Can anyone give me some wellknown tunes, eg. nursery rhymes, which a 14 year old would be likely to know, which start with
1. an upward major 3rd
2. a downward major 3rd

My pupil has difficulty gauging the correct (3rd) intervals. He is singing the test.

We have tried(unsuccessfully) the singing the intermediate(up or down) note of the scale in your head method.

Thanks

Steve

The downward one is a minor third, isn't it? otherwise it's not within the key of the start note. Unless I've misunderstood your question.

If it is minor, it comes at the start of that cheeky 'can't catch me' tune that all (? surely) kids chant

eg C C A D C---A (thumb on nose and fingers waggling!)

with the A below the C and D just above.

Rising major 3rd = Morning Has Broken.

Another falling (minor!) 3rd is 'Some day I'll wish upon a star' - middle section of Somewhere over the Rainbow. I'm forever indebted to Hannah (now a med student) for that one!

Fire engine noises don't work any more since they changed the siren - darned inconsiderate of them!

And also 'While Shepherds watch their flocks by night'

and "Once In Royal..."

Finding tunes that today's 14 year olds would readily know -or sing- is such a problem these days, though.Sadly. As hymns are no longer sung routinely in very many schools, ( or very much else, for that matter), all of the above 3 tunes, though common knowledge not too long ago, would be met by the blankest of blank stares by the majority of 14 year olds I teach. Gone are the days when 'My Bonny lies over the ocean' could be used for a Major 6th.

Perhaps we should ask on the Students' Board of an up to the minute list that could be used for pitching intervals? Suggestions, anyone?

I think Ding-Dong as in the common falling doorbell noise works for the falling third...does this make sense?

Unfortunately, some doorbells are major 3rds, some minor 3rds - also heard perfect 4ths...so the doorbell's not such a reliable help here, I fear!

THis is where we all need a working knowledge of current pop songs. The song 'That's not my Name' by the Ting Tings just sprang into my mind but hey - it doesn't really have a discernable tune!

Yes, but the problem is that pop songs come and go so quickly - the favourite for today's 10 year-olds will be greeted with blank looks next year (or pretend blank looks by those too embarrassed to admit they liked it).

Over time, I actually teach most piano students the 'interval' songs : 'My bonnie lies over the ocean' and often the carols (if their parents are OK with that). Equally 'Somewhere over the Rainbow'. Folk and traditional songs sound far better on the piano than most pop songs and even mega trendy kids seem to enjoy them.

Just a thought : Falling minor third suggestion : Old Macdonald - first and fourth notes ? Is that too spaced out?

Er...isn't that a perfect 4th??

Perhaps you meant This Old Man???

Have you tried singing arpeggios? That way you don't have to imagine something in between in your head. Major thirds upwards I find quite easy because it's 'just' an arpeggio sound.

I thought dolce meant 1st, 4th and 5th note! As in: 'Old Macdo -nald (4th) 'had (min 3rd below). But, yes, that would be pretty spaced out. This Old Man would definitely be better!

Er...'tis probably my ill brain but Old MacD goes P4 down then M2 UP (M2 down, M6 up, M2 down, M2 down)..oh, hang on, you mean between the do and the la??? But they're not consecutive...so there's no m3 as such...

*retires confuzzled brain to bed*

And my husband has doctored ours to be a falling tritone! Muso geek!

Yes, yes that's what I meant! All together now: 'Old MacDo.. (establishes tonic) .(nald .. shh ..just think this one, inner hearing and all that..) ..HAD - yup, there's your la. No, not consecutive..

Some door chimes do William Tell Overture. Or even opening of Symph no 40 (semitones! Rising min 6th - eventually..) Eine Kleine..

Thanks so much for explaining what I meant - yes, that's it exactly, I was keeping the tonic in my head and then singing the 'had' - but it WAS very spaced out (and not in a druggy way . . . ). This Old Man is better. And you're right - I couldn't even count four and five properly.

Just wondered, would you like a fulltime job HelenVJ ? You obviously understand my rather scatty thought process!

He He! How many of us are sitting at our computers right now singing Old Macdonald?.....

I always use 'See-Saw, up and down...'

Oh, it HAS to be done with the movement!!!