I am just not getting any time at all to practise! If I'm not at work, I'm having to look after the house and kids etc.

If I get my viola out, the kids start asking for stuff or fighting, so my practise sessions last about 5 minutes.

How on earth do parents find the time to practise?

It might get a bit better in September when my youngest starts school.

Get cross, mine know better than to interrupt when I'm practising, so they stand there watching me waiting for me to finish instead, which is possibly worse. It does get better - promise.

Partly timing it at the right moment, partly through negotiation.

Before I had children I used to play the piano to unwind when I came home from work. Unfortunately this has not been an option since I have had children since they want to tell me about their day as soon as I get in. However, if I spend some initial time with them, I can then claim some for myself later on. If they want something once I've started practising I tell them they have to wait another 15 minutes (half an hour or whatever) and they do actually respect this. Before the youngest could tell the time properly I used to say when the hand gets to whatever number. (I'm lucky in that they don't quarrel so I don't have that to deal with).

You can also probably cut down on the housework

There is no quick fix.

Here is the slow one.

1. Make a detailed audit of
a. your wishes and desires
b. your commitements and responsibilities
c. exactly how you spend every minute of your time
2. Design your ideal (or at least much improved) life
3. Make a plan to achieve it - a step at a time
4. Implement plan

No-one should expect this to be easy.

See the other current thread on "Biggest problems facing adult learners": http://www.abrsm.org/forum/index.php?showtopic=37484&hl=

What I don't understand about this strategy is that it doesn't seem to take account of anyone else. How can anybody design an ideal plan for their own life and implement it without reference to the other important people in their life? Suppose their family/friends don't want to fit in with their plan?


Edit: Several more posts have been made on the other thread since I wrote the above Feel free to ignore this post rather than start another controversy on this thread!

Where did I ever say "completely selfishly and without considering other people?".

Do we have to hedge everything we say with endless legalistic qualifications, or can we assume that some things unsaid are fairly obvious.

To answer your specific question, there are two extreme positions and one in-between, viz:

1. Go along with other people's wishes
2. Negotiate mutually accepted compromises
3. Do exactly what you want and to **** with everyone else

Far be it from me to suggest which of these anyone should choose

I am so glad I'm single, I can actually get things done

(no comfort, I know... sorry!)

1. Send the kids to Grandma's/Auntie's for tea once a week (only useful if they are close by)
2. Tell Hubby he is on childminding duty for 30 minutes each evening
3. Put on a video for 30 minutes when they get in from school (allows them to wind down before homework)
4. Wait until the children are older. By the time they're 10 it won't be a problem.

Now these are useful suggestions for elements of a re-designed life

Totally sympathise! My kids are older (7 and 10), so in theory should be more manageable, but in practice I still get the interruptions (requests for help in relation to homework / THEIR music practice; and the fighting doesn't get much better either ).

I have found I have to practise in the evening after they are in bed (fortunately our house is reasonably solidly built so if I go to the other end of it and shut all doors, the noise doesn't seem to disturb them too often), or at weekends when my husband is available to deal with immediate demands.

If these aren't options for you, I suggest:

1) ignoring all but essential housework - for me, this means only cleaning on a regular basis those things which actually present a significant hygiene risk, plus food shopping / cooking and essential laundry. Dusting takes the same arm movement and level of energy whether you do it once a day, once a week, once a month or (dare I say it) even less frequently than that Hoovering ditto, and as for ironing.... If your other half objects, there is an obvious suggestion you can make in reply

2) definitely second the video / TV suggestion made by another contributor. Provided this is time limited and you approve what is watched, you needn't feel guilty.

3) rewards for good behaviour - by which I would mean either not interrupting you at all, or going away straight away when asked. Most kids of school age or near school age can respond to this.

Hope you manage to find a solution!

I'm lucky if I can get half an hour or so by 9pm, once my son is in bed, I've made the dinner and tidied up. Is there an issue with your other half? i.e. are they doing their fair share? Test - do they have any time for their hobbies / time for themself (this includes watching tv, drinking, golf....). If they do, then you need to think about having a bigger discussion with them.

If you want to do your practice while the kids are around and awake, you need to set things up so that they are motivated not to interrupt you - provide something else for them to do (video is the obvious one, as mentioned above) and give them a reward for leaving you in peace. Star charts worked wonders with mine when they were small for all kinds of behaviours - start small eg a star for 5 minutes of uninterrupted practice. When you can achieve that regularly, increase to 10 mins etc. Give them a goal to work towards eg new toy/cinema trip or whatever once they reach a certain number of stars (?10 ie 2 weeks worth of after school practices). Use a timer an put it in the room with them where they can see/hear but not reach it.

Make sure kids are fed and watered and occupied, then do your practice - timing is half the battle.

This is probably not the answer you are looking for but I was around grade 3-4 piano when my children were small and realised that I would need more practice time for lessons to be effective. I took the decision to stop lessons for a time until I was able to put in the time I needed.

I don't have children but I'm always busy with work and life in general. It's difficult for adult learners to find to practice. I normally practice late at night when everyone is asleep. I use a metal mute on my viola and bow lightly - it's not good for my technique but at least I get some practice done. Things like rhythm, fingering for scales, position changing can be practiced quietly. It's not ideal, but it's better than nothing.

Practice once kids are in bed depends on having a space where you can do this which is out of earshot, so as not to disturb them: for me, that was the kitchen. I happen also to work part time, and found that once my two were in school, I could snatch a short hour here or there before they came out, but when they were still in nursery, I was having to collect them on my way home from work, so I got little done.
My big tip though is a little one: patch practice. If you only get one or two occasions during a week when you can do any sort of sustained practice, then try on those occasions to pick out little gremlins in what you're doing which trip you up regularly, and work only on those almost in passing the instrument, for five minutes here or there, between other tasks during the rest of the week. I cook the sorts of meals which tend to finish themselves off - so rice, and a sauce, once assembled in the pots, can be left to "get on with it" - and when doing intensive work on music, I could then tootle for five or ten minutes until they were done. Nowadays I'd use that time to wash up, but that can be delegated . It's amazing what patch practice can achieve: it's helped me get through a couple of grades and a diploma or two as well - I've been able to make more progress with that technique than with any other.

Hmm, I think my husband considers my learning of the viola to be a rather eccentric and unnecessary activity that I'll grow out of in time

I guess I need to sort out a proper shedule and explain to the others that I need to practise regularly or I'm just wasting money paying for lessons and creating stress for myself.

Teach the kids - fairly but firmly - that practice time is your special time and should only be interrupted if it is a matter of life and death. I know this might sound impossible to start with, but it can be done so long as you build it up gradually. Break them in gently if needs be - say, 10 minutes a day for the first week, then build it up to whatever you think is fair and reasonable all round. I speak as a mum of four who taught from home with no hubby about (he works away much of the time) from when the oldest two were at school and the youngest was at home. Same rule as for conversations and telephone calls. Don't cave in! Over summer, try taking them out for a good tiring activity first then put out the lego/colouring/whatever quiet activity works well in your house, then get on with it.

Is there somewhere safe that you can keep your viola out of it's case that means that you can just pick it up and play it, rather than having to go through the hassle and time of setting it up every time you want to play? If you can, leave it where you can just pick it up when the opportunity arises - even if that happens to be when the dinner is cooking.

It is pretty hard, isn't it? I have 3 little ones at home, and very little in the way of school/childcare (my choice, not complaining, just that I know its hard to find time!)

Here is what has worked for me:

1. Leaving the viola out so I can practice in dribs and drabs. My teacher actually says this is a good way to practice and on a good day I can get maybe an hour in this way.
2. A few times a week, dp takes the kids (no problems with this, just that he works quite long hours) and I do an hour of intense practice.

I have a rough practice schedule where I break stuff into 5-10 minutes vs sustained practice.

3. Just getting on with it as often as possible. Also, explaining that it doesn't work for me to be interupted. This has worked over a period of time, and it might help also that the oldest (5) recently started violin lessons himself, so he has an inkling of what is involved. (I am currently doing one of those Kreutzer studies with 40000 variations-he is doing similar with Suzuki and the Twinkle variations)

4. This might depend on the age of the kids, but for me it works to play some tunes they can dance to, to play them some of their favourites, etc.

If I didn't practice round my kids, I couldn't practice. I don't have the option of practising after they are in bed, even with a mute, as the house is too small. I do think a lot of this is perseverance, they get the message after a while that this is just what is DONE, and soon it becomes as normal and boring as washing up. (though I say that with the caveat that mine are 5, 4 and 1 so perhaps it is easier)



Just to add, some weeks I go to my lesson feeling I have hardly scratched the surface of what I could have done. This I find VERY frustrating!

I try to remember that, by just hanging in there, doing what I can, I am still getting better and better. Even practising just 20 minutes a day will make me better than if I'd left the viola in its case.

Oh another tip, in weeks when I know I am going to struggle I talk to my teacher in advance and get him to help me prioritise. Another tip might be to ask if there are any exercises, theory work, etc that can be done away from the instrument.

I can relate to this. I sometimes turn up and apologise to my teacher for not having got much practice in / not covered the points we had discussed at the last session. It almost feels like a wasted lesson. Likewise, my teacher is very sympathetic and will cover other points, with a view to returning to last week's lesson, the following week.

I find that I have to make time, even if it means staying up late every night or turning down a night out at the pub I get practice in pretty much every day where I can. It's quite difficult but I've decided that I'll have to make some sacrifices if I ever want to be any good

I still feel guilty when she asks about something I've not managed to fit in

Chance would be a fine thing. I'm lucky to get half an hour - hour come 9pm. Up early every morning, so no possibility to stay up late. We all have different demands on our time, it's a question of priorities. Anyway, let's not start that debate again; the last one got quite heated.

I still stay up late despite having to get up at 5:30am when on early shift... I am my own worst enemy

I agree with patch practising. On a day when I know it is going to be difficult to practise for a good period I put a piece of music on the piano and keep on practising one section (today it's a difficult phrase in Mendelssohn). It only takes 5 minutes each time but you can really hear the difference by the end of the day. Sometimes I do it when I'm in the house on my own but usually while I am waiting for my son to put his shoes on or something similar!

I used to do the 'short bit of practice while dinner is cooking' thing - until I went into the kitchen and discovered the dinner was on fire! I never did admit to my husband why he had to have a ready meal when he got in!

lol at "night at the pub", god it has been YEARS since I had a night at the pub! (well, 2). Am a bit shocked by this...

I really agree with just making time. But also, accepting that, if you are busy, there WON'T be oodles of time. Some days, for me, practice really is impossible. Others, very little time is possible. Some time is better than none. I am certainly better at the violin/viola than if I'd just left them in the case.

One good side effect of having so little practice time is that I'm pretty focused. I know exactly what I want to work on when I pick up the viola. And I am motivated, I am not going to waste the limited time I do have. I am progressing much faster than I did when I was younger and had all the time in the world, but spemt a lot of practice time playing the same pieces over and over, shockingly badly.

Can I ask a probably really daft and obvious question? Have you spoken to the kids about your need/ desire to practice? I don't mean, asked for their permission or worked out a way to bribe them (nothing wrong with bribing them, of course!) I mean just sat them down, explained what it means to you, and asked for their co-operation.

My kids are quite small but do seem to get that the viola is something non-negotiable. But then-they are quite small-this may change!

Patience, patience and er... more patience

My piano is so important now that I find little bits of time here there and everywhere, some days are better than others but you will get there, do keep going

Yeah, I have explained to them and they're old enough to understand, but they don't take much notice when I'm playing and still continue to whine for stuff. My husband also has a habit of dropping heavy hints that I should help him with stuff - usually bathing the youngest child, but I always practise when he's in the bath and I can keep an eye on him and play at the same time. I think my husband thinks I'm being self indulgent by playing this thing I work hard though and I think I'm entitled to some 'me time'. It's not like I go out or anything (apart from a music lesson once a week and to go to work).

You are. You could try a regime where you make it clear to all (including husband) that it is very off-putting to be interrupted in the middle of playing a piece. If they want something, they must wait, standing quite still and not interrupt, until you stop playing. Then (and this is the difficult bit) you must be disciplined and not respond to them until you have have brought the piece you are playing to a natual stop. Then give them your attention / sort out the problem and resume playing. Ultimately, it is simply good-manners training (or am I being ridiculously old fashioned? )

My kids would not have dared interrupt me when I was practising (and I've got Mrs Mole pretty well trained too )

We never interrupt each other unless there is an emergency. Like fire, pestilence or earthquake.
Jen stands there, says nothing and gives HUGE sighs. Very off putting.

Yes HUGH Sighs are permitted, along with theatrical yawns (provided they are not too overdone) but NOT interruptions!

Increasingly, the kids (and OH) will simply get bored waiting and wander off to do something else... :result:

Although you are quite quite mad, you are also rather clever Mole.

Gosh, I know!

I don't know why we feel guilty about this. (I would have done had my youngsters been small, but I didn't come back to the piano until they were at school and old enough to play on the computer for a while.)

For most of my childhood my dad was behind the newspaper and oblivious to anything going on around him. If you spoke to him all the response you would get would be an 'mmm'. Perhaps that is the answer - stolid indifference to petitioning and whingeing, and a rationing of their favourite tv programme or other activity until you need to practice. And as was said earlier, making sure the inner child is catered for.

Allocate a room for your practise and put a lock on the door? (High enough to be out of reach of petulant children deciding to lock themselves away). Okay, so you still might get people banging on the door, but it'd underline the "my time; leave me alone!" message.

I'm been keeping my glass flute on the kitchen table to play when I'm cooking. Don't know how long that'll last when Miss Tidy-Obsessed Kitchen-Clearing Housemate (that is clearing, not cleaning) gets back from her 3 week holiday in France.

Confessions of a 'bad' parent (when I really HAVE to practice):

1. Stick them in front of the TV or computer
2. Let them play on their Nintendo DS
3. Chuck them outside to play in the garden/at neighbours/on their bikes in the close (rare as it's always raining in Wales)
4. Bribe them with chocolates and crisps or special treats if all else fails.

It's worked so far.

Hi,

I am a mother of 2 girls age 5 and 8 and work 4 days a week (2 in London and 2 at home). I do have the advantage that as I am at home for 3 of my week days even though I am technically working during 2 of them, I regularly throughout the day practise for 5 mins here and there.

Whilst my two dont argue a great deal they do constantly talk to me and as others have mentioned I do not answer and they have to wait, until I have finished. They are learning slowly!

I find that 5 mins here and 5 mins there is an excellent way of practising, because I am not sat at the piano slogging away. I think short bursts are a fantastic way to learn. Before I know it I have spent an hour in little 5 min durations throughout the day. Ok house work is not done, there is dust everywhere, house smells, dinners not cooked but they are just not a priority anymore!!!!!!!

Then in the evening I put the piano on the practise pedal and do scales, sight reading etc. Not ideal but better than nothing.

I sometimes feel that in my obsessive quest to learn the piano I spend an awful lot less time with my kids than I did before, but this is the one thing in my life I have discovered that I love, so I don't seem to feel guilty. (Perhaps I should?) I have given them a good few years of undivided attention so now its my turn to do something for me. My husband always takes the mickey that I am always on the piano, but he is actually really supportive as he knows I love it so much.

Good luck and stand your ground!