Hi, There are a number of beginners threads and also a G3 clarinet thread but what about the more advanced players out there? Especially those say G6 and up? I thought it'd be nice to have a thread where we can talk about more advanced clarinetty things, share tips, discuss the trials and tribulations and joys and sucesses of the pieces we are working on, Favourite reeds, ligatures, mouthpieces etc. Anything really so long as its y

I'd especially welcome posts from those, like me, who are not taking exams or working on exam pieces but on other clarinet repertoire (although feel free to post about exam pieces too )

I personally have a renewed love of all things after upgrading my clarinet this year (now Buffet E13 from old Yamaha 26ii) having rekindled my love affair with the clarinet I've started lessons again for the first time in over 17 years - a bit daunting at first but actually are doing me the world of good

I've recently got to play 1st/solo part in band (on a strictly temporary basis), am enjoying playing clarinet with another forum menber accompanying on a semi-regular basis and am generally a much more confident player overall.

I've recently re-associated myself with serious practice too and am currently working on a number of technical exercises from the H E Klose book "Clarinet School", the first fantasia (P120ish) from that book and the Weber Concertino (OP 26 I think). I've got as far as the Andante section ok. Am struggling to get the bit where the soloist comes back in again after the strings to anything like the right speed and have gone as far as the end of Variation 1 but again not up to speed. I have another lesson tomorrow too.

My strengths: A willingness to have a go, A good tone, steady embouchre and good breath control and good sight reading abilities.

My areas for improvement: Timing - especially counting off beats etc in band and getting compilcated rhythms perfectly in time. Improve knowledge of alternative fingerings, especially in the top register. The reading and playing of passages (especially semiquavers, sextuplets etc) at speed - although the technical exercises are helping here.

So that's me. What about you?

My priority at the moment is the last movement of Suite For Emma, by John Dankworth, as I'm doing this at the Colchester masterclass on Sunday.

It's about grade 8 plus, it has lines of very fast quavers, and semiquavers, and quaver triplets. It needs work...

I don't know it. All the best

There's a snippet of it on the Naxos website : but you'll have to subscribe first to hear it.

It's the Scherzo...

Well being completely honest I haven't played my clarinet (or much of anything) for a few weeks now due to being ill. I was working on:

Horovitz - Sonatina
Lefevre - Sonata in Bb
John Ireland - Fantasy Sonata

But I imagine once I've recovered and can play again I am going to have to do some serious repair work to my playing, so will be focusing on extra exercises etc.

My weakness has always been fast tonguing, so after a long break in practise this will have seriously lapsed.

Lucid

Ah yes mine too although my teacher says I'm not too bad.

I think it's coordinating the fingers with the tonguing that's the main issue

Unfortunately with me it was never picked up on until I was about grade 6 level that I was moving my throat everytime I tongued - this was when I moved from school group lessons to individual private lessons. I never spent the proper time correcting it when I practised as I didn't used to do a lot of practise when I was younger , so it is something I have had to work on at a later stage and still need to improve on. But I find that if I don't spend a regular amount of time on it then faster tonguing does tend to slip.

Lucid

I'm also working on the Ireland Fantasy-Sonata...on and off! All my higher end pupils are preparing for exams at the moment so all my spare time seems to be taken up with extra lessons for them, over time at work, band rehearsals of my own etc. etc. Can't wait to get back into regular practice over the summer holiday. I'm currently playing my Eb a lot more than Bb because band rehearsals are the only regular playing I do!

Smells like an LRSM programme, Lucid I love the Ireland, and played it as part of my final recital at university.

I'm, um, not actually working towards anything in particular at the moment Instead, I'm spending some time just revisiting old pieces, perhaps those which I worked on for a bit before being distracted by other things. The music pocket of my case currently contains the Stanford sonata and the Weber Grand Duo Concertant, which have recently replaced Weber 1, the York Bowen sonata and the Lovreglio Fantasia on Un Ballo in Maschera.

Yes well that is the main reason I was looking at them, although it's more of a long term goal than something I'm working towards right away. I'm trying to prioritise my sax diploma and now a grade 7 flute exam. I actually found it quite difficult to come up with a LRSM programme within the time available - especially as I wanted to try to do new pieces. If I chose one of the big Brahms or Weber pieces then I found it messed up the time to get in another contrasting piece that I wanted to play. Also I saw that the FRSM is supposed to be a specialist programme so that's when I thought I would do Brahms' 2nd Sonata and Weber's Grand Duo Concertant (played it for my uni dissertation) - probably two of my favourite pieces to play.

Lucid

I take it the specialism is "Romantic German clarinet repertoire" rather than "Pieces I like"

If I ever get to the giddy heights of FRSM, my specialism is likely to be 20th century English clarinet music - an opportunity to get to grips with the Finzi concerto, Howells sonata and Ireland Fantasy-Sonata. all round! That is, however, a cart with a very big horse still in front of it!

If and when Project LRSM kicks off, it's likely to include a certain amount of 20th century English clarinet music too, but with something else as well, (i) to comply with the syllabus requirements (always important!) and (ii) to prove I'm not just a Frederick-Thurston-wannabe one-trick pony.

Just noticed the equine theme running through this post!

Have you had a go at any of them Deborah? Of those, the only one I've tried to any extent is the Finzi, and I think that's a lovely work

I've played all of them to a greater or lesser extent. I included the Ireland in my final recital at university, and every once in a while I chip a bit more of the Howells away. The first movement isn't too bad, but the second - um, hello, semiquavers in a fast 7/8

Have to say, that sounds tempting...

Yes sorry I completely forgot to mention that.

I was seriously considering the Finzi Concerto for the LRSM (I love the 3rd movement) but again due to the time element I found it difficult to find something to fit that would be from a different musical period or style (I've temporarily forgotten the exact specification in the syllabus). I also fell in love with the Horovitz and definitely want to play that so I've had to try to work other potential pieces around that.

Lucid

What an excellent thread hope I can join in

Currently playing and working on (well you never stop working on really do you...?!)
Jim Parker Concerto
Camilleri Concerto

Also hoping to do an ALCM Recital diploma in December, I've done the dipABRSM but like the idea of the London College recital diplomas you play a 45 minute recital (one composer must still be alive), write a 3000 word essay on the music performed and a viva voce - keeps me motivated anyway!

What an excellent thread hope I can join in

Currently playing and working on (well you never stop working on really do you...?!)
Jim Parker Concerto
Camilleri Concerto

Also hoping to do an ALCM Recital diploma in December, I've done the dipABRSM but like the idea of the London College recital diplomas you play a 45 minute recital (one composer must still be alive), write a 3000 word essay on the music performed and a viva voce - keeps me motivated anyway!

Yes of course you can. The more the merrier

Well I had another good lesson last night. I'm now moving on to the rest of the Weber Concertino. The second variation (down speed) seems doable now but the 15+ note runs on the last page are a bit scary!!! When my teacher plays them they sound almost like a gliss. What's the best way to practice these? Slowly a note at time and then try to increase speed? They are quite simple scalic runs I suppose
but how do I get my fingers to move THAT fast?

Keep them very near the keys. What limits your speed is the time it takes to lift fingers and put them down in a new position, so the smaller the movement required for this, the faster you'll be able to play.

(Sorry, I'm not even a clarinet player, but I've sat through so many lessons/masterclasses that I know exactly what the great clarinettists tell you!)

That's ok. i value your contribution but I don't lift my fingers too high. That was one of the things my new teacher noted and was pleased about. So I think it's just getting the flueny of movement really. That and noting any accidentals that may not fit the scale.

I am having similar problems on the oboe at the moment. My teacher's advice is to practise them very slowly, to play them with dotted rhythms and then inverted dotted rhythms, then to play in groups of three, lengthening the last note and then again starting the "three" one note later (and then again) so that each note will have been lengthened by the time you have finished. Then the same thing with fours (and depending on the length of your scalic passage, fives etc). The theory behind this is that your fingers end up knowing exactly what they are doing and will move automatically. You will know it has worked when you can just think starting note, end note and the fingers fill in the rest for you. It does work but requires lots of patience and (for me) several weeks.

I am assuming that eventually mastery will be quicker but I still remember my despair last year when I mastered a two octave passage starting and ending on D but with a C natural in the first movement of a sonata and then discovered that the last movement had the same passage but with a C sharp

Just found this advice on the clarinet board http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/r...i=259&t=259

Ken's post in particular. The mind boggles with it all

Some similar ideas to yours Kerri thanks

I forgot to say about this earlier but to get out of the habit of wanting passages to correspond exactly to scales my teacher gets me to practise scales starting on every possible note. So in C major, he has me start on B (which is the lowest note you can get in C major on the oboe), you play "B,C,D,E,F,G,A,B,C," come back down to C then go up to D, down to D, up to E etc. as high up the clarinet as you can go. You do this in every key.

P.S. My teacher doesn't usually ask me to play the same tricky passage the following week but leaves me a couple of weeks to work on it and we work on other aspects of the piece instead.

Hi. Can I join in?
I've been playing the clarinet since September, so I don't reallly know if I qualify for this thread, but at the moment I'm working on Krommer's Clarinet Concerto in Eb. I did the 3rd movement in a concert last Thursday (which was the first time I've played the clari in 'public' and am pleased to say that it went very well) and am now working on the other two to bring them up to the same standard.
x

"If you feel you qualify" that's qualification enough for me I understand you've prgressed very quickly and if you are playing a concerto you must be pretty good.

can't say I know the piece though

I think there was something i wanted to ask on this thread but now can't remember what

Guess it'll come back to me if it's important enough.

The Krommer Concerto is a good piece. I'd never heard of it until my uni teacher suggested I get hold of it. It is in the DipABRSM syllabus too. I probably like the 1st movement best. I also have both of the Krommer Concertos for 2 Clarinets and they are really nice - especially the 2nd one (although it's not referred to as the 2nd one, but I've forgotten the Opus number). Dawn I imagine that you would like the Krommer Concerto in Eb as I know you like the Mozart, so have a listen if you can find it somewhere.

Lucid

thanks for the recommendation. I'll see if it's on You-Tube (Good old You-Tube eh?)

I'd love to have a go at some of the 2 clarinet stuff sometime but I don't have anyone around me that I could duet with really

Done the Crussell Progressive duets in the past. Also enjoyed "Views of the Blues" No idea what standard but not easy. Great fun and fairly equal parts I think Many years since I've done either of these though.

Anyone know them?

Edit: Luicid is the Krommer in Eb for 2 clarinets? That's what I found on youTube
2nd Edit found it Op 36!!!

Hi Dawn,

Sorry the Concerto in Eb, Op. 36 is for one clarinet and is the one maya3 was referring to. Then there is also a Concerto Op. 91 for 2 Clarinets which is also in Eb - but I didn't remember that until I just looked it up. I was referring to the solo clarinet concerto when I said you'd probably like it - although all of them are good. The other one is Concerto Op. 35 for 2 Clarinets.

Lucid

Is there a forums concert coming up? Maybe some of us should tackle things like the Krommer double concertos together! I'm hoping to do some duets with my clarinet playing housemate in my final year at Uni

Have just performed Arnold Bax's Clarinet sonata for my last performance assessment at Uni - check out the recording by Robert Plane - it's BEAUTIFUL.

I'm starting to think about repertoire for my final year, I've started working on Debussy's Premiere Rhapsody and Messager's Solo de Concours. Both gorgeous but both are an absolute logistical nightmare! Don't mention the word cadenza to me..... I've got a whole year until my final recital though, THANK GOODNESS!

Been doin a spot of browsing on music room.com (birthday only a couple of months away ) and am looking to build up my repertoire of clarinet music using some suggestions from a previous thread (this one http://www.abrsm.org/forum/index.php?showtopic=34770&hl= ) and some of the things I like listening to on my Emma Johnson CDs - and I suppose I should ask or recommendations from my teacher too -. Anyway I came accross these 2 versions of the Krommer concerto http://www.musicroom.com/Search/gsearch.as...to+for+clarinet

Anyone tell me the difference? And why such a huge difference in price? My instinct with this sort of thing is always to plump for the cheapest one but I hesitate in case it's not such a good version.

Any advice on this piece and generally speaking? I don't want to buy a load of rubbish when I do get to buying.....

Also, whilst I'm on it and noticing Country bumpkin's post about cadenzas Oldnotes told me today that he'd come accross a website with some alternative cadenzas for the 2nd movement of Mozart's concerto in A (the adagio). Anyone know which one it is? I'd be grateful if you could post a link if you do. Thanks.

Dawn what version of the Mozart do you have?

I've just found my copy after a long time searching for it I have the Barenreiter Urtext edition, there are two options for the cadenza, I take the 2nd longer option and add something a little more interesting onto the end, I will try to explain if you like

Nicia

I've got the Baranreiter which is the edition on the diploma syllabus - and also the cheaper one of the two. I'm not sure what the other edition is like I'm afraid. The Baranreiter seems fine to me and is clear to read, but maybe there are extra features in the other edition.

Lucid

Chester is 19th September : launch will occur in mid-late June. There may be spaces left for the Stalybridge Adult Learners concert, but I'd think you'll have to be very quick to get forms in for that now.

Next year we're planning events in Sussex, Co. Durham and Taunton, amongst other places, as well as many of the old favourites (Teddington, Stalybridge etc.). I'll be more than happy to play the Krommer, or things along those lines.

Yes, I'm now just about on to a waiting list for Stalybridge slots.
For more advanced repertoire you might find the performance time limit a bit restrictive though.

Yes : the time limit for Chester will be about 5 minutes. I'll still be happy to run the lot of the Krommer though, picking one bit for the concert

It's in a blue/white cover. Boosey and Hawkes I think off the top of my head will check later though. I also have a Richard Stoltzman version of that movement but don't like the cadenza - too showy for that movement.



Thankyou. Cheaper is always better

It is indeed the Boosey and hawkes version.

Just been researching the cadenza and understand that a section of the quintet is often used. I have a downloaded copy of that. Can anyone tell me what section it is??? Think it's possibly from the larghetto ...?

Nicia - I think the 2nd cadenza you have is the Carl Bearman one. Apparently 5 phrases long!!!

Edit: Your Pm box is full Nicia.

Hi Dawn, yes I think it is

PM box sorted

Help!!!! lost my trill chart. Top E (3 ledger lines) to F natural what is it? It's a side key I know that much but which one and with which other fingers??

It's for the end of the Weber concertino.


Also A key plus register key : Does that play to Eb or E? Sound more like E on my instrument but in some notes that go with the concertino it tells you to do the to Eb "simply played as the a key in conjunction with the register key..." at the top of one of the runs.

Thankyou

Anyone ever played the Darius Milhaud scaramouche suite? Just been listening to Emma Johnson play it and it sounds well cool and Soooo much fun but probably a real headache to perfect. Think the 1st and last movement would be above me but the 2nd movement sounded possible and there's always hope that in the future I could play it all ..... Or am I dreaming?

For top E to top F I'd just use the 'normal' E fingering (second and third fingers on the left, plus Eb key with right little finger), and trill using the 'normal' F fingering (that's adding the C#/G# key for the left little finger)

Yeah, that's what I would have done but after trying it out at my lesson my teacher decided that a side key was smoother and more suitable for where it occured. Think it was top side key ???? but unsure as to what other fingers - normal E fingering????

It's the one you use for side key Eb/Bb (if you number the side keys from 1 to 4, with 1 nearest the top of the clari, it's no. 4). And yes, it's from normal E fingering.

Thankyou I shall go and practise.

oops...

This shows how much I use side key F! : it's key no. 1, not no. 4. I stand corrected...

Which is why it didn't sound right !!! That's what I was doing before I posted the other night. Found a chart in the Kloze and it said top key. Think I'm being asked to use it as my G# key has quite a lot of resistance and is not easy to trill smoothly with little finger.

That's interesting : I don't have any problem with my C#/G# key : it may be worth having it looked at.

I am intending to take it back in at some point soon as there are still acouple of keys that are slightly too resistant for my liking. The other one is the left hand c#.



Another question for the font of all knowledge of all things clarinetty....

A key plus register key : Does that play top Eb or E? Sounds more like E on my instrument but in some notes that go with the concertino it tells you to do the to Eb "simply played as the a key in conjunction with the register key..." at the top of one of the runs. ??????

Thankyou



And to all.....
Anyone ever played the Darius Milhaud scaramouche suite?

Just been listening to Emma Johnson play it and it sounds well cool and Soooo much fun but probably a real headache to perfect. Think the 1st and last movement would be above me but the 2nd movement sounded possible and there's always hope that in the future I could play it all ..... Or am I dreaming?

Should be Eb : I'm not at all struck on this fingering though : it sounds to me like a note that's vaguely in the Eb sort of region, if you get what I mean!



This is probably better known in its saxophone version. It's not as difficult as it sounds Dawn, and I think you could probably manage it with work.

I played the 2nd and 3rd movements for grade 8 sax. I really like it and although the 1st and 3rd movements are fast, it's based on scales, arps, chromatics, dominant 7ths etc and it's not too bad to get your fingers round.

Oooohh!! Another one for my wish list then

It's getting quite long I'm going to have to whittle it down some I think.

Should be able to buy at least some of it after my birthday..... then it'll be

Enough to make my family go (maybe in moderation)


As to the Eb - to me it seems more like somewhere in the region of E on my instrument (too sharp for Eb) and I don't see the advantage to using it in the run it's suggested for (not my teacher's suggestion btw, just the accompanying suggestions on "How to play the solo ...." Eb down to C is not too difficult with "normal" fingerings and if you use middle finger Eb it's even easier so I think I'll stick with that.

Thanks for satisfying my curiosity folks!!!