How does one go about teaching tones and semitones to a pupil that has no knowledge of the piano? Especially that there is only a semitone between E and F, and B and C.

I was taught this by using the image of the piano, as I also played piano at that stage, which made it much easier. But I battle to find a way for my beginners to remember te BC, EF semitones. Any tricks that someone would be willing to share?

I wish I could help, as this is something I have struggled with for a long time myself. As I teach more violin than anything else, it's not too bad as when the fingers are close together on the string it's a semitone, further apart and it's a tone (usually!) It's a very loose definition, but works for beginners. But for other instruments, I've no idea. I will watch this thread with interest - thanks for raising this.

To help me answer, can you tell me why you need to teach this?

I agree that it is hard to explain semitones and tones, even when you are teaching them on the piano and it is always easier if you have a visual aid and of course the piano shows the tonal distance spatially as well, which definitely helps.

I don't play the recorder, so this might be a really silly thing to suggest - in which case I apologise, but it's just a thought:

Can you not show them a keyboard (or print out a keyboard layout) and demonstrate the semitones to them with that, then explain that although the recorder is a different instrument, without keys that set the distance, the semitones/tone sounds remain the same in western music.

So then you explain how to play the semitones and tones on the recorder, relating it to what they can see on the piano?

Can you do it aurally - hear how much bigger the interval is between A and B and B and C?

But as tomfrakenburg said, if you can let us know why you need this, it might help with killer suggestions

I usually try to avoid the topic of tones and semitones as long as possible! It does become essential when you start with scales, especially minors where you have to calculate the relative major (three semitones away).

I teach the recorder if that helps.

If it's for theory purposes, I think you just have to memorise that there is a semi-tone between B/C and E/F. There are only two things to remember and it is not that hard.

My daughter plays the cello and this is what she did. Obviously she can hear the difference between a semi-tone and a tone and I showed them to her on the piano but since she doesn't know which note is which on the piano it wasn't much use as a way of helping her to remember.

If you are thinking about scales you could always point out the way a scale is built (tone, tone semi-tone etc.) The pupil can then work out from C major what the semi-tones are.

Maybe this is too theoretical for your purposes (hard to physically demonstrate), but here goes.
1. Intervals in a major scale are T T S T T T S
2. C major has no accidentals.

Therefore the gaps between E and F and B and C must be semitones. I guess the piano keyboard layout is just an "accident" based on this.

Of course this invites the question "why did they call the scale that has no accidentals C major"? Damn, maybe the French have the right idea after all.

Could you maybe try teaching a chromatic scale so that they can hear clearly what semi tones sound like and then teach the tone/semi-tone composition of major scales to help the person understand the difference in sound between tones and semitones?

I also thought that chromatic scales would be helpful.

Too much of everything is easier to teach to pianists. Although I guess viola, cello, bassoon, (etc) players get their own backs when it comes to alto or tenor clefs.

I go with Cadence on this one. I always use the visual aid of the keyboard - real or printed. I think most children need the visual prop as well as the aural and purely theoretical memorising approach. A lot depends on the age and ability of the children.

Once they've got the hang of it visually I usually play little chromatic passages on the piano - just 3 or 4 notes so that they can play with me and both see and hear at the same time.

It is a difficult concept for some children.

A bit but I've recently been teaching a young piano student about semitones. He cottoned on very quickly to how sharps and flats worked and got all the questions right in his theory book. But he told me yesterday that his mum doesn't believe that there are such notes as F flat, E sharp, C flat & B sharp!!

You definitely need to connect the visual and the aural.

So I would suggest singing (naturally!) - solfa is very helpful because the semitones are always called mi-fa and ti-do, regardless of the key you're in. The Kodály handsigns are also helpful because the downturned thumb of the fa is pointing to the mi and the ti points upwards to the do.

Try drawing a staircase - as if you were looking at a set of stairs from the side. Make the semitone steps half the height of the tone steps and this is an effective visual tool. If you are using solfa you can write the solfa letters on the top of each step. For letter names you could have some cards (one with each letter on it) which the child could put on the appropriate steps in the staircase for whichever key you are using.

This is all a bit difficult to explain in words but I hope the suggestions help a bit.

Funnily enough, I had exactly this conversation at work today, I teach piano, and asked two brass teachers how they taught this. They both said they show students the piano keyboard so they can relate to the visual idea. I have also used this with theory students who don't play piano, and they don't seem to have a problem with it, even though it isn't their instrument. Many children play keyboards in school music lessons, so it isn't altogether unfamiliar.

For any keyboard student, I demonstrate semitones by taking a long strip of card (say, a couple of octaves long) and covering up the wider part of the natural keys, leaving only the narrow part on view.

By asking them to play every (narrow) key in turn, they not only hear, but get a visual impression as well.

After a couple of goes, they can usually play "in semitones" without the card being there.

I have also devised (composed is too strong a word!) several little "tunes" (tunes to them - exercises to me ) which comprise semitones ONLY

teaching semitones is hard. they're not very bright, and they giggle a lot and try to impress one another. Worse than teenagers ....

That D# is a terror. Wait until I speak to her Mum ...

Thank you for all the replies! Seems like I will have to use the piano as visual aid after all. That's fine. I was just wondering if there is any 'trick of the trade' that would make it slightly easier.

I use the idea of a ladder or staircase where some of the steps are smaller than the rest, or larger where you have the harmonic minor with sharpened 7th. I would usually draw on a small whiteboard to explain or use the piano keyboard - but all my students are piano students so they know something about keyboard geography.
The visual picture away from the keyboard can sometimes help them think about it in a different way to looking at the piano .

Like others have said though, it is difficult to explain, so I don't generally spend much time on it. Every so often, a student will ask me why there is not a black note between E/F or B/C which I usually explain by saying that the keyboard pattern with black and white notes is there to help us know where we are on they keyboard.


Louise

Her twin, Eb is a bit sharper though.

ah, but are they identical twins? now that should stir up ...

Oh I'm sure there must be someone around here who can put us straight on that one.

Depends who you ask. The string players would insist they aren't, the wind players would insist they are, the keyboard players would maintain that not only are they identical, they're such well-tempered twins as well

Please don't discount the idea of the visual staircase - it is immensely helpful and you can use the idea to show the structure of all the various scales. I use it a LOT!

Yes I do something similar - just cover up the lower half of the piano keys, and explain that if you walk up the keys from one to the next, ignoring colour, then you're playing semitones - the smallest steps you can take on the keys. If you play every other note, you're playing tones (and can point out that semi = half to reinforce). Then uncover and play normally, stepping just up the white notes - where there's a black note in between the notes you play, you must be playing tones, and where there isn't (ie B-C, E-F), you're taking the smallest possible step, i.e. no black note in between, = tones. And then introduce the major scale pattern etc...

Interesting though...

At another level the question is rather clever - why indeed is there a semitone between the 3rd and 4th, and 7th and tonic notes ?

Basic harmony from the overtone series can give us the tonic, 3rd, 5th and b7th - and therefore we can derive intervals with the tonic and its overtones - I think somewhere that is where the major 2nd interval comes from.

Now we have those intervals its just a case of fitting major 2nds into the gaps in a "pleasing" way - I think and thats is where there may be argument - i.e deciding what is pleasing to some cultures may not be pleasing to others and over time some sequences become standardised, like our own major\minor scale series:

Major scale Tonic, T,T,S,T,T,T,S back to tonic again

The start of the minor scale looks like Tonic, T,S,T... - just the alternative way of fitting the maj 2nd interval into the gap between the supertonic and the perfect 4th.

As for naming them C, D, E etc - I've no idea, but I suppose they have to be called something....

I've probably missed some stuff in all this, but basically thats my understanding! (oh, I haven't mentioned Just and Equal temperament as it may start a nightmare post....)


Actually - now I've had time to look, there is a good overview page on Wikipaedia - and that major second is there as the 9th partial.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harmonic_series_(music)