) and it's more portable than a piano.

That's not an exhaustive list, but should give you some idea of the sorts of things you might want to take into consideration.

Don't let your intonation problems automatically rule out strings or rule in anything else. As others have said, most instruments have intonation issues or one sort or another. So you'll have to overcome them eventually or be limited to keyboards and fretted strings (with help from a tuning device).
skylark
If you don't have a particular yearning towards one instrument or another, I'd probably take two things into account, both of which Teigr mentioned and I agree with - the type of music you like to listen to and the performance opportunities which the instrument affords.

If I liked baroque music, I would take up the recorder - I've heard the recorder family played by excellent recorder players and there may be opportunities to play with an SRP group (Society of Recorder Players).

On the other hand, if you have a hankering to play with an orchestra, recorder would obviously not be the best choice. Your local orchestra may be crying out for clarinet, flute, (insert instrument), players so it might be worth ringing round to find out.

I didn't have a passion for clarinet when I took it up - I just wanted to be able to play along to the type of songs that a family member liked to sing, and clarinet was the nearest instrument to a recorder, which was the only instrument I knew anything about. I had even less of a desire to learn to play piano - I only took it up to help with music theory/harmony. But I took to both instruments instantly, and haven't looked back since wub.gif

Holz Gedeckt
QUOTE(Teigr @ Mar 23 2009, 09:39 AM) *

As you don't have a clear preference for a particular instrument, have a think about what you want to do with one. You already said you want to have fun playing, but different people have different ideas about what's fun.

As piano tends to be quite a solitary instrument, do you want something that offers lots of ensemble playing opportunities?
See what you can find out about local ensembles as going for cornet if there's no local band or violin if there's no local string group or amateur orchestra might make it harder to find playing opportunities. (I know you already ruled out strings, but this is just an example).

Is part of what you enjoy about piano the fact that you can play harmonically complete music by yourself?
Other keyboard instruments or plucked strings could be worth exploring.

How much space do you have at home? What sort of car do you drive?
A flute is easy to store and transport. A double bass? Not so much...

Do live in a detached house, or something with shared walls (and how sound-proof are those walls)?
Classical guitar is unlikely to annoy even the closest of neighbours, but drum kit could easily antagonise half the street.

You said you're a school teacher. Do you teach primary or secondary?
Way too many primary schools involve well-meaning parents/teachers in teaching the recorder, even if they have no real understanding of it, so kids get into really bad habits like playing with their hands the wrong way round. Learning the recorder properly could be useful for a primary school teacher.
Whichever type of school you're at, there may be opportunities for you to learn and/or practise at school, so that may affect your choice too. Access to school orchestra percussion instruments or a harpsichord would give you a chance to learn something that would otherwise be quite difficult to arrange.

What sort of music do you like?
If you prefer early and baroque music, then clarinet or sax might not be good choices. If you love jazz, then something like oboe wouldn't be the most suitable.

Given that you're already quite experienced at piano, how well do you think you'd cope with being a struggling beginner all over again? If you think you'd be very impatient to get past the very early stages, go for something which normally offers quick results rather than something that's generally more challenging to start with (flute or cornet rather than violin or French horn).

If you want to get into orchestras and so on, consider the demand for various instruments. Strings and the less popular woodwind and brass instruments will give you much greater chance of getting in than flute or clarinet.

What can you afford to spend?
Bassoons are expensive compared to trumpets.

Do you like to sing?
Guitar (and other plucked strings) could be a good choice as it would let you accompany yourself (or others) and it's more portable than a piano.

That's not an exhaustive list, but should give you some idea of the sorts of things you might want to take into consideration.

Don't let your intonation problems automatically rule out strings or rule in anything else. As others have said, most instruments have intonation issues or one sort or another. So you'll have to overcome them eventually or be limited to keyboards and fretted strings (with help from a tuning device).

What a very well-considered post, packed full of excellent advice! smile.gif
Flossie
QUOTE(skylark @ Mar 23 2009, 10:01 AM) *

On the other hand, if you have a hankering to play with an orchestra, recorder would obviously not be the best choice. Your local orchestra may be crying out for clarinet, flute, (insert instrument), players so it might be worth ringing round to find out.


I'm not sure about this (sorry Skylark) - I think you need to look at what's available in your area and the standard they would expect you to be on a particular instrument. I play flute (which I absolutely love) but it generally isn't a good instrument to play if you want orchestral opportunities. The flute is a popular as the violin now, but whereas a standard sized orchestra will typically take 20-40 violins it will take 2-4 flutes with the 2nd flute player doubling onto piccolo - with the result that a lot of amateur orchestras turn away post-diploma standard flute players. Some areas have things like wind bands or flute choirs which will take lower grade players - but this isn't always the case (and a lot of wind bands seem to typically expect players to be grade 6+, or sometimes grade 8+). I have had problems finding playing opportunities and now play in a community orchestra which has a daft number of flutes and end up sitting out for quite a lot of the music because we typically have 8-10 flutes at rehersals and if there's only 2 flute parts for a particular symphony then the DipABRSM/LSRMetc players are the ones who play.

Like a lot of the other posters, I would recommend that you think carefully about what you intend to do with your second instrument and don't automatically rule out strings because of your 'poor' ear. Woodwind instruments can appear to be require less of an 'ear' than strings in the early grades but in the intermediate and higher grades they present a lot of challenges for intonation which do require you to be able to hear and adjust tuning and intonation etc - so don't let your 'lack' of ear put you off certain instruments - they all have their own challenges for this.

Think about the instruments you like listening to and what you would really, really like to play. Don't chose something you don't have a passion for just because yout think it will be easier to play or carry etc - if you don't have a burning desire to play the instrument in the first place, then you probably won't get on as well as you otherwise would.

Hope you enjoy whatever you decide. smile.gif
AmandaL
QUOTE(Flossie @ Mar 23 2009, 02:16 PM) *
Think about the instruments you like listening to and what you would really, really like to play. Don't chose something you don't have a passion for just because yout think it will be easier to play or carry etc - if you don't have a burning desire to play the instrument in the first place, then you probably won't get on as well as you otherwise would.
I wholeheartedly agree with this. Whatever instrument(s) you choose you've got to really want to play it, otherwise practice will become a chore.
Roseau
QUOTE(Flossie @ Mar 23 2009, 03:16 PM) *

I play flute (which I absolutely love) but it generally isn't a good instrument to play if you want orchestral opportunities. The flute is a popular as the violin now, but whereas a standard sized orchestra will typically take 20-40 violins it will take 2-4 flutes with the 2nd flute player doubling onto piccolo - with the result that a lot of amateur orchestras turn away post-diploma standard flute players. Some areas have things like wind bands or flute choirs which will take lower grade players - but this isn't always the case (and a lot of wind bands seem to typically expect players to be grade 6+, or sometimes grade 8+).

You should come and live in my part of France where, believe it or not, flute players are in very short supply and the wind-bands and orchestra I play in are actively advertising for them!
plonkee
The only thing I'd add to teigr's comprehensive post is that you might want to think about how easy or difficult it would be to get lessons. The more unusual the instrument the further you might need to travel to find a compatible teacher. This depends on where you live yourself of course, London is not going to be a problem, but the Shetland Islands might be a different matter.
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